But seriously, can we just talk about Pantheon for a sec?

Visigoth··4 votes·1,338 views

Around Christmas of 2014, I started playing. At the time Pantheon was a pretty good champion. He was actually the first champion I bought and in a way my first main. My friend and I would play our favorite combo of Jax Pantheon top, since jungling wasn't even a concept to us. Little did I know, the champion who I just thought "was cool because he's a Spartan" was about to become a highly dominant champion in soloque.

In the beginning of Season 4, champions like Pantheon, Kha'Zix, Lee Sin, Elise, and Evelynn were pretty dominant. All of them got their respective nerfs in some aspect. The hardest hitting arguably being Kha'Zix and Evelynn's guttings before finally being buffed from the ground up.

Alright, well good ol' Leonidas was still viable. The only major nerfs he got were to his ultimate. But god damn. He could no longer use summs before landing, and could also no longer use abilities, specifically his W, just before landing to get into action quicker.

This meant no more smite stealing baron before landing with W to wreak havoc. Additionally his ult had received many range changes, once being global, then at one point almost being able to barely reach the other side of your nexus, but eventually to being about a third of the map. Alright, a respectable range. But the time it took to cast, now combined with how long it takes to land was detrimental to his once legendary ganks. His ult wasn't a complete killer anymore, and was pretty much a less restricted Rek'Sai ultimate.

Worlds happen. First worlds I've seen, and before the ones in about a month the only worlds I've seen. Pantheon actually does get played once, by none of than inSec. It was glorious. He inspired me to once again pick up the left handed spear, despite the splash showing it in his right hand. Yes, that is true, Pantheon's splash shows the spear in his right hand, when in fact he is a lefty. That fact always made him feel close to me, as I am also a lefty.

Pre-Season 5 roles around. The biggest changes? Dragon and jungle items. With dragon having 1/4th the attack speed and 4x the damage, Pantheon could actually solo drag level 2 for the powerful, since his passive blocked the shot. And Warrior gave Pantheon armor pen, his favorite stat along with armor shred. Pantheon was once again top-tier.

But soon that was nerfed. Hard. Less attack speed, along with removing his ability to block dragon's hits, by making them count as spells. This is proven by the fact that Noc can block them with his W now, and Jax cannot with his E. Just thought that was interesting.

So Pantheon is hit hard. But he's not garbage, yet. More nerfs. Cinderhulk. Warrior gets another hit. Cinderhulk means tanks are back, so his damage on a target below 15% is harder to do. The final hit? Dragon gets its attack speed buffed back to normal, and damage put back to normal. So essentially dragon now attacks just like in Season 4 and before. Why is that so important? Because it still was counted as a spell, not an attack. So now Pantheon still could not solo dragon, however most champions now could because the higher attack speed/lower damage model is more friendly, except when Pantheon gets nerfed.

And he never got compensated. The next time we hear about Pantheon would be this very patch we're on now, where he gets a very slight attack speed buff.

So how do we make Pantheon actually viable again?

Firstly, change dragon's attack back to count as an auto attack again instead of spell. It always bother me that when dragon's attack was changed back to how it was in previous seasons, this was not. Even Baron got a treatment like that when he got his fancy new attacks, making his normal attacks still blocked. This change isn't even really for Pantheon, but rather for consistency. Also, it's annoying getting item 3102 popped by dragon.

Let his W reflect damage against jungle creeps. As of season 5 Pantheon has had almost no sustain since creeps became stronger. His only saving grace was god ganks and level 2 dragons. He has neither of those right now.

Let him W out of his ult. The stipulation would be that Pantheon would also be stunned by the "shock" of prematurely landing. Because he came down with the extra force, both him and the W target would be stunned for 1.5x the duration of his normal W stun. This means that if he does end the landing early, he must do it with W, cannot use summs yet, and would also be stunned with his target.

Alternatively, Riot could go the less fun way and just make his ult cast and land time shorter. But I think we can all agree that him coming down with so much force that he stuns himself and the enemy would be way more badass and fitting of a Spartan. If proven to be OP, the self stun could be changed to not be affected by tenacity and QSS effects, however the stun on the enemy could be.

Of course these changes would be after worlds, as to not scramble everyone just before them. But please Riot, do something. You know something is wrong when one of the best item 3071 champions, who is already sticky and would love to be stickier still isn't played. Think about it. If this Black Cleaver came out during Season 4, when Pantheon was already dominant, people would've flipped out. In theory the new Black Cleaver should've been a huge buff, but he still is never played. I literally don't think I've seen a single Pantheon since Cinderhulk came out. So, around February/March. At least 6 months. I've seen pretty much every champion but Pantheon. To be honest, I forgot that my once favorite champion even existed for a bit. I've seen Yorrick, the champion Riot literally wants to forget about, more than Pantheon.

Please Riot, don't let me go into Season 6 without Pantheon once again coming back. He can't be gone. Pantheon is by far one of the coolest and most unique champions. He has so many mechanics that he pioneered (the crit on targets below 15%, who else has that?). The block, the mechanic of stacking the block with attacks and abilities, the once global ultimate (okay, TwistedFate gets that one). And besides, who doesn't want this badass to make a return?

10 Comments

ButterBladesX2 votes

only problem i see with panth is that his ult takes forever to actually do somthing and in that time the enemy team gets out of it. even when used in a chaotic team fight

Visigoth1 votes

{quoted}

only problem i see with panth is that his ult takes forever to actually do somthing and in that time the enemy team gets out of it. even when used in a chaotic team fight

That's what I see as his major problem too, which is why I think it'd be a cool idea for him to come down faster with W like he used too (although that was later written off as a glitch in season 4). But now, it would also hurt him, so it could be more "balanced"

disregardable1 votes

That's the Christmas of 2013/The New Year of 2014.

Quite a lot of balance thoughts on this thread I can't comment on, so I offered some correction.

SaltyKracka1 votes

I don't.

Jungle panth is pretty fine where he is.

Krully1 votes

i like jungle panth tbh, been having some success, in normals mind, just gotta work those lanes build some sustain and use his ult more for objective control than anything else.

Firu1 votes

Pantheon's my main jungler and I find him pretty serviceable at Silver. I can't speak to him in any other roles. I find timing my passive, let's me get some healthy albeit slow camp clears done. As you said, he has a pretty sweet early game (which I think he still has). My main concern with him is that he falls off late game (or I fail to adjust to late game correctly).

Overall, I think Pantheon is in an okay place though he could use a little love. Not much though. More a hug than like anything that would make my mom blush.

Darth Valer1 votes

I want Pantheon to return to the scene, but with a rework (I've read a Rioter post not long ago where they said Anivia and Pantheon will be on the rework list in the near future). As much as I've loved him over these years, his mechanics are outdated and his kit might use some renewal.

What I'm waiting for the most, though, is AD itemization changes. I want a fu****g real upgrade for brutalizer summoner 14

GastonBarnacles1 votes

Can't stand the shield passive so I can't stand the champ.

Ralanr1 votes

You are not alone as a Pantheon main. I play him top though. I'm not of any rank because I do not want the labels that ranked gives, I don't want to deal with that.

Pantheon was the first champion I wanted when I first started league. I loved his ultimate (I never saw the unnerfed version) and worked to buy him at one point.

I got frustrated when I did get him. I hated how he could be smacked away while performing his W, failing it and putting it on cooldown. There were other things, but that was it.

I came back to him recently, when I started to PVP. I'm surprised how I seem to be the only one to play him in my matches. I felt incredible at top lane, not broken since I had to play smart. But I come on top most of the time with champs like Fiora. But it's normals so take that as you will (I also use the recommended items. Just frozen heart doesn't justify a personal item build).

Even as a Pantheon main I'd be all for a rework. I think his model needs a VU, new lines, new lore. He probably doesn't need a rework, but with every new kit I start to think otherwise.

Last I checked he has a 48% chance winrate. But he's so underplayed. On one side I want him to be noticed by the community again beyond his meme status, but on the other I don't want him to be an "insta-ban" champion.

It's why I hope for a Mt. Targon event. It has to involve Pantheon in some way since it is his home.

Riot I'm not sure where you are on pantheon. I know other champs need your attention first (like Poppy, Taric, Urgot, and Yorick) but I do hope he hasn't been forgotten. You can make him less 300 expy (I wouldn't mind him not being a cardboard cutout of them) and I'm sure a lot of mains would still play him.

Also OP: I assumed he was ambidextrous.

Killer of Poros1 votes

He just needs a better way to be more reliable outside of his lane cheese where he either snowballs or falls off the face of the earth after 30 min. Then again I'm just a lowly silver so what do I know.

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