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More Viktor nerfs? Why?

Galewings·2/11/2016, 7:03:18 PM·127 votes·6,863 views

"Base damage lowered to 70/110/150/190/230 from 70/115/160/205/250, augment explosion damage lowered to 70/110/150/190/230 from 70/115/160/205/250"

What are the justifications for this nerf? Viktor is in no way shape or form a broken or overpowered champion. He has clear strengths and weaknesses with pretty clear counterplay. Hell, even his winrate hasn't been spectacular for a long amount of time either, 47.25% winrate overall, capping out at a clear 50% on average on players with more than 125 games on him. (http://champion.gg/champion/Viktor/Middle)

So is it because he is constantly picked in pro play? Well he gets picked because of his ability to clear waves, which is really desirable because of what YOU have implemented into this game, Riot. YOU made turrets standing butter bars that need to be protected or you lose too much.

So yes, they're nerfing him for his waveclear. But Ahri on the other hand got a buff to her Q a while back to "help her clear waves" despite the fact that her wave clear also deals true damage. And that Ahri has been sitting on a much more comfortable spot than Viktor ever has, for a much longer time as well. 53% win rate which increases to 56% once you have 125 games on her. But then I forget the balance team likes to play favorites.

101 Comments

The Yetii Rider2/11/2016, 9:39:37 PM45 votes

Ahri's wave clear being true damage is irrelevant, minions don't have MR.

Jasiwel2/11/2016, 7:36:29 PM28 votes

Some are saying because his waveclear and sieging with Deathray are exceptional alongside super cost-effective once his E is upgraded. These advantages allow him to create extraordinary siege comps...but he still isn't winning as much as Lux/Zed/Ahri. The siege capability is also his greatest strength right now, so why they're nerfing that without compensation on top of how strong his current competition is baffling.

He's picked a lot in Korea (at most 18%), even if his winrate is subpar (45-48%). That said, OP.GG has some odd discrepancies at the moment, so I'm not even sure how reliable those stats are.

I made another thread earlier that's been in flux for a bit, if you want to see it for reference.

There's also this better thread on Reddit too.

I don't care how Riot's sees our concerns, but I really want some clarification here. What I don't understand is why they nerfed both the base damage and the augment damage when they could have simply made the Augment damage deal less to minions.

Penns2/11/2016, 7:18:39 PM18 votes

Meanwhile Alistar, one of the stupidest champs in the game gets a buff. Why?

Limitanei2/11/2016, 9:45:52 PM17 votes

As a (semi) Viktor main, I don't see the justification for Viktor's nerfs here.

Even though I was originally against Riot making his Hex Cores be scaling instead of flat AP and mana, I learned to get used to it by not rushing Perfect Hex Core. But nerfing his E? Why?

It's bad enough that Viktor's counters (Zed, Talon, etc.) are super meta now because of Riot's genius decision to create Duskblade of Draktharr, but now Viktor's waveclear is being nerfed?

Whatever the balance team is smoking right now, I'd like some of it.

Ulquiorra9952/12/2016, 1:35:26 AM13 votes

Here's the problem with Viktor:

1.) Flashy champion jumps on Viktor. 2.) Viktor anticipates it, dropping W on himself. 3.) LC$BIGPLAY gets stopped dead in its tracks and the would-be playmaker gets obliterated.

We can't have things like that in this game.

The Deckowner2/12/2016, 2:25:11 AM13 votes

Here is rito's logic

WOW rageblade way too broken on JAX? better nerf irelia.

WOW juggernuts deal way too much dmg and cant be killed? Better nerf irelia right now!

WOW ZED is getting another ult on an item? better nerf Viktor.

ÁCTION IS COMING2/12/2016, 1:51:39 AM7 votes

Why does LeBlanc get buffs? That is the true question here. Seriously though, it takes 2qw combos and you're dead. (In laning phase mostly)

Serika Zero2/12/2016, 8:20:23 AM7 votes

Ahri has to use 2 Qs to clear wave, when when you are ahead, your 1 Q will not clear melee minions. Viktor was able to clear both melee and caster minions in 1 second. He was probably the best wave clear in LoL. That's regarding your Ahri comparison.

On the other hand, I don't see why he had to be nerfed. I mean, sure. He has burst and a shield and wave clear and a slow/stun zone control, but that's about it. If anything, the wave clear is the core of his identity right now (game play identity), and that's the reason why you pick Viktor over other mages. If they were thinking he is way to strong, they could've removed that shield of his for example......... not the darn wave clear.

Then you get 4 months later: Immobile mages do not have an identity and there's no reason to pick one over another one. Gee rito, guess who's fault that is........

Earthlord Jazz2/11/2016, 9:29:42 PM6 votes

I think their reasoning is due to his tremendous waveclearing potential with his empowered E...

That being said, a champion should have well defined strengths and weakness, and I feel Viktor needs that good waveclear to put him a slot above other typical mages...

And EVEN if these Viktor nerfs still go through, they should really compensate him. A 40 total dmg reduction on his poke + wave clear is a pretty big nerf imo

Edit: Just read the comments, I agree with Jasiwel, if Riot was toning Viktor down because of waveclear, they should just have E augment deal slightly less to minions

Ariel the Cruel2/11/2016, 11:21:13 PM5 votes

item 3147 They're worried about Duskblade breaking him. [/joke]

Velasan2/12/2016, 12:07:11 AM4 votes

Funny that people are mentioning his siege ability. Frankly original Viktor was a true master at the art of the siege.

New Viktor is more of an upfront burster (especially because Q is now a solid part of your rotation). His hexcore was also recently nerfed as well.

You wont see him do well right now because he is just an alternation of Annie or Veigar, who also aren't doing well right now for the same reasons. Their win rates will never be abysmal though, simply because they have good aoe cc/dmg in team fights.

High52/12/2016, 2:51:11 AM4 votes

Agreed. Viktor needs more skins, not more nerfs.

Wyrmblade2/12/2016, 4:06:26 AM3 votes

Every time there is a balanced focused patch I wonder why I'm still playing this game.

CasterGilgamesh2/12/2016, 12:19:51 AM3 votes

i'm surprised riot wants to nerf him after nerfing his Core item.I thought that nerf made him balanced.....

Sneakyy XD2/11/2016, 10:41:02 PM3 votes

He's a mage. Riot doesn't need any other reason when nerf mages.

Dazaruk2/12/2016, 3:28:17 AM3 votes

Find it sad that out of all the complaints players have a problem with about champions, Viktor wasn't one of them, yet Riot wants to nerf his damage. As if we need less options to play in this game.

Scramrail2/12/2016, 11:25:18 AM3 votes

This is completely mind blowing to me. Like, its almost impossible for me to even remotely wrap my mind around their strategy with this game right now. I cant think of any other multiplayer game that has so blatantly and ham-fistedly pushed their own agenda onto their players, including riot themselves in the past. Since the end of S5 they have been shoving mages farther and farther to the back of the bus, while continuing to pander to AD champions exclusively over and over again. Talon and Zed were already strong before item 3147 , and now theyre just going to be borderline overpowered. Graves and Quinn were already borderline overpowered after the ADC update, and now with item 3147 are going to be perma pick/ban im sure.

I mean jesus, they even just gave Ekko some love and he's still got one of the most overloaded kits in the game(imo). Yet Viktor, a champion I cant even recall ever being on the boards' shit list, a champion who has never really had a spectacular win rate as far as im aware, is getting nerfed with no compensation?

What in the actual fuck is riot doing with this game?

dunkeroni2/12/2016, 6:32:31 AM2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Protean Wings,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RrUlEtJJ,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-02-11T19:03:18.065+0000)

But Ahri on the other hand got a buff to her Q a while back to "help her clear waves" despite the fact that her wave clear also deals true damage.

Just a clarification, minions don't have resistances, so all damage is true damage. So her 'wave clear' has nothing to do with true damage. That's purely her poke potential.

PiVoRx2/12/2016, 5:15:21 PM2 votes

Viktor is too big threat for Ahri for throne of mid lane, so Riot took action.

Sahn Uzal2/12/2016, 9:52:48 AM2 votes

As a (Semi) GP main and a player who enjoys Viktor... I think the balance changes on PBE are some of the dumbest I've seen in a while. And I realise I'm saying that after those Xin buffs got live. summoner 31

Xonra2/11/2016, 11:47:51 PM2 votes

He is pretty much on 100% pick/ban in Korea. I'd say he is pretty strong.

LordBrasca2/12/2016, 11:57:20 AM2 votes

Hope he won't end like azir... He's fine right now, really.

fééd l0rd2/12/2016, 2:00:47 PM2 votes

Viktor gets nerfed while Lux stays untouched? Alright.

4yoyoman2/12/2016, 4:10:27 PM2 votes

Nerfs Viktor, but buffs everyZeditem 3147 assassinTalonitem 3147 everShaco item 3147 .......................... can we talk about this rito???[zombie-brand-facepalm]

Reynard the ƒox2/12/2016, 1:09:44 AM2 votes

Can't have his waveclear stopping those LC$ big plays