Can we please buff Sona's early game

only zhule··6 votes·977 views

I understand she's meant to be a late game support. That said i don't feel that should mean her early and mid game should be as bad as they are. I honestly play the champion and feel like it takes me till around level 13 to finally have the items and power in my abilities to really be of any use to my allies (or my lane gets a ton of early game kills, 4-6, and i can afford the big items i need).

She feels like she needs 30-40% CDR to really be able to use her spells in proactively. Her damage has been cut so heavily that you aren't much of a threat in the laning phase (often feels like more of a liability). Her base stats are some of the worst in the game, making her a big target and an easy kill through out the entire game.

Her late game looks great on paper, but when you really look at it her power isn't all that impressive. The heal and shield are rarely going to go off more then once in a team fight unless your side is already winning. If she wants to surprise you and deal a ton of damage she's going to need a item 3100 , her powercord online, all her spells off cooldown, and a ton of AP and CDR to try and combo off two empowered attacks. and then pray that it's enough damage to kill you. Because otherwise she's dead in the water. Think about that for a moment, if you were up against a mage with 400+ AP, and lich bane, who managed to surprise you, wouldn't you expect to take a ton of damage? So why is it when Sona does that damage she's too strong/ toxic?

Over all though i think she needs to be less reliant on items, especially high cost AP items. Look at the other supports who get played. While items help, their kits are designed to not need a metric ton of any one stat to be useful. They have stuns/ grabs, or good utility skills that work without needing items to power them up. Sona needs to build like an AP carry but on the budget of a support, this puts her at a disadvantage for far to much of the game. No champion should need to drop 5-7K gold to simply function as a character.

TL:DR

Sona's laning phase needs to be stronger, either better utility or a boat load more damage to make her scary.
She shouldn't need to build like a carry to play as a support. Most fights are decided by the time she has cast one heal and used her ultimate.

34 Comments

Nyannie8 votes

Are you fucking high

Sona is a lane bully

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

Are you fucking high

Sona is a lane bully

She use to be when her Q did more base damage, and her passive had a 100% damage bonus if you last cast Q. Now though you have to have the freaking stars align to bully someone out of lane. If you are letting Sona walk up to and repeatedly land Q, AA (with powercord) without punishing her. Then it's your own fault for being bullied out of lane, she can't build up charges of her passive in the early game without going OOM pretty quick.

Marthian1 votes

Except it's stupidly easy to poke with Q (you basically outrange every carry not named Caitlyn or Rocket-jinx), and positioning to auto attack isn't hard.

Also she has one of the best win rates (52% last I checked), she doesn't need buffs.

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

Except it's stupidly easy to poke with Q (you basically outrange every carry not named Caitlyn or Rocket-jinx), and positioning to auto attack isn't hard.

Also she has one of the best win rates (52% last I checked), she doesn't need buffs.

Ok so she outranges you with a spell that starts off doing 40 damage, then goes up 40 damage per rank. Most ADC's can take that kind of damage every 7-8 seconds without much issue. So it's really a question of if she can keep getting in range without much risk. I would assuming you are usually going to see her coming unless you somehow managed to have no control of the both bushes in lane.

So as i see it you can't win the trade if all you are doing is auto attacking her once when she comes in for damage. But if you are willing to use a spell, or your support has some sort of CC that they manage to land, you should be out trading her easily.

I've never liked the idea that X champion has a win rate above Y, or below Z thus nothing is wrong. Just because a character isn't totally useless or near godlike doesn't mean they can't be improved upon. Also my issue isn't her damage, while it would be nice to see that get a buff if they refuse to make her utility better. What i want is a mildly easier early game, utility numbers that aren't garbage outside of 5 man death balls, and not having to build like an AP carry to simply play as a support.

Marthian1 votes

If you only use Q to poke as Sona, you are doing it wrong. Q combined with an enhanced auto attack does some pretty good damage and isn't hard to hit with either. Power chord and spellthief makes her poke hit even harder. And if you are skilled enough, you can dodge the other support's CC. Taking time to hit Sona is taking time away from farming. And even the threat of being hit by Sona's poke is just as good since they will have to back off, and potentially miss some CS (which ultimately, that's what poke is all about: Threatening them for trying to farm.)

Honestly, she has a pretty easy early game, and her aura aoes is big enough you don't need to be super grouped (and if they do have a comp to counter it, it's not terrible hard to play around it, especially with your amazing ult.) She isn't required to build like an AP carry to be a support, it's simply one way to build her. She can still easily succeed with low AP, as can lots of other AP supports. Both builds are good choices, it's ultimately up to the player. (For reference, her highest win rate build is item 3092 item 2049 item 3158 item 3504 item 3110 item 3190.)

Tl;dr Sona doesn't need buffs, especially to her early game.

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

If you only use Q to poke as Sona, you are doing it wrong. Q combined with an enhanced auto attack does some pretty good damage and isn't hard to hit with either. Power chord and spellthief makes her poke hit even harder. And if you are skilled enough, you can dodge the other support's CC. Taking time to hit Sona is taking time away from farming. And even the threat of being hit by Sona's poke is just as good since they will have to back off, and potentially miss some CS (which ultimately, that's what poke is all about: Threatening them for trying to farm.)

Honestly, she has a pretty easy early game, and her aura aoes is big enough you don't need to be super grouped (and if they do have a comp to counter it, it's not terrible hard to play around it, especially with your amazing ult.) She isn't required to build like an AP carry to be a support, it's simply one way to build her. She can still easily succeed with low AP, as can lots of other AP supports. Both builds are good choices, it's ultimately up to the player. (For reference, her highest win rate build is item 3092 item 2049 item 3158 item 3504 item 3110 item 3190.)

Tl;dr Sona doesn't need buffs, especially to her early game.

Ok let's break this down. Your right Q isn't hard to hit since it auto targets, like all range characters Auto attacking is simply a point and click. That said why are you just standing there staring at Sona as she comes barreling down the lane to try and hit you with her Q AA? Why is your support just standing there letting her barrel down lane to hit you?

Powercord and spell thief do make her poke stronger. Power cord by "After 3 ability casts, Sona's next basic attack will deal 13 / 20 / 27 / 35 / 43 / 52 / 62 / 72 / 82 / 92 / 102 / 112 / 122 / 132 / 147 / 162 / 177 / 192 (+20% of ability power) bonus magic damage, with an additional effect depending on the last basic ability cast." and spell thief by 10 damage per charge used (so +20 if you have powercord or empowered AA up). Maybe it's me, but none of those numbers look all that impressive. Even the upgrade, frostfang just bumps the damage per charge up to 15.

Your right if you are good you can either bait out the CC from your opponent or try to dodge it. Except most CC out ranges your AA, the missle speed is much higher then your movement speed, and the risk of getting caught is often bigger then the reward of getting off your combo at low levels. Usually this means you are using the minion wave as cover. This is easily countered by simply having your ADC fight from max range, since they can auto from longer distances then Sona, if she wants to get them she has to leave the saftey of the minion wave, few Sona's are going to risk constant poking when their only out is flash or a really sub par opponent.

The ease and difficulty of her early game usually comes down to how good your ADC is vs. how good your opponents are. Your spells aren't on short enough cooldowns naturally to save someone who get's caught, your damage isn't high enough or fast enough to pressure opponents back if they try to capitalize on grab/stun (unless they were already near death). This often means that even though your ally got the opponent to 5% or less health you don't have the ability to finish them off because you blew your load trying to kill them before they killed your ally.

Your right her ultimate is pretty nice, still probably shouldn't have her other spells tied into it like it does, needing to be level 11+ is kind of a late point in the game to finally start getting your abilities power back on track. Regardless, a champion should not just be a walking ultimate, it's poor design for any character if all your good for in your teams eyes is one powerful spell on a super long cooldown.

Curious where are you getting the info on what the item build order is for her highest win ratio? What does that ratio take into account? As rude as it might sound, i'm not super likely to take a high win rate at low ELO as a sign that she's strong. If your opponents play the whole game afraid of you, it doesn't matter what champion you are you will have a high win rate.

HaIlMonitor1 votes

Yeah if by buff you make it so her passive doesn't take away 1/4th of my hp at level 2 then sure.

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

Yeah if by buff you make it so her passive doesn't take away 1/4th of my hp at level 2 then sure.

What are you playing a moist paper towel? At level 2 she is doing a wooping 100-110 magic damage with her Q into power cord AA (plus what ever her base damage is). So assuming you have basic resistances and healing, you should negate probably 25-40% of the damage and heal up most of the lost health before she can build another power cord... or she does build another cord and burns through a huge chunk of her mana pool. Also you probably should be trading back with her, since she's super super squishy.

Only Play Darius1 votes

Sona needs help but she doesn't need to be buffed in a way that sends her back to being aggravating to lane against.

only zhule1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jelly Mac,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=V7cRwO93,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-08-26T06:09:51.201+0000)

Sona needs help but she doesn't need to be buffed in a way that sends her back to being aggravating to lane against.

Not sure if i agree. I kind of liked her identity being that of the lane bully. I would say she was so aggravating to play against before because she was able to stay so far away from combat but still have such a huge effect on it. 1000+ range aura to give allies AD/AP and half decent armor and magic resist, made her one of the most passive support choices. Her ability to poke hard was annoying at times, but it looses a lot of it's luster when you have to start spending most of the game in the mid to front lines instead of playing a long series of hit and run tactics.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

the main thing she needs is better AP support itemization, the ones we have currently are horrible with very few exceptions

Marthian1 votes

She already has pretty good support itemization. Ardent Censor is so good on her, and then has tons of choices for AP itemizations (CDR, Utility, pure AP, AP bruiser, etc.)

ZephyrDrake3 votes

{quoted}

She already has pretty good support itemization. Ardent Censor is so good on her, and then has tons of choices for AP itemizations (CDR, Utility, pure AP, AP bruiser, etc.)

no, Arden is a horrible choice on her like in every single support champion. Support itemization is horrible right now and she needs more actual support items and not solo laner items. Same can be said about every single non-engage support. Engage supports have it extremely easy to get anything they want, utility/poke focused ones need AP to function at a decent enough lvl which is something they cannot get unless they delve into solo laner AP items. Using your logic we should just not get any new items at all or improve in the itemization of any of the classes/roles/whatever since you can just go and use random items to fill the need for said items.

Also she can poke you with Q easily alright... that whole 200 max rank damage Q is very strong i hear and so hard to just simply heal back up and positioning to auto isn't hard? it is when you cannot afford to trade at all since you will lose that trade hands down every single time

Marthian1 votes

If Ardent Censor is such a bad choice on Sona, then why does she have a high winrate with it? AP support itemization is anything but crap, they have Ardent Censor, Athene's Unholy Grail, Banner of Command, Rod of Ages, Twin Shadows, Zeke's Harbinger, Frost Queen's Claim, Mikael's Crucible, and don't even need to go full AP. They can do just fine with some tank items as well. I have seen SEVERAL utility/poke supports go AP Tank and still provide great utility and survive a fight. My logic is that support itemization isn't as crappy as people make it out to be (if it was as crappy as people make it out to be, Sona, Soraka, and Janna wouldn't have above average win.) I wouldn't mind new support items, but saying that the current choices suck is a complete understatement. The only one I'd love to see is an AP sightstone option (or mana sightstone) and not as a tier 2 option instead of ruby sightstone, but a tier 1 option instead of sightstone.

The real reason why they aren't so prominant is because engage supports have much more going for them (which is mostly due to sheer utility and pretty high base damages.)

If you are using just Q to poke, you are doing something terrible wrong. You use Q-enhanced autos and your passive to poke as well. Not to mention if you took spellthief line, you get some more damage off that (A Q+enhanced auto attack procs all 3 charges, and it is some pretty good damage early game: 50 AD+40 Base Q+20 Bonus Q+18~ Power Chord+.98 AP=128 Mixed Damage, 143 if you proc spellthief all three times on them, and before any AP you might have.) At level 1, that's about a fifth of a carry's health. And don't bring up risk of doing so, she has the same auto attack range as the average carry and out-ranges a lot of supports. And no reason not to have some armor runes/defensive masteries while doing so. (And if they are healing up, they are paying for it somehow: Nami's healing isn't cheap, and if Soraka's there, you just poke her instead.)

ZephyrDrake2 votes

{quoted}

If Ardent Censor is such a bad choice on Sona, then why does she have a high winrate with it? AP support itemization is anything but crap, they have Ardent Censor, Athene's Unholy Grail, Banner of Command, Rod of Ages, Twin Shadows, Zeke's Harbinger, Frost Queen's Claim, Mikael's Crucible, and don't even need to go full AP. They can do just fine with some tank items as well. I have seen SEVERAL utility/poke supports go AP Tank and still provide great utility and survive a fight. My logic is that support itemization isn't as crappy as people make it out to be (if it was as crappy as people make it out to be, Sona, Soraka, and Janna wouldn't have above average win.) I wouldn't mind new support items, but saying that the current choices suck is a complete understatement. The only one I'd love to see is an AP sightstone option (or mana sightstone) and not as a tier 2 option instead of ruby sightstone, but a tier 1 option instead of sightstone.

The real reason why they aren't so prominant is because engage supports have much more going for them (which is mostly due to sheer utility and pretty high base damages.)

If you are using just Q to poke, you are doing something terrible wrong. You use Q-enhanced autos and your passive to poke as well. Not to mention if you took spellthief line, you get some more damage off that (A Q+enhanced auto attack procs all 3 charges, and it is some pretty good damage early game: 50 AD+40 Base Q+20 Bonus Q+18~ Power Chord+.98 AP=128 Mixed Damage, 143 if you proc spellthief all three times on them, and before any AP you might have.) At level 1, that's about a fifth of a carry's health. And don't bring up risk of doing so, she has the same auto attack range as the average carry and out-ranges a lot of supports. And no reason not to have some armor runes/defensive masteries while doing so. (And if they are healing up, they are paying for it somehow: Nami's healing isn't cheap, and if Soraka's there, you just poke her instead.)

item 3027 item 3174 item 3023 are not support items and item 3060 barely is. item 3092 this item sucks just like item 3504 it doesn't matter if it has a high winrate with it or not, it still a terrible item on pretty much every single support and it's only really "ok" when your team can use it's passive well, guess how many times that happens? not many since most of the time only the ADC can use it's passive, one that does not scale at all! and that's not even mentioning the terrible stats it gives. You can go anything on support and you will have some success, people win with AP versions of champions even though they don't even have AP ratios (AP Garen anyone?) or barely function as one (AP MF, Varus). Support itemization is terrible whether you want to admit it or not, it favors heavily tank/engage supports and that's only because you can get any tank item in the game by building either of these item 1028 item 1029 item 1033 so you always have a cheap start no matter what and end up with a decent enough item with good stats and decent passives/actives unlike actual AP support items.

Engage supports have better items, better utility, tons of CC while utility ones pretty much it's all or nothing in the early game and the instant they fall behind they get boned and outscaled incredibly fast, unlike Janna or Morgana who can actually deal with engages and it's the main reason Janna has the winrate she currently has.

You can use your auto to poke and that's exactly when any decent ADC/support is going to poke you back or even worst engage on your paper tissue rear. Yes you can deal 143 damage at lvl 1... that gets lowered by the natural MR of the target since it's mostly magic damage and pretty much everyone just heals it back up before you can launch anything more. Then comes lvl 2+ and every single step you take to harass the enemy ADC or support means you must be 100% certain that they won't be able to simply poke back at you since YOU WILL LOSE THE TRADE NO MATTER WHAT and if they engage upon you that's almost a guaranteed flash from you unless you want to die. Sona's poke is a lot harder than you think it is, since you always have to be mindful of what the enemy is doing and if they cannot retaliate in any way shape or form. Engage supports don't care about your poke unless you constantly throw it at them and even then all they need is to land ONE skill on you and that will most likely force you to flash and that can be said about every single poke support in the game

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

She already has pretty good support itemization. Ardent Censor is so good on her, and then has tons of choices for AP itemizations (CDR, Utility, pure AP, AP bruiser, etc.)

Personally i think Censor is a joke. The stat line is really poor for the cost, and it relies on a team comp that is heavy on auto attacks rather then ability usage. Like it's great if i have say a Quinn top, Udyr jungle, and basically any ranged ADC. But if the only champion who autos for damage is my ADC that's a lot of gold to drop for an item that really only helps one ally.

Marthian1 votes

That's your opinion, doesn't make it true. It's gold efficient for it's cost*, not to mention it has everything you could want: AP (40 is still acceptable), CDR, Movement, and mana regen. It only becomes more gold efficient with more team members (even one champion is considerably gold efficient). And quite often, you'll usually have one other auto attack champion (bruiser, jungler, maybe an AD mid.

I've bought it on comps not reliant on AA and it still is pretty great for the ADC, especially mid game where the other team hasn't itemized strongly for defense.

*Cost Analysis Breakdown: 40 AP = 870g - 100% mana regen 720g - 10% CDR 317g - 8% movement speed 316g = total 2223g, costs 2100g, is 105.86% efficient before it's passive. 15% attack speed is 450g and 30 on-hit damage is 600~g, hitting an ally gives ~1050g worth of stats, making it 50% more efficient for each ally hit.

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

That's your opinion, doesn't make it true. It's gold efficient for it's cost*, not to mention it has everything you could want: AP (40 is still acceptable), CDR, Movement, and mana regen. It only becomes more gold efficient with more team members (even one champion is considerably gold efficient). And quite often, you'll usually have one other auto attack champion (bruiser, jungler, maybe an AD mid.

I've bought it on comps not reliant on AA and it still is pretty great for the ADC, especially mid game where the other team hasn't itemized strongly for defense.

*Cost Analysis Breakdown: 40 AP = 870g - 100% mana regen 720g - 10% CDR 317g - 8% movement speed 316g = total 2223g, costs 2100g, is 105.86% efficient before it's passive. 15% attack speed is 450g and 30 on-hit damage is 600~g, hitting an ally gives ~1050g worth of stats, making it 50% more efficient for each ally hit.

That looks impressive won't deny. But it's really one of those items that looks amazing on paper but in practice it's not all that impressive. Also not 100% but pretty freaking sure you are WAY over valuing the stat bonus.

Let's compare censer to something like item 3174 , for 600 more gold i get 20 more AP, 10% more CDR, and 25 magic resist I trade away the movement speed buff. Then we look at the passive, Grail gets me more mana regen and a nice boost in mana if i kill or assist in killing an opponent (no more running OOM during a long fight). I lose the ability to give my allies the damage and attack speed buff.

So by your stat to money line grail is offering me about 1,305 gold worth of AP, 720g worth of mana regen, 634g worth of CDR, and 540g worth of magic resist. So before figuring out the passives, censer is worth 105.86% of it's cost, and grail is worth 118.48% of it's cost.

Marthian1 votes

15% attack speed is 450g and 30 on-hit damage is 600~g, hitting an ally gives ~1050g worth of stats, making it 50% more efficient for each ally hit.

Those gold references are from the League wikia. They are both good items, and it doesn't seem impressive because it's an extremely passive... passive. It's like auras: great but hardly noticeable. Regardless, it's still a good item whether you think it is or not (again, she has a great winrate with it, and since when was free stats for your adc ever a bad thing?)

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

Those gold references are from the League wikia. They are both good items, and it doesn't seem impressive because it's an extremely passive... passive. It's like auras: great but hardly noticeable. Regardless, it's still a good item whether you think it is or not (again, she has a great winrate with it, and since when was free stats for your adc ever a bad thing?)

i think the cost is right if those were permanent stats, given they are only active for 6 seconds after a heal or a shield i would probably rate them at maybe 20% of the price tag you listed.

I think someone else pointed this out as well, but just because a champion can win with certain items doesn't mean they are good items for them. Hell with the right team, i could probably rake up some wins as ADC Sona. Yes Censer is probably most useful on Sona given her ability to shield her entire team, but that doesn't really make it a good item per say. It's not a 100% garbage but the stat line could easily be better without breaking it. And lets be honest the item choices for poke utility supports is pretty bad right now.

Marthian1 votes

If you are playing Sona with 40% CDR (which there is very little reason not to.), it's basically permanent (lasts 6 seconds, W has a 6 second cooldown with 40CDR)

It makes it a niche item, which there's nothing wrong with that. (Remember when people wanted buffs for Runaan's? It's now core on Kalista and basically core on Kayle.) Keep in mind buffing support itemization too much will make it more possible that other roles may pick it up or it may make support itemization expensive and out of reach of the champions that it was intended to be bought by.

Ultimately, that's pretty off topic. The point of your thread was buffs for Sona, which she clearly doesn't need. She doesn't need nerfs either, she's in a good spot. She should have some weakness somewhere (early game being squishy) due to the fact she has very strong team utility. If they pick a comp to counter grouping up, then play differently or play another support that better matches your/counters their composition. Champions are generally not supposed to be the best in role and counter everything that comes at them (there are some outliers such as some ADCs crowding out other ADCs from play, and that definitely needs looked at, but that's another topic. Similar case for other roles.)

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

If you are playing Sona with 40% CDR (which there is very little reason not to.), it's basically permanent (lasts 6 seconds, W has a 6 second cooldown with 40CDR)

It makes it a niche item, which there's nothing wrong with that. (Remember when people wanted buffs for Runaan's? It's now core on Kalista and basically core on Kayle.) Keep in mind buffing support itemization too much will make it more possible that other roles may pick it up or it may make support itemization expensive and out of reach of the champions that it was intended to be bought by.

Ultimately, that's pretty off topic. The point of your thread was buffs for Sona, which she clearly doesn't need. She doesn't need nerfs either, she's in a good spot. She should have some weakness somewhere (early game being squishy) due to the fact she has very strong team utility. If they pick a comp to counter grouping up, then play differently or play another support that better matches your/counters their composition. Champions are generally not supposed to be the best in role and counter everything that comes at them (there are some outliers such as some ADCs crowding out other ADCs from play, and that definitely needs looked at, but that's another topic. Similar case for other roles.)

I still disagree, maybe it's what i define as the early game (ends around level 6-7), it would be one thing if she wasn't amazing at this point but was passable. It however feels like it's not till around level 11-13 that i finally see Sona start to get her feet up under her. And it's not a matter of her damage finally hitting a tipping point, or her magically finding that sweet spot on her utility. This is just often the point where i find she finally gets her mana regeneration and CDR item finally built. The idea that you need to be about 4-5K gold into the game before she "gets good" is insane, even more so when you look at the limited income for a support.

I've never liked the idea that because a champion can effect a group of other players, that means they should be balanced around the maximum number of people they can effect rather then splitting the difference between laning phase and end game. And that is the issue with Sona, she's very impressive late game when she's buffing the whole team, but really unimpressive during the first 15-20 mins when all she can do is help one ally in very limited ways.

On a side thought i do wonder, since the idea is she is good when the team groups up. Would she still be powerful in a team fight pre level 6? No ult, limited to no CDR, and next to no AP. Do her buffs hold up if you can't spam your abilities?

AmazingBeaver1 votes

Don't get me wrong i <3 Sona matter of fact she is my favorite girl in LOL but if they make that her passive scales with lvl, that will balance her early pokes , also they should make her MP coasts a little lower , like the old days ^^ P.S.-- Also here is my build : item 2045 item 3020 item 3040 item 3110 item 3100 item 3190 (the order depends on how well are you doing or whats needed the most ) You start with item 3303 and sell it at some point ^^

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

Don't get me wrong i <3 Sona matter of fact she is my favorite girl in LOL but if they make that her passive scales with lvl, that will balance her early pokes , also they should make her MP coasts a little lower , like the old days ^^

See that comment is what makes me wonder. Since her passive DOES scale with level, each level it does a little bit more damage.

After 3 ability casts, Sona's next basic attack will deal 13 / 20 / 27 / 35 / 43 / 52 / 62 / 72 / 82 / 92 / 102 / 112 / 122 / 132 / 147 / 162 / 177 / 192 (+20% of ability power) bonus magic damage, with an additional effect depending on the last basic ability cast.

Her passive doesn't even add that much damage. Hell even the bonus amount from Q isn't all that high (40% more on the passive, down from the old 100%).

P.S. Curious do you tend to play ranked or unranked? I ask because it's been a long long time since i last had the chance to play a game that went long enough to buy a full 6 item grip of items. I'm usually lucky to get my boots, sightstone, and 2-3 end game items.

AmazingBeaver1 votes

I men't skill lvl so if you have more point is a skill her passive do more dmg ^^

Lugg1 votes

[{quoted}](name=only zhule,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=V7cRwO93,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-08-26T05:54:28.975+0000)

I understand she's meant to be a late game support.

Stopped reading right there.

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

Stopped reading right there.

Good for you, you know how to read English. Want a lollipop?

Lugg3 votes

I guess you don't realize Sona is a lane bully. That's why you are getting downvoted.

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

I guess you don't realize Sona is a lane bully. That's why you are getting downvoted.

Except she's really not anymore. Sure she can probably bully a Janna support lane out, but an engage support lane she can't risk going in for her empowered AA to much since if she get's caught out even a bit she looses on the trade. Plus most engage supports will be able to shrug off her damage unless you are landing like 6-8 powercords a minute.

Hell she can't even really bully a Soraka out of lane because that heal counters her damage like there is no tomorrow. Even Nami will usually out trade you since she can cast her damage/heal when you try to do you combo and BOOM your attack did next to nothing and you took a chunk of damage, can't do that the 5-7 times you would need to to drive someone out of lane/kill them.

Abyssphere1 votes

{quoted}

Stopped reading right there.

To be fair, she is designed to be quite strong late game. The nature of being able to buff 5 people at once guarantees that she scales well, and that's amplified by the passive buffs on her ult. But yeah, she's definitely a lane bully. I've gotten more level 1 kills with her than would be possible with anyone not called Blitzcrank.

only zhule2 votes

{quoted}

To be fair, she is designed to be quite strong late game. The nature of being able to buff 5 people at once guarantees that she scales well, and that's amplified by the passive buffs on her ult. But yeah, she's definitely a lane bully. I've gotten more level 1 kills with her than would be possible with anyone not called Blitzcrank.

This makes me wonder. Who the hell are you playing with or against where your opponents let you get that much damage off in the early game? How is your ADC getting enough poke in where you can land your combo for the kill at level 1? How are your opponents not aware of her damage that they would stick around at below 15% health? How are they managing to take that kind of damage at level one?

Booriin1 votes

I just want Riot change Sona, give her niche like the old days instead become a Nami's Shadow.

How I miss the old fun days of LoL, when Sona actually have Auras or Soraka can heal mana

You can build Yolo with insane amount of fun item 3157item 2045 item 3089 item 3117 item 3100 item 3135

Or become an Aura bot item 3110 item 3117 item 3069 item 3222 item 3190 item 3001

Or mix of AP and support items...etc

You have many builds to try.

But now all she have is a boring kit and being force to build AP to actually feel effective, xit like item 3504 is just an OK item that I have to build everygame because without it my utility feel like xit, item 3050 have good stat but the unique is unreliable and not work well when support roam to ward. Keep facing Thresh, Blitz, Naut and building same items every early game feel so dull.


I can't wait untill 5.18 come out with Sona change, I feel nervous as well because Riot don't want Sona to bully bot lane or play passive...

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

[deleted]

only zhule1 votes

So much anger. Might i suggest taking a bit of time to cool off?

Your right Sona will out damage a hard engage champion. Which would be great if that meant you could drive them out of lane, or that it didn't take half a dozen or more hard pokes to put them in the same situation one engage puts sona in.

Turns out it's a lot easier to aim when your target is rooted most of the time. You brought up Ryze does he tend to build Lich Bane? I would think with all the face rolling of spell casts it would really add up damage wise. I dear say quite a bit more then on Sona.

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