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Can we please give Sona a better early game

only zhule··6 votes·1,240 views

I'm not talking a strong early game, heck i'm not even talking a "good" early game. I'm talking enough of a boost that she isn't a burden on her team pre 6, and just a walking ultimate till level 11.

Honestly pick one of the following 3 things and you give Sona a purpose in the early game.

  1. Give her a meaningful amount of damage output. If you are going to keep Sona as a champion who is slow, made of glass, has to get into auto attack range to do damage, and has basically no support power in the early game, the least you could do is give her enough damage that she feels rewarded for all that risk. I'm not talking mage "support" levels of damage. But enough that she can apply some pressure to the lane despite having no stun to set up kills.

  2. Give her meaningful amounts of heals/shields. If you don't want Sona to be a damage dealer in the laning phase, let her healing and shields be strong enough and up often enough that she (her and her ADC) can EITHER win a straight fight against the enemy duo, OR grind out advantage through the course of several trades. She doesn't need to outshine Soraka , but she needs enough support power to make up for the fact that she isn't doing damage and she doesn't have skill(s) to set up for her allies to get kills.

  3. Give Sona more survivability. I'm not asking for Sona to be as hard to kill as Leona or Braum . But if she isn't allowed to pressure the lane via damage NOR is she allowed to sustain the lane through heals and shields, perhaps she could not just die to 3 auto attacks. Again the idea is not that Sona becomes a tank-y champion, just enough defense that a light breeze doesn't knock off 20% of her health.

A strong late game champion shouldn't have a great early game. But they also shouldn't have such a weak early game that they are a burden for their team to carry for the first 10-20 mins. Honestly i think buffing Sona's starting health and health gain per level would be enough. It is beyond sad that ADC's have more starting health and more health gain per level then Sona.

25 Comments

Ahristocats3 votes

she needs a "stand by" buff until a rework because right now she's a hard carry deguised in support

reduce her passive from 10/25/40% cdr to 10/15/20% cdr buff her W mana cost and base cooldown buff her Q mana cost buff her E base cooldown

Daedric Etwahl1 votes

Personally I don't relaly think her identity of a hyperscaling support is that much of an issue in itself. Perhaps the way it's gone about, but not the identity itself. Riot just took way more out of her early game than was necessary

Ahristocats2 votes

it is if you want to balance such a "hyperscaling support" you need to trash the early game, which will make the support unviable because people want from a support a good early game

Daedric Etwahl2 votes

Other hyperscalers have a weak but not complete trash early game, so why can't the same be for Sona? Overall Sona's early game was already weak, except for the brief blip with the new runes where we all understood she was OP. But beyond that Sona's early has always been pretty weak. Most hyperscalers usually aim for that style, and most of the time it's worked.

Sona has very clear, and exploitable weaknesses but that's not where the issue lies, the issue lies in the fact that in that she is far too weak at everything she does right now. Something should give, she should be okay at one or two things, not great at anything, but also not trash at everything either.

Ahristocats1 votes

so how "good" sona early game should be?

mana cost? base stats? more healing?

anything you do above will turn her into a non interactive support who just want to play safe to scale

Daedric Etwahl1 votes

Idunno! That's why I never suggest specific balance changes, just ideas, haha.

But I think probably the best way to help her out would be to give her some fo her damage back. She shouldnt outpoke the likes of Brand, no, but right now, that noninteractive Sona that just waits to scale? That's Sona RIGHT NOW. If you increase her damage a little, especially on her Q aura (perhaps only buff it on Sona herself? Dunno) would encourage her to play more aggressively, opening her up to engage or other counterattack.

chipndip11 votes

I've told these people this way too many times. Don't bother. They'll never learn.

LyingOnLine1 votes

[deleted]

Daedric Etwahl2 votes

This reply does nothing for the conversation and is just unneeded. Can we not have a civil and reasonable conversation about a champion that needs a little help.

Besides, nobody's spamming anything. I can bet the main reason people are speaking up more than usual about Sona's sad state is because of the upcoming Heal and Shield nerfs. Really, of the enchanters only Lulu and Janna are really a problem, but with how it sounds the entire class might be getting the nerfs, and several of them, including Sona, don't need it.

LyingOnLine1 votes

[deleted]

Daedric Etwahl3 votes

A champion is in a pretty lousy and unfun state, and their mains come and have actual constrictive posts about it, and that counts as circlejerk? Honestly I could counter with your comment just being the typical boards anti-Sona circlejerk. The boards have completely villified Sona players just because of some unreasonable people, and they'll say some pretty vitriolic things just because you like or play Sona, and no other reason.

I mean it's not even like we want anything crazy, either. We just want to feel like we aren't a burden on our team until level 11 and two items, because that's how the majority of games as Sona feel right now.

LyingOnLine1 votes

[deleted]

Daedric Etwahl2 votes

A. Well I didn't really notice the creators of the topic, don't pay too too much attention to usernames unless attention is drawn to them, so ya got me there.

B. If by compatriots you mean supporting each other among things we agree on, then yeah I guess so? But beyond that I'm not compatriots with anyone. It's extremely difficult to start any sort of civil discussion on Sona without the anti-Sona borads circlejerk breaking out in full force, no matter how reasonable you're being, and it gets immensely tiring. People have actually told me that Sona has zero counterplay, and that's just plainly untrue.

C. Again, dunno this person, dunno what the "classic Sona circlejerks" were, probably wasn't around at that time, so I can't really comment on this. Either way, if I feel that my champion is being treated unfairly, I'll speak up. The initial nerfs at the preseason were completely necessary. The additional nerf to her Q, especially among all the indirect nerfs, was not. And right now I worry she's going to get indirectly nerfed soon, which is something she really can't afford right now.

D. Hm, perhaps I forgot to mention what I personally am hoping for, sorry bout that. But what I really would appreciate right now from Sona would be a power shift. Take a little from her late and give it to her early. Unfortunately, even suggestions like that get quickly downvoted and either ignored at best or flamed at worst, again, because of that anti-Sona circlejerk I mentioned.

Also, Sona's pitiful early game translates to her being unfun because yeah, you have that lategame, but until then you feel like nothing but a burden to your team. It happens to me all the time, I get flamed for being useless even if I've done nothing wrong, but because I'm playing Sona it must be my fault.

Yaśuo Main1 votes

By "classic Sona circlejerk" He means the cancer Sona player community when it comes to balance. For example, 1 post got 60+ upvotes because it complained of Sona nerfs, and everyone who openly agreed with it on the post was dowvoted heavily, one Sona player freaked out and said "when she goes below 50% winrate I'm gonna write up a storm" which is just so wrong and biased, and most sona players there acted like obnoxious dicks. It was very disgusting.

Daedric Etwahl1 votes

Sounds rough, to be honest :/ Yeah I don't remember times like that, to be honest, but I do my best to be reasonable with what I hope for. I do admit I can get a bit heated sometimes, but I do everything I can to be reasonable about things.

Which is why right now my stance is "I'm pretty sure her winrate is okay, but her early game is pretty unfun and miserable, which I think deserves some attention"

Not necessarily straight up buffs, little ones if that, or power shifting yknow?

Yaśuo Main1 votes

I'm fine with power shifts myself, although figuring how to power shift some strength into early-game seems extremely confusing. I've played Sona before, and I've been here long enough to see a lot of Sona posts about her early game is similar to playing as a minion. She is definitely something to not like to play early-game, so I think she should have an early game that is still weak but can be seen as a threat (similar to Yasuo or something). Little buffs would be fine, althougth I'd kinda lean away from a damage buff.

Daedric Etwahl1 votes

I literally just thought it up, but what if Sona's auras gave her a different, more powerful buff to herself than the ones she gives her allies? Her E sorta does this already. It could help out her personal issues, but the buff that gets spread around to four other people is the weaker version?

I somewhat suggest more damage (at least in her Q aura/Power Chords rather than her Q active) because if she's encouraged to deal damage then she'll interact more, and in a way with plenty of counterplay. Right now the issue I have is I have little incentive to even Staccato unless I get it for free, because of how weak they made it, and how much damage everyone else does in comparison.

Daedric Etwahl1 votes

I literally just thought it up, but what if Sona's auras gave her a different, more powerful buff to herself than the ones she gives her allies? Her E sorta does this already. It could help out her personal issues, but the buff that gets spread around to four other people is the weaker version?

I somewhat suggest more damage (at least in her Q aura/Power Chords rather than her Q active) because if she's encouraged to deal damage then she'll interact more, and in a way with plenty of counterplay. Right now the issue I have is I have little incentive to even Staccato unless I get it for free, because of how weak they made it, and how much damage everyone else does in comparison.

A Dizzy Lulu1 votes

Yeahhhh no

Ifneth1 votes

Here are some buff ideas:

  1. More Base Health. Sona was made squishier because Kleptomancy made her strong. Now that Kleptomancy has been nerfed, this nerf could be partially reverted.

  2. Stronger early Power Chord. Increase the base damage from 30 to 75. A good Sona will manage her cooldowns and find the chance to use her passive. A bad one will bungle one of these steps.

  3. Heal tweaks. Decrease the mana cost by ten and increase the base heal by 20 across the board. Change the cooldown to 9/8/7/6. A little more sustain could help her survive lane.

  4. Haste tweak. Grant her ally movement speed for up to 7 seconds if they stay in her aura. Grant Sona a passive haste equal to half the active haste. This will strengthen her rotations and escapes and help her return to lane faster.

  5. Crescendo tweak. Reduce the cooldown from 140/120/100 to 120/110/100. More chances for more all-ins.

ModCaliCoastReplay1 votes

I feel like she's pretty good?

I never seem to have the problems dealing damage that others are reporting. In fact she got my Moon Revel Golden Chroma token - haven't played her lately much, but when I do play her, I seem to win a lot.

Q itself is small damage. But Q + an auto is healthy damage. Q + a Staccato autoattack should be a LOT of damage, unless you're way behind. Q + Staccato + item 3100, if I feel like getting it, is often enough that my ADC's complain of killsteals, so often I just build pure AP instead for the heals.

To me, she does take more skill than people think. I think that if you're just waiting to scale, you're doing it wrong - yes, she has a great late game on a fed lane, but I think her early game can be a lot more active than people think. If you're just floating around, idly Q'ing and healing, you're doing it wrong. But I'm a pretty good Sona - I really actively manage the lane, try to deny zones to the enemy champions, and don't just expect to rinse-cycle-repeat off Q's - it takes her whole kit, and a lot of positioning, and a lot of proper passive management, to really be effective.

I don't know.

I certainly wouldn't complain if they buffed her, but my opponents might.

xelaker2 votes

what you described isn't early game... by the time sona has a item 3100 you aren't looking at early game.

only zhule1 votes

{quoted}

I feel like she's pretty good?

I never seem to have the problems dealing damage that others are reporting. In fact she got my Moon Revel Golden Chroma token - haven't played her lately much, but when I do play her, I seem to win a lot.

Q itself is small damage. But Q + an auto is healthy damage. Q + a Staccato autoattack should be a LOT of damage, unless you're way behind. Q + Staccato + item 3100, if I feel like getting it, is often enough that my ADC's complain of killsteals, so often I just build pure AP instead for the heals.

To me, she does take more skill than people think. I think that if you're just waiting to scale, you're doing it wrong - yes, she has a great late game on a fed lane, but I think her early game can be a lot more active than people think. If you're just floating around, idly Q'ing and healing, you're doing it wrong. But I'm a pretty good Sona - I really actively manage the lane, try to deny zones to the enemy champions, and don't just expect to rinse-cycle-repeat off Q's - it takes her whole kit, and a lot of positioning, and a lot of proper passive management, to really be effective.

I don't know.

I certainly wouldn't complain if they buffed her, but my opponents might.

If you build her as a mage like poke champion, she's not half bad. Not a good mage mind you, but she can more or less function and item 3100 pairs very nicely with her kit.

Now if you build her as a support I.E. item 3107 & item 3504 she really doesn't hold up super well. You are trying to win fights off the back of 50-70 point heals every 6-ish seconds, and 200 point poke every 4-5 seconds.

But this is getting off track. The issue isn't her mid to late game, because let's be honest once you get your 45% CDR, bonus 25% CDR from ultimate passive, enough mana regen / big enough mana pool to combat the fact that you will be spell spamming, she does fine. The issue is the first like 20 mins of the game. The point were you DONT have all that stuff and your win rate is at 44.5%

RedCyclone1 votes

What I hate most about how they have changed Sona is by turning her into a passive support too scared to even use Q anymore, this is a champion who used to be considered THE early harassment support, now she is a zany flipped support that scales just like an ADC...why would anyone want this?

Say what you will about Sona, but her Q Auto procs are the most linear thing to counter, just hit her back and add some cc and she will probably pay for that harass Having a Q that is worth using in the laning phase lets you have the risk and reward back, it creates a more interesting laning phase when Sona is at risk for applying meaningful harass

People say Sona shouldn't be good because she is simple to play, but forget to mention she is simple to play against

The best possible case for Sona is a rework that puts her back as a early harassment support that transitions into a primary enchanter getting to lategame , I feel something like this would make her more unique and fits her theme pretty well

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