Ignite needs to be buffed.

Ser Garland·Aug 8, 2015·1 votes·582 views

I'm not seeing it anywhere anymore. Not even mid. Everyone knows that saving one health pot can save you from it pre 6. Teleport's an obnoxiously offensive tool for what it is. It used to be, if you take TP top, you will most decidedly lose lane against an ignite opponent, but you can roam easier.

now people are taking Krugs or wolves level 1, and TPing to lane early with a level lead and an item advantage. So tP no longer has an early game disadvantage, and ignite is so weak late game it's basically a wasted summoners spell.

They should honestly replace Ignite's grievous wounds with a unique 0 healing stat, which simply pauses all regen, and life steal while ignite is active. That way it will have an identity late game instead of being a watered down exhaust with some DoT.

20 Comments

Sightless66Aug 8, 20153 votes

They should honestly replace Ignite's grievous wounds with a unique 0 healing stat,

That is waaaaaaaaay too hard of a counter. No no no no. Bad mechanic. You can't have something so easily accessible that so completely and utterly stops a certain segment of champions. That's terrible design. Counters are not supposed to completely invalidate certain champions. They're supposed to weaken them and make it easier to fight them, not completely destroy them at all times. This is bad design, through and through. Even if ignite needs a buff, and I don't necessarily agree that it does, this is one of the worst directions you could take it in.

Ser GarlandAug 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

That is waaaaaaaaay too hard of a counter. No no no no. Bad mechanic. You can't have something so easily accessible that so completely and utterly stops a certain segment of champions. That's terrible design. Counters are not supposed to completely invalidate certain champions. They're supposed to weaken them and make it easier to fight them, not completely destroy them at all times. This is bad design, through and through. Even if ignite needs a buff, and I don't necessarily agree that it does, this is one of the worst directions you could take it in.

It's only for five seconds, and I think everyone knows how to bait out an ignite now.

Sightless66Aug 9, 20151 votes

5 seconds can be a pretty long time in this game to be deprived of a primary mechanic, particularly since ignite is extremely easy to apply and very easy to hold until the enemy needs to actually use their heals or begins using them. Holding an ignite until a swain or mundo start ulting is not a challenge.

It easily and completely invalidates a primary mechanic for a decent period of time in an unavoidable manner on something that is easily available to multiple classes at all stages of the match. That isn't acceptable in this game. This is a terrible design idea. It has no place in any buffs that ignite may or may not need.

Ser GarlandAug 9, 20151 votes

{quoted}

5 seconds can be a pretty long time in this game to be deprived of a primary mechanic, particularly since ignite is extremely easy to apply and very easy to hold until the enemy needs to actually use their heals or begins using them. Holding a heal until a swain or mundo start ulting is not a challenge.

It easily and completely invalidates a primary mechanic for a decent period of time in an unavoidable manner on something that is easily available to multiple classes at all stages of the match. That isn't acceptable in this game. This is a terrible design idea. It has no place in any buffs that ignite may or may not need.

Then teleport honestly needs to be nerved. The fact that it takes up top lane more than flash is a stupid necessity.

Sightless66Aug 9, 20151 votes

It might need a nerf, but I think it's impacting the game pretty well for the pick. It feels like it's up often enough but not too often. I'm not sure messing with that is a great idea, but it's also the only thing you can mess with (besides channeling time taken to TP I guess, which actually might be an ok nerf now that I think about it). Buffing ignite is a good option too, particularly late-game buffs. It just can't be the completely negating healing thing.

I will say that teleport being taken more than flash top lane (if that's true) isn't something I really mind. Those are the champions that are least likely to need flash to save themselves or tactically avoid spells, and it is also the role most likely to benefit from pushing alone until an objective fight is set up (as well as getting back to lane quickly early on). It occupies a heavy presence in that role, and that's fine. What concerns me a bit more is ignite being rarely picked up on midlaners, with even the strong roamers often opting for other spells. That's something that shouldn't be happening quite so much.

SasogwaAug 8, 20153 votes

A summoner spell that is used **competitively ** on some champions instead of flash (!) should not be buffed imo.

But I think TP should get nerfed though. Along with a slight barrier buff (heal is just better)

Ser GarlandAug 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

A summoner spell that is used **competitively ** on some champions instead of flash (!) should not be buffed imo.

But I think TP should get nerfed though. Along with a slight barrier buff (heal is just better)

Those same champions that opt for ignite over flash STILL take Tp though. It's absolute nonsense.

IcyPepperAug 9, 20151 votes

I find nothing wrong with flash being replaceable by a different summoning spell.

shrugs

Personal opinion. I find ignite/TP to be more diverse and strategically interesting than being forced to take ignite/flash or teleport/flash

OperationDEEZ1Aug 8, 20152 votes

One health pot can save you from it pre 6

It applies grievous wounds for a reason. @the zero regen idea, NO. Aatrox , Vladimir , Swain ,etc would instantly become unviable.

Ser GarlandAug 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

It applies grievous wounds for a reason. @the zero regen idea, NO. ,, ,etc would instantly become unviable.

Ignite is SUPPOSED to counter them. as it stands, it barely even gives you an advantage. They all need reworks anyway.

GroundRuleDoubleAug 8, 20152 votes

Let's look at Ignite vs. Health pot at level 5.

In 5 seconds, ignite will deal 150 damage. In 5 seconds, your health pot will heal you for 25 health.

Yep. Health pot really counters ignite...

Ser GarlandAug 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Let's look at Ignite vs. Health pot at level 5.

In 5 seconds, ignite will deal 150 damage. In 5 seconds, your health pot will heal you for 25 health.

Yep. Health pot really counters ignite...

Say you ignite someone at 150 health. Health pot will save them.

GroundRuleDoubleAug 8, 20152 votes

If you ignite them at 100 health, it doesn't. What's your point?

Ser GarlandAug 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

If you ignite them at 100 health, it doesn't. What's your point?

Chances are you're not going to get them to 100 health nearly as easy as you could at 150

GroundRuleDoubleAug 8, 20153 votes

Do you realize the argument you're trying to make? Ignite isn't supposed to take someone down from half health. Ignite is supposed to prevent healing and be a finisher. The fact that it can deal 150 damage at level 5 in 5 seconds and cause a health pot to only heal 25 health over those 5 seconds is insane. I can't tell if you're being serious or just trying to troll at this point.

We better buff all spells that deal 200 damage because if you have 250 damage, you counter them.

Sakura MirageAug 8, 20151 votes

Man an item advantage a whole 2 pots and a ward surely I lost lane because of 2 pots not because I didn't want to proxy the wave if I knew he was going to be taking a camp logic.

Ser GarlandAug 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Man an item advantage a whole 2 pots and a ward surely I lost lane because of 2 pots not because I didn't want to proxy the wave if I knew he was going to be taking a camp logic.

Not to mention a summoner spell that allows you to never leave lane and gank bot at will.

ValyrianBladeAug 8, 20151 votes

Not sure why you think it's only 2 pots and a ward...

Often you start flask with no pots, then after the camp take either cloth armor or boots to lane.

Regardless though, you're right that the item advantage is pretty small. The dorans item alone will be better than flask+ boots/armor.

Your wave point, do you mind clarifying exactly what you want the wave to do when someone starts a camp? Do you push it hard to try to deny a cs or two to tower and to try to hit level 2 asap to eliminate the level advantage? Do you freeze it immediately and take a longer level disadvantage but make them miss cs by letting their minions live longer to deal more damage to yours while they clear a camp? I've only ever played top laners that start a camp, and I've never found either strategy more annoying than the other. I don't play top very often though.

Ser GarlandAug 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Not sure why you think it's only 2 pots and a ward...

Often you start flask with no pots, then after the camp take either cloth armor or boots to lane.

Regardless though, you're right that the item advantage is pretty small. The dorans item alone will be better than flask+ boots/armor.

Your wave point, do you mind clarifying exactly what you want the wave to do when someone starts a camp? Do you push it hard to try to deny a cs or two to tower and to try to hit level 2 asap to eliminate the level advantage? Do you freeze it immediately and take a longer level disadvantage but make them miss cs by letting their minions live longer to deal more damage to yours while they clear a camp? I've only ever played top laners that start a camp, and I've never found either strategy more annoying than the other. I don't play top very often though.

The teleport user has the advantage in every way. Gold and items aside, you are either

A) forced to push to their tower in order to level up around the same time as them, giving them free farm and denying you farm and harass. B) freeze lane and have them arrive with a higher gold count and a level over you.

It's good on tanks, it's good on melee carries. It's generally good on everyone. I remember when only the wet noodles, farm champions and global ult champions like Nasus or Shen took TP, and the lane bullies took ignite.

Now, a Riven with Teleport can somehow survive and beat a mastery 5 Garen with ignite. absolutely unforgivable.