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What if everyone could ward hop?

Painted Celt··28 votes·2,661 views

Alright, guys, hear me out. As we all know, ward hopping was an unplanned innovation and was never really considered in the power budgets of champions who can do it. Yet, ward hopping has been more-or-less endorsed by Riot and the chances of it being removed appear to be slim to none. So, I present an alternative: introducing the Shifter Sightstone.

Shifter Sightstone item 2049 + item 2053 + 800g (Total cost 2,600g) +175 Health +40 Armor +100% Base Health Regen

UNIQUE Passive - Point Runner: Builds up to +30% Movement Speed over 2 seconds while near turrets. UNIQUE Passive - Ward Refresh: Holds 4 charges and refills upon visiting the shop. UNIQUE Active - Ghost Ward/Plane Shift: Consumes a charge to place a Stealth Ward that reveals the surrounding area for 3 minutes. Reactivating this effect on an existing Stealth Ward within 700 Range will instead consume a charge to instantly dash to the target location (15 second cooldown). A player may only have 3 Stealth Wards on the map at one time.

(Unique Passives with the same name don't stack.)

With this addition, wards can be made untargetable to all other abilities, except the Teleport summoner's spell. Lee Sin keeps his "big play" potential, and other champions gain the ability to invent their own plays based on this mechanic. Lee Sin's options to make plays would actually increase when near allied champions or minions, as he would still be able to Safeguard in addition to this. However, Lee (and other champions building Shifer) would really need to invest in that flexibility since the item isn't really slot or gold efficient when not considering its passives/actives. This should actually help smooth out Lee's powercurve, since he will be a bit less safe/overbearing early game, and a bit more flashy/flexible mid/late game if he purchases this item.

As far as balancing goes, this item provides a lot of flexibility to make plays (similar to the Flash summoner's spell) but is counter-weighted by its relative stat inefficiency which make it a really poor first-buy item. This item puts a quantifiable price tag on flexibility and opens up an itemization option for champions that don't otherwise have that kind of "flashy play" potential built into their kits. This item also gives lots of non-supports an incentive to provide vision for their team, taking some of that weight off the support's shoulders (support mains rejoice). For comparison, the proposed Plane Shift effect has the exact same range and slightly longer cooldown (and isn't affected by CDR) than Lee Sin's Safeguard but without any of the other 3 effects Lee has on his W.

Thanks for reading! -Painted Celt (Sam)

Edit: Increased combine cost; 300g -> 800g (Total cost 2,100g -> 2,600g)

47 Comments

DrCyanide12 votes

Fun concept that would spread vision and mobility to all. Thus, Riot would probably never implement it...

Painted Celt11 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAUOPHqx5Gs

A man can dream though... A man can dream.

BluePolarizer7 votes

this would be amazing, as that gives short ranged burst mages and immobile bruisers gapclosers, while it gives long ranged mages and immobile ADCs an escape at the cost of an item slot and 2100 gold, which is not insignificant.

Altricad7 votes

Good concept OP! +1

Looks like since Lee is immune to changes, we gotta go about ways to bring up the mobility to the "Lee Sin bar"

PiRoScOuT5 votes

Do you know what that would do to mobility creep? I think it could be a game mode, but shouldn't be in a ranked or normal games.

Painted Celt5 votes

It's not mobility creep in the conventional sense that the community is against, since it applies to all champions fairly equally. Since all champions have access to the item, it doesn't push naturally immobile champions into becoming obsolete. In fact, since it allows champions to itemize flexibility/mobility, it would probably be a bigger help to older champions that don't already have this kind of "play-making potential" built into their kits.

Hemulus2 votes

The problem with mobility creep is that it leaves a lot of champions obsolete and unable to compete. This new item wouldn't do that. It might even help the immobile champions keep up. I would build it immobile champs that push, like Mordekaiser and Malzahar, since it would give me a chance to escape when Lee or Zed appear out of nowhere and try to all-in me. It would also let me get a sweeper or blue trinket since it would already give me a couple wards to spare even if I save some charges to escape or engage.

67chrome5 votes

That item would become as mandatory as summoner 4 Because it's giving summoner 4 to everyone.

Except at 700 range rather than 400 range.

And a 15 second cooldown rather than a 216 second CD best case scenario.

As we all know, ward hopping was an unplanned innovation and was never really considered in the power budgets of champions who can do it.

I'm not sure it was that unplanned. Riot did remove it for about a week but added it back in when testing balancing it out. Since then Katarina and Jax have both been completely reworked though, so Riot has known about that part of their power-budget when re designing their kit. Lee Sin has actually received a large number of nerfs and buffs since then as well, because that was like season 1 Riot was playing around with that issue.

Also, it's really important to point out ward-jumping isn't the best type of mobility. Jumps with no target at all are the best - which very many champions have. Kassadin Ahri Aatrox Caitlyn Corki Ezreal JarvanIV Khazix Lucian Graves Shaco Tristana Tryndamere Vi Zac All of these champions can do exactly the same thing as Kat/Jax/Lee without needing to use a ward to do so. They just click where they want to go, so it's not like ward-jumping is some epitome of gap-closers pushing such champions over the edge.

Katarina stomping public games because she's an assassin is mostly what she has going for her, spawning QQ threads from salty players.

Jax's counterstrike being better than a wide range of ultimates is mostly what he's got going for him.

Lee Sin essentially having 7 abilities rather than 4 is what's making him difficult to deal with at the competitive level, seeing as it gives him more answers to problems and thus an easier time at both exploiting weaknesses and covering his own weaknesses.

Painted Celt3 votes

I disagree that it would be mandatory, though I do expect that it would be a viable option in a lot of cases (which shows how valuable ward hopping is). The tradeoff on the item is that it provides very little in the way of stats while having a very significant cost attached. It is much too expensive for the stats it provides to rush as a first buy on pretty much any champion, while its poor stats make it a questionable use of a slot lategame. I would be quite surprised if it was included in serious ADC builds for example, since they tend to go for multiplicative lategame DPS items (which Shifter would not fit with) and already have their team providing peel/engagement for them.

If the item did become overly popular, it could be rebalanced appropriately (lowered ranged for example). If rebalancing Shifter were indeed necessary, it may provide insight into how other similar case examples, like Lee's Safeguard, may need to be tweaked/balanced.

It may also be interesting to see if people start building Shifter in lieu of taking Flash. They both offer unique advantages. Shifter requires a 2,100g (edit: increased to 2,600) investment, takes up an item slot, but also provides vision, a longer dash range, and a lower cooldown (if the player is returning to the base frequently enough to refill charges). Flash allows players to have safety/flexibility early on in the game without the investment/sacrifice involved with Shifter, and Flash does not require management of "charges" in addition to cooldown.

67chrome2 votes

I disagree that it would be mandatory

75% more range than Flash on 1/20 th the cooldown of Flash, fullfilling the same thing as Flash?

How would that not be mandatory? You're even throwing in Heart of Gold woes with the stats, allowing players to go all passive in lane while building up to it.

Painted Celt3 votes

I think you are underestimating the opportunity cost of going for Shifter early in stead of an actual powerspike item of similar cost or a bit more.

Also, the charge system would only allow the item to be used like Flash twice per return to base (4 charges when full, 1 charge to place ward, 1 to dash). How often are you going to want to return to base to refill charges? Flash's cooldown can be brought down to 216 with the Summoner's Insight mastery and Distortion enchantment on boots, yet those are not mandatory to take.

Like I said though, if the item were too popular, it could be rebalanced appropriately. Dash range, cooldown, and combine cost should be enough levers to balance the item.

67chrome2 votes

I think you are underestimating the opportunity cost of going for Shifter early in stead of an actual powerspike item of similar cost or a bit more.

If it was just a 2250 gold investment with no component items at all, then the opportunity cost would be steep enough that it would probably see the same type of action Blink Dagger does in DotA2.

Which is about ~3 players of the 5 on each team from what I've seen.

Having it built in such a way you can purchase various components of it Heart-of-Gold style is the exact opposite of holding back on an opportunity cost, especially with throwing HP in the mix. HP is a monstrously powerful stat in early game, vision wins games more than anything else at the competitive level, HP/5 is quite possibly the best stat in the game for the first half of the lanning phase, and armor's actually pretty strong prior to opponents getting both Cleaver and Whisper.

So - 100% chance everyone remotely tanky is going to get this. Supports, junglers, top-lanners more often than not, and with the mobility it's quite appealing to a solid number of mages.

Also important to point out base damage scalings in LoL don't require the same itemization investment most people tend to imply: A typical champion gets ~40 damage per level up within their QWER combo. Which averages out to 1k damage @18, or you can just assume 1/2 of base HP/level or 100% of base mana/level to get a quick estimate. You need around 450 AP to double that: which certainly explains why players like Froggen would build full-tank on Anivia and still wreck faces. You're not actually sacrificing that much damage when looking at QWER combos, champions like Leona and Braum can still be major damage threats to a squishy by eradicating 50% of their HP with 1 combo just through bases.

As AD only gains 3.5 damage per level it would be a pretty big opportunity cost of glass-cannon ADs, which is marksman and a few assassins like Yasou and Yi that have crap bases to place a heavier reliance on item scalings effecting their combos over bases.

Like I said though, if the item were too popular, it could be rebalanced appropriately. Dash range, cooldown, and combine cost should be enough levers to balance the item.

I'm not sure those really are, because you're introducing an extra Flash to pretty much every class outside of marksman.

Zac can now slightshot+ward hop over wards to pull off a gank. Skarner can now ward hop on top of an opponent to drag them around. Alistar can now ward-hop 700 range for a pulverize+headbutt combo. Galio can now ward hop to initiate and then lock things down for a significant amount of time. Shaco is impossible to catch when split-pushing 100% of the time.

You could probably fit it into the game eventually, but it would more than likely become something like Flash where it's a major part of the game that changes everything about how the game's played.

Painted Celt4 votes

I have increased the proposed combine cost from 300g to 800g (Total cost 2,100g -> 2,600g). This would be by far the least gold efficient item in the game. If this mechanic were literally impossible to balance, then the same argument could certainly be applied to Lee Sin's current ward hopping. I think the community is tired of the "it's only okay when Lee does it" stance when it comes to defining what is toxic, impossible to balance, overbearing, etc.

By the way, for some context, this would bring the cost inline with Ohmwrecker (same total cost) while offering a bit more than half of its stat value (1,627g of stats VS 2,610g of stats; 62% of Ohmwrecker's stats; also only roughly 62% gold efficient). If necessary, a 1,000g combine cost to take the total cost to Zz'Rot's Portal (which is a really inefficient/unpopular item) wouldn't be out of the question.

Hemulus5 votes

{quoted} would probably see the same type of action Blink Dagger does in DotA2.

Which is about ~3 players of the 5 on each team from what I've seen.

Wait, so the support and two others build the item on average... I could actually have three people on my team contributing vision?! Sign me up!

{quoted} Zac can now slightshot+ward hop over wards to pull off a gank. Skarner can now ward hop on top of an opponent to drag them around. Alistar can now ward-hop 700 range for a pulverize+headbutt combo. Galio can now ward hop to initiate and then lock things down for a significant amount of time. Shaco is impossible to catch when split-pushing 100% of the time.

Just noticed... You literally named a bunch of bottom tier champions that were left behind by the meta... Like the champions people give out in nemesis draft... Zac... Skarner... Galio... And then you gave examples of how the OP's item would give them a chance to get back into the game rather than rotting at 1-2% pick rate game wide... And you acted like that was a bad thing...

SouL1ess4 votes

Unlike certain archetypes in DotA, just building Blink Dagger, an item that gives no (useful) stats whatsoever, isn't something very viable on League champions....

Pryotra1 votes

Honestly, I would likely buy it as my second or even 3rd item on Heimer, and drop flash in lieu of ghost or even possibly just tele.

I would also just place 1 in an escape route before every fight or prolonged engagement so that I could have my emergency out of jail free card.

KING OF MASKS3 votes

Really neat idea, though I would increase the cooldown of the ward hop itself substantially (maybe to a minute or two).

Hemulus4 votes

lol If only Lee Sin had to wait a minute or two between his ward hops!

SouL1ess2 votes

Nice blink dagger with some stats.

No one would care where they place the wards...just save it for general mobility purposes.

Painted Celt2 votes

I think that it would be better to use the item more strategically. If I were mid-laning with this item, I would place 1 ward in each side bush and then save the remaining 2 charges for a an escape/engagement in most cases. Positioning near wards that you have already placed would also open up opportunities to make plays without expending as many charges as you would need to if you treated it like a Blink Dagger and only ever dashed to fresh wards.

OyddAWqJ5r2 votes

This and then remove the ability to ward hop. Now Lee Sin isn't special. Then remove the item. Problem solved, no more ward hopping.

AyRe CoNteMpT2 votes

man, i really hate how everybody cries about all this cancerous mobility. yes, overboarding mobility, cc with no outplay-potential and unavoidable damage are a very big problem.

but instead of making every champion cancerous, i prefer to create options to COUNTER their mobility instead of just giving it to yourself so everyone can fly across the map and the one who randomly gets the better flashtibbers off wins the game.

how about this: an item that marks an enemy champion and the place he is standing in and after 3 seconds, he will be returned to this exact place. about the base stats and components of the item we can speculate seperately, but that would definitely be an option to lock down hypermobile champions. it would also be very usefull to defend/counter towerdiving AND you could possibly even use it on an ALLY to let them jump into the fight, burn all their cooldowns and be safely transported back after 3 seconds. much like leblancs distortion, except that its a FORCED recall.

stuartk111 votes

Auto-build for Lee Sin, who already builds sightstone anyways. This pretty much only exaggerates the problem by having a champion have 2 ward hops and a gap-closer skill shot.

Painted Celt3 votes

There wouldn't be any champions with 2 ward hop abilities/actives, since Plane Shift is a unique active and I proposed wards become untargetable to other abilities (with the exception of the Teleport summoner's spell). Lee loses the ability to target wards with Safeguard, so he becomes less flexible/safe until he completes Shifter.

As you mention, Lee already builds a Sightstone, but the proposed Shifter upgrade requires significantly more investment, alleviating a little bit of the pressure Lee creates in the early game. This item costs a total of 2,100 gold (edit: increased to 2,600), compared to a cost of ZERO for a warding trinket and only 800 for a regular Sightstone. This helps make Lee less frustrating in the early game while making him even flashier in the endgame (if he sticks with his teammates).

1CalledMIA1 votes

Ok so being LoL, and knowing soloq, it'd make people ward even LESS now that they 'have to save it for an escape'.

Painted Celt6 votes

{quoted}

Ok so being LoL, and knowing soloq, it'd make people ward even LESS now that they 'have to save it for an escape'.

The item holds 4 charges. Players can put down at least 2 wards and save 2 charges for an "emergency ward" + dash.

LucasWho1 votes

Or first use the trinket charges?

Sythraell1 votes

to expensive it will be a nub trap and lee sin is not suppose to have to invest in his plays they r his identty he is suppose to be safe assassin and snowball game early cuz he is 100% useless late

SouL1ess3 votes

he is suppose to be a safe assassin he is 100% useless late

Yes, this is why he has skill base damage and ratios that are competitive with actual AD assassins while also having more mobility, utility and CC than them.

DJ Di01 votes

Oh lawdy think of Lee Sin; 3 dashes.

I like the concept, and I think it would help out a lot of champions (especially squishy immobile supports like Zyra or Sona), but I don't think giving mobility to immobile champions solves mobility creep.

Kitten of Evil1 votes

League of Split-pushers?

ThePlasticSpork1 votes

Darius now has a gap closer.

GG top lane

Im Andru1 votes

Lee would probably get some buffs

Syn Zykan1 votes

I'd love to see an item like this

yes it gives more mobility to a lot of champions, but it creates options for champions with no gap closer to get in range for things. Imagine the flashy plays you could make with this and it might even make it where you could forgo flash for another summoner spell on some champs O:

Samflash31 votes

Wardhopping destroys the target ward.

GG

King Odin1 votes

Give Lee more mobility D:

terkmc1 votes

Ward Hoping Mordekaiser , the end is near

insaiyanbacca1 votes

indeed

DanofDemacia1 votes

I would honestly love this but not in an item form. Just a game mechanic with a CD.

Orangesilk1 votes

Darius Just became the most powerful monster in the league.

Celeste Benal1 votes

Because Lee Sin needs to be able to hop back and forth between 2 wards constantly, while waiting for an opportunity to Q in. Just... no.

Martyrofsand1 votes

League is in a state where mobility needs to be removed from the game not added to it. All this item does is make mobility even more toxic.

SmokingPuffin1 votes

Main problem with this item design - it more readily gives mobility to some classes than others. Mages think buying this thing is the worst idea of all time. Defensive fighters think it's pretty solid. Offensive fighters think it's junk. Maybe if you had a few variants of the same idea, aimed at different archetypes, similar to the jungle enchant system.

I am super scared of this item in the hands of some support champs. In particular, Janna just became insane. Ward hop flash R is mind bogglingly strong fight initiation.

warpenguin5551 votes

lol i read this as ward top.

Drunk Rummate1 votes

Darius instantly rises to 70% winrates and 100% pick ban

grLKQ9ma0o1 votes

It's basically the same thing as everyone having flash now. It would limit build potential in a lot of champions while also making the already brokenly mobile champions more brokenly mobile.

Celeste Benal1 votes

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/champion-reveal/bard-wandering-caretaker

Request granted. (check his E)

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