If you could go back to S5 League in it's entirety....

Dominick Destine·Jun 16, 2016·55 votes·2,888 views

Would you?

92 Comments

AWildAPKalistaJun 16, 201622 votes

Screw season 5, I'd rather go back to season 3. As far as my knowledge goes back, this game has been on a steady decline starting with patch 3.14 and hitting its fever pitch by 4.13, season 5 would be far too late. Of course, I've only been playing since season 3 and I have a strong suspicion that if I'd played in even earlier seasons that I very well may want to just go back to those even.

The Yetii RiderJun 17, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Screw season 5, I'd rather go back to season 3. As far as my knowledge goes back, this game has been on a steady decline starting with patch 3.14 and hitting its fever pitch by 4.13, season 5 would be far too late. Of course, I've only been playing since season 3 and I have a strong suspicion that if I'd played in even earlier seasons that I very well may want to just go back to those even.

Ah yes. Season 3. Let's go back to the time when Kassadin was at 90% ban rate and like a 62% winrate or something monstrous like that.

AWildAPKalistaJun 17, 201630 votes

At least back then there was only 1 perma-banned champion as opposed to the consistent 12 or so we have right now.

Nimble MantaJun 17, 20163 votes

People have always complained about champs being OP. The fact that right now we have a multitude of good bans but nothing you absolutely have to ban is a good indicator that's S6 is a lot more balanced than S3 (which it most certaintly is.)

ZeeWolfZJun 17, 201616 votes

Malz, Zed, Fizz, Ekko, Swain, Darius

Must Bans.

Are you high Brozef?

LatetotheRaceJun 17, 201611 votes

Apparently he made it to silver 1 with that level of ignorance. DQ is clearly op.

Nimble MantaJun 17, 20162 votes

In my promos for gold, climbed only using solo and duo que. My friend and I are both in our promos, and we'll probably do them together friday or saturday night. Root for me and see if I make it :3

LatetotheRaceJun 17, 20162 votes

I don't know if I want you to make it or not.... You clearly don't understand the game, and you shouldn't proceed until you do.

The LexerJun 17, 20162 votes

Everybody can be countered though. (Tank Ekko is arguable, so we'll have Rito try to keep fixing that)

A quick stat check shows the highest win rate to be 55.48% (Malz).This means 45 out of every 100 matches, Malz actually loses. Additionally he only has a 2.33% pick rate, so even when he is not banned, he is rarely picked.

Zed is the only champ above 50% ban rate (and way above, at that), yet he has a 47% win rate

Fizz and Swain have fairly high stats, but are probably not "must" bans. (i haven't seen tons of Fizz's or that many Swains either)

Meanwhile, Lucian has the highest play rate, Irelia seems to be the best ban, considering a combination of play rate and win rate, and MF looks just as good as any of those you listed. Yeah, Those are annoying, but they all have counterplay

https://champion.gg/statistics/#?roleSort=Middle&sortBy=general.banRate&order=descend

Nimble MantaJun 17, 20161 votes

Not sure why you would assume I'm bronze, since it's usually bronze players that have the most trouble with "op" picks. I'll go over how I deal with the champions you listed if it helps you I guess. Also keep in mind I don't play any of the champs you mentioned - I play Veigar/Morg/Akali mid, Vlad/Akali top, and lulu support.

Malzahar: The passive gives him incredibly dumb amounts of lane safety, but his lower kill potential has made him much more managable. Jungle malz isn't a threat until level 6, which by that time you have enough wards to just walk away from his immobile ass.

Zed: Most zeds in my elo are absolutely terrible. Like, I can beat them in lane as veigar bad. That being said, he's a lane bully assasin. Laning against him is an absolute nightmare because you have to play perfectly and he can fuck up all he wants (especially if he bought fucking hexdrinker.) That being said, he falls off when teamfights come around and mages are fucking gods in teamfights so not feeding him in lane usually means winnning the game.

Fizz: This guys a piece of shit and I literally learned akali just to counter him. He's like zed where not feeding him early = winning the game, it's just a lot harder not to feed him. He's realy easy to counter pick though so I'll just do that if I'm low in the picker order. Tank fizz is whatever imo since he does absoutely nothing to peel for his carries and doesn't do enough damage to carry alone. Definilty a good ban if you're high in the pick order, but by no means necessary.

Ekko: I'll concede that he was pretty broken before his nerfs. Now he's sorta like tank fizz with less damage but a ton more utility and survivablity. I'd say he's just about as good as any other viable tank right now.

Swain: I play veigar which counters him both in lane and teamfights so my opinion of him probably isn't too accurate. Whenever I'm not playing veigar though, getting my adc to buy mortal reminder has been more than enough to deal with him in my expiriences.

Darius: Just kite him. In lane accept the fact that you'll have to take sky williams advice and play like a bitch and take comfort in knowing that if he's not fed he'll be easy for your backline to deal with in teamights (so long as they know how to kite.)

Anyways, what about zyra, ahri, volibear, kindred etc. There's a lot of strong picks right now, and they're just that - strong picks. In my opinion the fact that the variety between top and high tier champions is greater than it ever was is an indicator of balance, not "omg why are there so many op champs."

ZeeWolfZJun 18, 20161 votes

Brosef = Bro = Le Brosef = Brah = Brother

My lord.

Nimble MantaJun 18, 20161 votes

Well you spelled it Brozef and someone else responded:

"Apparently he made it to silver 1 with that level of ignorance. DQ is clearly op."

to which you didn't bother to correct so I made the rash assumption that you mispelled bronze rather than brosef. Apologies.

LadyRenlyJun 17, 201617 votes

yeah I wouldn't mind. I thought the game was finally starting to stabilize before the juggernaut update. pre season 6 was pretty bad, too.

vampirekid13Jun 16, 201612 votes

can i just go to season 2 please

eastcoastblazeJun 17, 20164 votes

You and me both. I want my god damn force of nature back

ShonjlJun 16, 201612 votes

I would, since while it was a tank meta, at least a tank meta is fairly balanced, you won by either slowly wearing the enemy down, or winning more than 1 lategame teamfight.

I hate that they made all of S6 an experiment and its snowbally as hell, there is no skill in one person going out of control and taking an entire team by themselves, or winning 1 teamfight lategame and taking 5 towers and Nexus since death timers basically jump up to past 1 minute after you die after like 30 minutes. Sejuani back in S5 landing the perfect 5 man ult was skillful...

LegacyDAPJun 16, 201610 votes

Over this pile of rubbish. Yes, and Season 5 is one of my least favorite Seasons of all time.

Dextix LTJun 17, 201610 votes

Would go back to the moment of Tank Meta after cinderhulk nerfs. That was the best time for the game.

AMYS GRAVEJun 17, 20161 votes

X a bajillion this ^

AlüeJun 16, 20169 votes

hmm yes but only because it was before the flat ap reduction

DealthJun 17, 20169 votes

Season 6 is by far the best season. Elemental Dragons, Rift Herald, Keystones, New champ select. I don't see why people are complaining so much.

KING ATTILAJun 17, 201624 votes

Dynamic Queue. Atrocious balancing. Ranked meaning nothing now. Keystones are bullshit btw. The only thing good is the new champ select...which is not the same as DQ btw...

ƒoesJun 17, 20162 votes

As a Yasuo main, yes, keystones are bullshit.

If you take the wrong keystone in any matchup, you're practically fucked.

P4ppinoJun 18, 20161 votes

So that is just not true. You take the keystone you are comfortable with. Also, Yasuo can utalize 3 keystones: Warlord's, Fervor Grasp (maybe thunderlord's, but I think it is useless nowadays), so it's not like you certainly lose if you take grasp instead of warlords.

LatetotheRaceJun 17, 201616 votes

If we could have "Elemental Dragons," "New champ select," and maybe "Rift Herald" I'd be all for it. But with the rest of S6 came too many problems.

Critmaster GarenJun 16, 20168 votes

give me the last patch of season 5 and we have a deal.

from there on you could still reintroduce the new champion select, but actual general game balance was much better than it is now.

PapaGreg21Jun 17, 20167 votes

Yes during cinderhulk era. No if it was during the Darius and Fiora are destroying everyone era.

doiminat0r3600Jun 17, 20166 votes

Pre juggernaut patch. Post tank patch.

LatetotheRaceJun 17, 20164 votes

No Ekko , Taliyah , AurelionSol . No super strong Drain tanks Swain Graves Vladimir No bizarre mage update, (which fixed mana late game, but made it even worse early.) item 3078 didn't build out of item 3101 (My gosh why did they buff Irelia.... ;_;) No tank Fiora Finally and most importantly, ranked teams/solo Q would still be a thing.

There's always that problem with Fizz not getting his nerf, but since they added 10% CDR to item 3001 nothing has really changed. So sure, why not.

Woodsy2575Jun 16, 20163 votes

No, season 5 was the worst season to date, tank meta was mind numbingly boring

Wind WhistlerJun 16, 201610 votes

{quoted}

No, season 5 was the worst season to date, tank meta was mind numbingly boring

Tank meta only existed for around 2 months.

Dextix LTJun 17, 20165 votes

And it was the best 2 months since we saw actual strategy and diversity in the game.

Not who picks the most op champ currently.

JimmyyyJun 17, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Wind Whistler,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Ri39b9WY,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2016-06-16T21:27:08.081+0000)

Tank meta only existed for around 2 months.

That's a long time. Especially for people who play this game for hours every day.

iamthegoatofwarJun 17, 20163 votes

I'd honestly go back to around season 3-4.

EndlessSorcererJun 18, 20163 votes

Cinderhulk Era? Possibly.

Post-Juggernaut Update? Heck no.

Jungle Lux GodJun 17, 20162 votes

Well of course I'd like to be able to play in a jungle where only 4 champions are viable by default of no one else being able to clear.

I'd also like to be able to play in a duo lane where the enemy melee "ADC" auto-wins by out-leveling us through farming and one-shotting our carries with one ability.

Finally, I'd really like to play an AP mage in the jungle and either go OOM on my clears 10 minutes into the game or have to build a item that's useless after 15 minutes to not go OOM.

LatetotheRaceJun 17, 20165 votes

Gragas Sejuani Amumu Evelynn Rengar Khazix Nidalee Diana Hecarim Jax MasterYi Olaf Nocturne Nautilus Skarner XinZhao MonkeyKing Volibear ???????????????? A couple of these may be arguable but...... wtf

"I'd also like to be able to play in a duo lane where the enemy melee "ADC" auto-wins by out-leveling us through farming and one-shotting our carries with one ability." Why... HOW did you lose to Yasuo/GP adc....

Fiddlesticks Chogath Akali Ever tried full AP / Bruiser Gragas Amumu They're broken asf.

Jungle Lux GodJun 17, 20161 votes

My original post was referring to season 5, not season 6. If anyone actually played season 5 you'd know what I was talking about.

Season 5 started out in the worst state for junglers ever. There were only a handful picks like Lee Sin or Jarvan IV because no one else could handle the jungle. If you don't believe me then here's an old video from Foxdrop talking about this very problem:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEhEF7j4xXw&index=8&list=PLU8hDH7nvRUFrKQVVG5cjRHwDWAmbwDKj

And how can you not remember Mordekaiser after his juggernaut rework? He was pick/ban at worlds for his obscene power in a duo lane that stemmed partially from his ability to get solo lane experience in a duo lane and partially from his ability to one-shot enemy carries with a single third hit from Q. If you played at the time or watched any competitive games back then, you'd understand.

And don't even get me started on AP mage junglers, which is different from AP assassins like Nidalee or Fizz or AP divers like Elise or Diana. It was excruciatingly difficult to play a mage jungler that wasn't Fiddlesticks. With Magus you had no mana to do anything but could scale decently well, and with Runeglaive you had all the mana you needed but had horrendous scaling. No matter which AP jungle item you look at there wasn't a good option until Runic Echoes was released in season 6. Even Fiddlesticks, who for a long time was the only viable mage jungler, was complete garbage when Runeglaive was released because it did nothing for him. He wanted the mana, but not on an item whose stats were complete garbage and whose passive was useless on him.

LatetotheRaceJun 17, 20161 votes

" If anyone actually played season 5 you'd know what I was talking about." I just have address this.... this sentence doesn't agree with itself. Anyway, I've been playing since late season 3 so I remember last season pretty well. I also remember that pretty much everything I listed above did fine in the jungle and quite a few of them were AP. I also remember Runeglaive and how it was abused by this little bastard, and Riot loved it for a bit. Ezreal Even though some junglers couldn't abuse it or use it to it's full potential, it was still decent at helping them clear which is really what those items are for. Right now we have items like item 1414 item 3711 which are a bit excessively strong imo.

BlanchimontJun 17, 20162 votes

Yes

excepti0nJun 17, 20162 votes

Season 3 was where it was at baby! Back when AP Gragas Mid was OP and Zed's ult shadow spawned right on top of where he landed. Haha good times!

WolfBVJun 17, 20162 votes

Yes.

DarfallerJun 17, 20162 votes

Season 5 right before juggernaut patch and have no juggernaut patch or a few patches after jug where the 4 horsemen of hell were nerfed enough.

AATTRROOXXJun 17, 20162 votes

The patch before the juggernaut fuckdate, yes.

iamthegoatofwarJun 22, 20161 votes

jugs are fine now save for darius man. Honestly I kinda liked what that patch did.

KETSU0Jun 17, 20162 votes

Yes/no, I dont want to go back to a game where the meta was pretty much farm for 35 mins, teamfight, win, profit. Or a meta where caitlyn jinx and tristana was the holy trinity of botlane or (shivers) the juggernauts. But I do want to go back to a time where Rengar e didnt make the champ extremely clunky, Nidalee and Gangplank isnt nerfed nearly every damn patch.