Weekly reminder from a Brand player.
Also, with the addition of Bard we have another mechanic that will probably completely negate Brand's ult which is a large part of Brand's teamfight presence and Riot has stated in that mobility creep thread that his teamfight presence is why the mobility creep is totally aok, so make it bounce plz.
RiotMeddler24 votesPyroclasm bouncing off untargetable units (without dealing damage of course) seems reasonable given it's an ult on a fairly noticeable cooldown. We're planning to try that change out in testing.
Eyrgos2 votesPyroclasm bouncing off untargetable units (without dealing damage of course) seems reasonable given it's an ult on a fairly noticeable cooldown. We're planning to try that change out in testing.
This' ridiculous... it basically acts like a homing missile, having it lock onto or target an untargetable object makes zero sense. Find some other way to improve his Ult if you want. Sorry but I have little respect for the "logic" here (lack thereof).
Vier3 votesLux needs some love too :( don't you think?
Sorry for this being off topic. I just enjoy playing Lux and playing against Lux but it just feels that Xerath etc. make her useless :( maybe her being able to cast her shield while running would be enough.
SeductiveGrandpa1 votesLux is fine, some champions just can't be taken down easily. If you have problems with Xerath go for a different strategy don't consult the rioters to do a change on her just because you cant deal with Xer. . - .
darkdill2 votesLux actually is underpowered because of the mana regen changes. If she's pitted against a manaless Champion like Zed or Kat, she will have inferior laning because she has to farm with her E, which inevitably causes mana burnouts. It's especially nightmarish vs Zed because you can't rush mana regeneration; you have to go Seeker's Armguard.
SeductiveGrandpa1 votesSince I couldn't find a way to explain how I want to respond just look at this:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7ze9aVST9c&feature=iv&src_vid=iIfcBe_iI1I&annotation_id=annotation_2818513861
Knight SoIaire 5 votesPyroclasm bouncing off untargetable units (without dealing damage of course) seems reasonable given it's an ult on a fairly noticeable cooldown
not it does not some lucky bounces of that ult allow it to easily owershadow veigar in single target damage, not to mention that someone else took 2 bounces
i think that his enemies already lack the capability to stop his ult and the damage is realy owerwhelming and random so being able to remove it by using zhonyas when there are 2 targets is realy important
also noticeable cooldown is a very basic atribute of an ultimate ability
so yeah i agree that there is some space to work here, but i dont think you are heading in a good direction
Champion Skin1 votesEhh some ultimate abilites have a rather short cooldown... like stances Nidalee and Jayce (Udyr?)... Kassadin or Swain... Even Leona ult has a rather short cooldown... it can get as low as 36 seconds cooldown
Knight SoIaire 1 votes. like stances Nidalee and Jayce (Udyr?)
well that depends on what you consider an ultimate ability for me its a big move with a longer cd than basic ability
guys like udyr or nidaele forsake this big move for other stuff owerall i wouldnt say that a champion needs an ultimate ability and riot already proven that champs without ults can work too (udyr and karma who's ult is just an empower for one of her basic spells)
you can disagree and im perfectly fine with that but ask yourself ... does that nidaele's change or kassadins blink feel like they are the ultimate power of that champion, or just a basic ability unlocked at lvl6 or lvl1 that is simply closer to the core of their playstyle
Champion Skin1 votesWell Kassadin ult used to be a pretty big deal as it let him jump on the enemy to get more use out of his E and W And it also gave him much better mobility to escape bad situations... level 6 is a big deal for kassadin and it pretty much is the core of his playstyle and all of it's power
Same with Akali
Swain has a lot of his power in his ult even with it being on a short cooldown
(And do you consider windwall an ultimate ability? It has a longer cooldown then most basic abilities and it has the ability to negate a lot of abilities and can be immensely powerful)
Bijorn2 votes[{quoted}](name=Hagane No Arashi,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QhI4X4gP,comment-id=00010002,timestamp=2015-03-01T11:08:59.881+0000)
not it does not some lucky bounces of that ult allow it to easily owershadow veigar in single target damage, not to mention that someone else took 2 bounces
i think that his enemies already lack the capability to stop his ult and the damage is realy owerwhelming and random so being able to remove it by using zhonyas when there are 2 targets is realy important
also noticeable cooldown is a very basic atribute of an ultimate ability
so yeah i agree that there is some space to work here, but i dont think you are heading in a good direction
Thing is, Brand does not have overwhelming damage at all.
The bounces of his ult, as you say, are very random. So random that unless the fight is in the baron pit or dragon pit, it will get 2 bounces on average. It moves quite slow and can easily be stopped (Braum, Yasuo). It can be easily stopped by cc'ing him on the windup. Banshees is still extremely viable stopping it. Even Bards' ult will stop it (although if we are going this route, Bards' ult will stop everything lol). The bounce range is still really small, so easily counterable by taking two steps away from your team.
But. I do agree that there are possibly other alternatives out there. Regardless, Brand needs a bit of help somewhere.
Knight SoIaire 1 votesThing is, Brand does not have overwhelming damage at all. The bounces of his ult, as you say, are very random.
the damage is top tier but the single target damage is quite random warying beetwen owerwhelming and medicore
owerall would go for alternative changes, instead of tweaking the randomness
Bijorn1 votes[{quoted}](name=Hagane No Arashi,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QhI4X4gP,comment-id=0001000200010000,timestamp=2015-03-02T22:12:44.176+0000)
The bounces of his ult, as you say, are very random.
the damage is top tier but the single target damage is quite random warying beetwen owerwhelming and medicore
owerall would go for alternative changes, instead of tweaking the randomness
I would agree with the damage being "top tier" if you got multiple bounces (2+) off in a teamfight (like in baron or dragon pit).
I guess im saying the damage is not overwhelming/top tier due to it hitting more often than not 2 or less targets. If the RNG was changed/the range between champs that can be bounced to was increased I think that would really help his ult.
Carnicore1 votesThis overlooks Brand's biggest problem, honestly. The reason he stopped seeing competitive play is because the bouncing makes his ultimate too unreliable. If it was reworked a bit to work consistently, he'd be a much more common pick.
Bijorn1 votesThis overlooks Brand's biggest problem, honestly. The reason he stopped seeing competitive play is because the bouncing makes his ultimate too unreliable. If it was reworked a bit to work consistently, he'd be a much more common pick.
No I completely agree with you. If the bounces were more reliable it would be MUCH better. To do that I think either it needs to prioritize champs regardless of if they are ablaze, or increase the distance between champs so that it can bounce to them instead of going to minions.
I am sure there are much better ideas/ways to make his Ult "better". I just do not know what those are.
Regardless, I will still be picking Brand as my main Mid laner
Bijorn2 votesThe first half dozen times I saw this type of thread I wasn't really for or against it. Now, with the Bards' ult, it might actually be something to think about.
Counterplay is a good thing, agreed. But when there are so many things that just negate his ult, it would be nice to see something like this. I love Brand, he is in my top two mid laners (other one is Ziggs).
There are a few other champs that their ults get negated by this as well (like Zed) but they all have mobility while Brand does not.
That being said, I am not sure if this is the BEST way to go about buffing Brand. It could be ea QoL buff, but it will make him stronger seeing as there will be nothing that "negates" his ult besides something like Banshees (does QSS work on his ult before it hits you? Iv never ran into someone with it that I used his ult on lol).
SpongebobIsLife1 votesthe damage will still be negated though, it just bounces off of the person who zhonyad.
Bijorn1 votes[{quoted}](name=Its Spongebob,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QhI4X4gP,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2015-03-01T10:18:49.169+0000)
the damage will still be negated though, it just bounces off of the person who zhonyad.
Hmm. I didn't think of it as "bouncing" off of said zhonyas. If I missed that before my comment then my bad.
WatchdaWorldBurn1 votesAs a Brand main, I feel like Brand's Ult just needs to be less reliant on what the enemy does. It's already hard enough trying to land skill shot combos (with super high cd's) on all the hyper mobility champions in this game when they easily dodge them a large amount of the time. But it just always feels super shitty when you cast what you think is a "good" ult and it ends up doing nothing due to untargettable, flash, or a champion uses a dash/blink/teleport ability. Or Braum/Yasuo throw up their shield wall and cancel out my Ulimate with a normal ability. There are just too many situations like this to count. I feel like I spend an extreme amount of effort trying to identify the correct opportunity to Ult and then a large % of the time my Ultiimate is just entirely ineffective.
I really feel like Brand's entire kit is awesome, synergizes well, and is in harmony with his theme. It would just be nice if he wasn't gimped by an ultimate that is so easy to render ineffective. I feel like his utter lack of mobility, defense, and reliable damage just always keeps him from ever being competitive (even in solo queue). It would be nice if the balance team could figure out a way to give him something (small) in any of these 3 categories to help overcome these 3 glaring weaknesses; WITHOUT DESTROYING him like you did Veigar. If adding some power to his kit in any of the 3 above mentioned weak areas causes you to want to entirely redesign the champion and make him even less reliable. DON'T TOUCH HIM PLEASE. I feel like he needs SMALL adjustments to be relevant in the current state of the game. NOT A MASSIVE REDESIGN.
Again my major complaint is how unreliable his damage is and how easy it is for all the mobility champions in the game to entirely dodge his damage. This coupled with high cds and and a super unreliable ultimate makes me feel often that I'm just not competitive against players on champs with mobility.
MyGhettoFantasy1 votesI play Brand mid a lot. I think I am neutral on this change.
I personally would like to see added utility through his passive. If it could grant vision (they're on fire?) for the first 2 seconds that'd be greeeaaattt.
SquirrellyOtter1 votesI disagree.
If you're gonna argue that Brand, being the answer to a hypermobile meta, needs his teamfight-nuke ult to bounce off an item that makes a champ not-move, you have an odd argument that I don't think you can logically defend.
Also, if we make Pyroclasm bounce, does that consume a bounce? If it does, everyone buys Zhonya's, Brand is still useless. If it doesn't, then why not just make the ult target champs only (Morgana ult style) and rework the passive interaction to something else?
I think there are other ways to buff him other than this, but I think this creates more problems than it solves.
Bijorn1 votesI disagree.
If you're gonna argue that Brand, being the answer to a hypermobile meta, needs his teamfight-nuke ult to bounce off an item that makes a champ not-move, you have an odd argument that I don't think you can logically defend.
Also, if we make Pyroclasm bounce, does that consume a bounce? If it does, everyone buys Zhonya's, Brand is still useless. If it doesn't, then why not just make the ult target champs only (Morgana ult style) and rework the passive interaction to something else?
I think there are other ways to buff him other than this, but I think this creates more problems than it solves.
The Morgana style is a really interesting thought