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I'm not sure why, but Bard is freaking amazing with the preseason changes.

Koechophe··8 votes·11,376 views

I honestly am at a loss to explain it. I've been playing a lot of Bard, and I've always loved his playstyle. When I started, I tried to play hyper-agressive in lane, but it never worked out very well because his poke was abysmal. So instead I transitioned into leveling W first and never getting hit, so I could just sustain away any damage they did to the ADC with my shrines, and smoothly transition into Bard's awesome mid-late game skirmish plays.

With the new season, I decided to try agressive Bard again, where I run MPen runes, and I went into thunderlord's because I noticed that spells with an on hit (like his meeps) proc it twice, so a Q + AA combo will do the thunderlord effect. And I suddenly found myself chunking the ADC or the support for 1/2 of their hp. I have no real explanation for this. I know thunderlord's helps, but man, bard's damage seems to have magically shot through the roof in the new season.

I used to run tanky builds with things like Frozen heart, spirit visage, Dead man's plate, etc. But now, after the core sighstone item, I run ludens into lichbane into situational (usually zonyas or void) and I find myself doing absurd amounts of damage for a support. Even when Bard gets behind, he's got enough utility to fall back on, and almost magically, he seems to get ahead again. My last game I was doing terrible in lane, went 1/4/2, and then we had a skirmish in the jungle, I nabbed three kills, then went on a massive killing spree until I was up to 8 (I wasn't ksing even, just blowing people up). I ended that game 10/8/18 with more damage than everyone except our mid laner.

Idc what it is, but bard is amazing now.

41 Comments

RiotRiot Koalifier8 votes

IMO he's just really great with Thunderlord's since it procs from Q-Auto+Meep alone, which makes his early laning that much more oppressive.

To be fair, I think he was already strong pre-preseason, and Thunderlord's just amped up his power. That and Kalista being played less helps (she's too hard to hit for him with Q).

Bard also thrives in the early game when he hits level 9 because he has maxed out his Q, but begins to fall off in damage and overall impact once other champs start building health/resists instead of damage. Since early game pressure is more valuable with squishier towers and Rift Herald, Bard gets better :D

ModAcademy Kayn2 votes

That is if you're playing support...

Take him mid and go straight AP and by late game 700 damage Q's that hit two people, and meeps that follow up with so many procs... and did I mention the meep damage is AOE?

item 3027 item 3100 item 3285 item 3115 item 1311 item 3089

RiotRiot Koalifier2 votes

{quoted}

That is if you're playing support...

Take him mid and go straight AP and by late game 700 damage Q's that hit two people, and meeps that follow up with so many procs... and did I mention the meep damage is AOE?

item 3027 item 3100 item 3285 item 3115 item 1311 item 3089

But then I don't get to ruin other supports' days :(

ModAcademy Kayn1 votes

If they're not Leona, Braum, Thresh, or any tank you will ruin there day plenty.

pew pew

The Bearded Bard1 votes

Huh, I always found him to be a bit weak early on, but exceptional late game. Guess we just have different playstyles.

RedCyclone1 votes

Question, if Bard can do this then why can't Sona considering when she uses Q with a passive auto attack she has FOUR sources of damage coming off her, but I can only get it to proc if I autoattack reset with the passive early... A friend told me in PBE that it proced of her Q+passive, needless to say I was pretty stumped to find out that it didn't on live

I have a feeling that Thunderlords and Deathfire are pretty bugged on what they consider as "abilities"

RiotRiot Koalifier7 votes

{quoted}

Question, if Bard can do this then why can't Sona considering when she uses Q with a passive auto attack she has FOUR sources of damage coming off her, but I can only get it to proc if I autoattack reset with the passive early... A friend told me in PBE that it proced of her Q+passive, needless to say I was pretty stumped to find out that it didn't on live

I have a feeling that Thunderlords and Deathfire are pretty bugged on what they consider as "abilities"

So with Sona, her passive makes her next auto "empowered" with her last chord effect, so it modifies her auto attack. With Bard, his meeps add an additional effect to his normal autos, the meep-strike. Bard's autoattack and his meep damage are two separate instances of damage, which is why Bard meep-auto + Q = 3 autoattacks or abilities - which is the trigger for thunderlord's.

what you deserve1 votes

Same works on Lux, it's pretty ridiculous

ModAcademy Kayn7 votes

Petition to change the in-game name of his passive to "The Meep-Stike"

RiotRiot Koalifier9 votes

{quoted}

Petition to change the in-game name of his passive to "The Meep-Stike"

+1

RedCyclone2 votes

Thanks for the reply, but don't take this post as an attack or anything, im just confused

So essentially the empowered autoattack bard gets "doesn't count" as an empowered auto even though it is

Sounds pretty fair... Also WHY don't empowered auto's count towards Thunderlords and Deathfire? are they not abilities/auto attacks like the masteries say they proc for? It's very confusing for people to actually figure out what counts for these masteries to work it, and it's really inconsistent, there is a list somewhere on reddit where half of the champions in the games damage passives don't even proc them....

RiotRiot Koalifier3 votes

{quoted}

Thanks for the reply, but don't take this post as an attack or anything, im just confused

So essentially the empowered autoattack bard gets "doesn't count" as an empowered auto even though it is

Sounds pretty fair... Also WHY don't empowered auto's count towards Thunderlords and Deathfire? are they not abilities/auto attacks like the masteries say they proc for? It's very confusing for people to actually figure out what counts for these masteries to work it, and it's really inconsistent, there is a list somewhere on reddit where half of the champions in the games damage passives don't even proc them....

Hmmmm, as far as I know, the easiest way to tell whether something will count as a "point" toward thunderlord's proc is to see how many times you're going to deal damage to the opponent. Sona's empowered auto does damage once, so it's one "point". Bard's passive does damage twice, once for the auto, and again for the meep. It works like that because the Meep later becomes AOE, so the meep damage needs to be separate from the auto damage (well, maybe it doesn't need to be that way, but it's much simpler). So basically each time an ability makes little damage floaty numbers come up, it probably adds a stack of thunderlord's.

As far as figuring out what works for the masteries, I don't really think the opportunity cost of "play a game with it and pay attention to when it procs" is really that rough :/

RedCyclone1 votes

I get it a little more now thanks for the clarity, but I still stand by that empowered auto attacks/spells should probably proc it too since they do classify as a form of different damage source, specially if thats coming off a champions passive alltogether

I mean really would it be overpowered for both Tunderlord and Deathfire to proc on empowered autos? it would really clear up the confusion on the "what works, what doesn't?" question that I have to ask myself before rolling them

Likewise though, I do pretty well and play a mean Sona with Thunderlords with the more incentive to get auto attack resets off my Q passive really kinda helps, but I just never understood why my 4 sources of damage were being classified as 2

FromTXwithLove1 votes

Nami, if she selfcasts her E, has two damage proc numbers when hitting an enemy champion. One for magic, and one autoattack. But it still only counts for one stack on thunderlords.

RiotRiot Koalifier1 votes

{quoted}

Nami, if she selfcasts her E, has two damage proc numbers when hitting an enemy champion. One for magic, and one autoattack. But it still only counts for one stack on thunderlords.

Well, if that's the case then I'm just confused.

RiotRiot Koalifier1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Koalifier,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UoZZFNMl,comment-id=0004000200000002000000010000,timestamp=2015-11-23T00:40:25.948+0000)

Well, if that's the case then I'm just confused.

Actually, upon looking at it, the damage happens all at once, but there's a damage number for magic and for physical with Nami. Hmmm. I'm guessing it works this way with Bard because the damage is separate from his auto due to the AOE thingy I mentioned before.

On an unrelated note, I'm not sure why you'd want to take thunderlord's over windspeaker's on Nami, since she heals so much and windspeaker is super strong.

The Yetii Rider2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Koalifier,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UoZZFNMl,comment-id=00040002000000020000000100000000,timestamp=2015-11-23T01:24:01.093+0000)

Actually, upon looking at it, the damage happens all at once, but there's a damage number for magic and for physical with Nami. Hmmm. I'm guessing it works this way with Bard because the damage is separate from his auto due to the AOE thingy I mentioned before.

On an unrelated note, I'm not sure why you'd want to take thunderlord's over windspeaker's on Nami, since she heals so much and windspeaker is super strong.

Well, some people might be playing mid Nami, in which case they'd prefer the damage from Thunderlord's or DFT. Also, if they're just playing AP in general and prefer to damage from the support role instead of use utility. Not every support player wants utility (that's why so many of them play tanky supports).

Hyrum Graff1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Koalifier,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UoZZFNMl,comment-id=00040002000000020000000100000000,timestamp=2015-11-23T01:24:01.093+0000)

Actually, upon looking at it, the damage happens all at once, but there's a damage number for magic and for physical with Nami. Hmmm. I'm guessing it works this way with Bard because the damage is separate from his auto due to the AOE thingy I mentioned before.

On an unrelated note, I'm not sure why you'd want to take thunderlord's over windspeaker's on Nami, since she heals so much and windspeaker is super strong.

I'm pretty sure that Lux's passive works this way as well. I haven't tested with Thunderlords specifically, but [spell]-AA procs 3 stacks of spelltheifs.

Photos of Ghosts1 votes

But it isn't. It's a second autoattack, like Pix.

Hellioning3 votes

Which is weird, because Sona's empowered autoattack does proc spellthief's twice...

MungoGeri1 votes

Even on the PBE, the sona combo was auto-Q-auto to trigger Thunderlord's. This is fine, because auto-Q-auto was and is the standard harass combo on Sona, since her Q resets her auto-attack animation.

Big Lincoln4 votes

45% CDR is the real meat of Bard hilarity

I find that none of the keystones really excite me but I run Thunderlord's because the lane damage is good for being a threat.

AP bard is disgusting but he isn't a support at that point; basically becomes a nuker with how fast he can rip people apart

ReshiKillim2 votes

What if the preseason changes weren't actually to change the ADCs, but to make Bard OP? Could it be that the ADC changes were there just to hide Riot's dastardly scheme?

RiotRiot Koalifier1 votes

{quoted}

What if the preseason changes weren't actually to change the ADCs, but to make Bard OP? Could it be that the ADC changes were there just to hide Riot's dastardly scheme?

If I were in charge of the preseason, that would be a pretty good hypothesis, but I am not item 3070

Death by Glamour2 votes

pokey ap supports are in

sona, lulu, karma ect are all in a pretty decent spot.

sona double dips with and increase to both her healing and shield strength, lulu similar to bard can proc the damage by a q e AA combo. Meanwhile karmas strong early game suits the meta.

Nicorus 2 votes

Go big or go home, go ADC Bard item 3004 item 3153 core. it works because his chimes refill a portion of his health, also his chimes stack damage, and so late game you're halfing tanks health with Q+ auto

RiotRiot Koalifier4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nicorus ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UoZZFNMl,comment-id=000a,timestamp=2015-11-21T05:05:06.506+0000)

Go big or go home, go ADC Bard item 3004 item 3153 core. it works because his chimes refill a portion of his health, also his chimes stack damage, and so late game you're halfing tanks health with Q+ auto

But his chimes only restore mana?

SlytherinUmbreon3 votes

I think he's talking about the passive, collecting Chimes buffing meeps

Gotta have those Buff Meeps http://shirtoid.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Incredible-Meep1.jpg

Nicorus 1 votes

[zombie-brand-mindblown]

You're right, I meant restore mana, not health. oops. his chimes passive restoring MANA works well with the active passive whatever from muramana. you caught me.

RiotRiot Koalifier1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nicorus ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UoZZFNMl,comment-id=000a00000001,timestamp=2015-11-21T22:20:26.265+0000)

[zombie-brand-mindblown]

You're right, I meant restore mana, not health. oops. his chimes passive restoring MANA works well with the active passive whatever from muramana. you caught me.

I wasn't sure if you were referring to chimes restoring mana or using his W shrines to restore health XD

Lugg1 votes

He is also much better off if you take the keystone mastery that increases heals by 10%. It makes his shrines actually decent. Going for the damage increase is probably better though.

Kitten of Evil1 votes

I'll have to try this! I usually don't build much damage or AP on him, and I've had decent results just using his insane utility, but I also haven't played since they hotfixed Thunderlord.

Virgin Ray1 votes

Awww man, now I don't feel like a special sprinkle anymore playing Bard.

Earl Eulrich1 votes

yea, i also had been rather shocked when playing him again how strong his early laning has become with the new thunderlord (works incredible on support-heimi aswell, as it proccs from just one w).

ViashinoWizard1 votes

Bard Threatening chimes

Caytheles1 votes

i was noticing this aswell..

Borbland1 votes

Bard counters short range adcs like Lucian and Graves pretty well, since they need to dash forward to do damage. A good Bard stuns them with Q against a creep behind them and retaliate with full power.

hafhafx21 votes

that is my idea http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/EKFKhx24-new-champ-idea

V The Support V1 votes

Bard was, is, and always will be amazing.

I normally like a more passive (roam support multiple lanes) movement speed utility Bard, but this is an interesting post and certainly will have to be attempted.

Have you considered one AP or a MS quint rather than that the third APen quint?

Thanks again for this.item 3903 Bard

ElysMustache1 votes

Idc what it is, but bard is amazing now.

This may have some validity.

http://tinyurl.com/oavxdgr

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