Kalista

Woook3r··1 votes·1,168 views

Just want to get some honest thoughts on kalista and her nerfs coming to pbe. Im not sure i entirely understand exactly what they are doing with her. Are they moving more dmg to her rend? Dont even know if she is getting any compensation at all.

My thoughts: ive been playing her in teambuilder recently. The players at my elo need two things to reliably kill her. They need a slow and a gapcloser and armor or burst dmg because slows actually slow her attack speed if she commits to doing hops. So for instance both zed and sejuani can kill her. Lee sin for instance has more trouble, esp since his gap closer is a skill shot.

Now, most bruiser champs are used to the idea that they can just murder the adc in broad daylight. Obviously, this is a sense of entitlemetn that offends the average adc who has to think about so many positional variables to be effective. We cant just walk up and kill anyone. We have to wait for the chance which is usually due to a mistake on the other teams part. So now that I have my hands on an adc that can have a chance in a solo q situation with a lee sin, I dont want to let her go.

If you arent an adc main you dont know what its like to commonly see snot nosed b3 players walk up and "hue hue" murder your ass while ignoring LITTERALLY EVERYTHING AROUND YOU regardless of if its even a good idea to dive the underfed adc or their team is actually dying a full screen away. Then they go into all chat and shit talk you while their team is in a grey screen. Its really toxic in my opinion.

Having said all that, I recently started playing kalista without investing heavily in attack speed. Just pd and boots. Her single target dmg is just wow. And if you have a ranged support like teemo who is building runaans, her w is wow. And I think she is unbalanced.

I consider myself to be a lot better than my current elo. I had a huge loosing streak about two or three months ago and dropped 3 divisions in about two weeks. My MMR is still recovering. (I tried to learn vayne without understanding how important it is to max tumble first) Regardless, there was no way syndra and lee were going to do a good job of killing me unless i made a mistake given that they werent doing a good job of coordinating.. They both rely on a skillshot. Syndra her stun (hard to land on anyone much less kalista) and lee's gap closer wouldnt even help him late game because he no longer has the as debuff or slow or whatever he used to have. So, I had a pretty big advantage in this last game I played, even taking this into account, I started to feel like I had the power those bruisers have over me when i play my other adc's.

Now, at the risk of coming down on both sides, my teammates (teemo and j4) were actually doing a much better job of coordinating. I often killed syndra only after she had blown at least one cooldown maybe more on a teammate of mine. I honestly think that a 1v1 between me and syndra would have come down to rng and who took advantage of the bushes. THIS IS HOW IT SHOULD BE (except for the part about rng)! Positional play, smart plays, and team comps win the game. When I am playing jinx and hecairim dives me from a mile away, i could literally be loosing to a neanderthal huffing freon. Now, If i am playing kalista with a red buff, I still dont think I could be a neanderthal and pound peoples face with her. But given the difficulty of my other adcs, I am conditioned to feel guilty. I have been trained to think that bruisers should kill me quickly and somewhat easily in a 1v1. And that might be a problem too.

TLDR: I want your opinions on kalista but think it shouldnt be so simple to dive the adc repeatedly in solo q. Its toxic. Lee Sin can troll his entire team and the enemy adc by just doing that single mindedly the entire game. So I like kalista. All it should take is one dive to make lee sin realize that he needs to be careful around me and maybe team up if it looks like I am ahead. Shame on him if he bangs his head against the wall trying to solo me while I am getting fed. And remember. I cant exactly chase him down and ruin his game. My base ms is 325. The lowest in the game. He can always stay away from me. He has to get pretty close for me to gun him down. Let him learn some of the principals of position like I had to.

Devils advocate TLDR: I feel like the entire game is balanced around the idea that bruisers can laugh at the adc while annihilating them in a 2v1 taht is dis favorable to the bruiser. Given that kalista breaks this mold, she may be considered slightly broken or moderately unbalanced. Especially with that w. Dayum.

9 Comments

Koldheartedjsp2 votes

stopped reading when you said bruisers shouldn't be able to 1v1 adcs

Woook3r1 votes

{quoted}

stopped reading when you said bruisers shouldn't be able to 1v1 adcs

I understand. I just that adc's are SO weak. I think it should require more than simply having vision of the adc. Like IDK skill! Timing. Positioning. Good opportunities vs bad opportunities. I cant even get away from most bruisers. Its fine if i cant fight them 1v1. I would like to be able to RUN AWAY 1v1 but I cant.

LaowPing2 votes

I feel you bro. I'm an adc main as well. I think some people can't get over the idea of an ADC that can handle herself. People bitch about Vayne quite often or the same reason. What most people don't see is that most ADC's who can't fend for themselves have something to make up for it. Champs like Jinx, Cait, and Kog can attack attack at long range with out being hit. Every other ADC (graves, lucian, vayne) have an escape or dash to make up for their lack of range. Kalista is no exception. People should stop seeing her as an easy kill (which is how most ADC's are viewed) and more as a duelist. Her AA range is short so she needs to put herself in danger in order to hit you. Every bruiser has a gap closer that can be used on her. She's just as free to skillshots as anyone else before she gets in range and she can still be hit even when she's hopping. Her only real problem is that she destroys in lane which is being fixed with the upcoming changes. As someone who's been enjoying Kali since she was released, she's not invincible. People just don't know how to handle her.

Woook3r1 votes

{quoted}

I feel you bro. I'm an adc main as well. I think some people can't get over the idea of an ADC that can handle herself. People bitch about Vayne quite often or the same reason. What most people don't see is that most ADC's who can't fend for themselves have something to make up for it. Champs like Jinx, Cait, and Kog can attack attack at long range with out being hit. Every other ADC (graves, lucian, vayne) have an escape or dash to make up for their lack of range. Kalista is no exception. People should stop seeing her as an easy kill (which is how most ADC's are viewed) and more as a duelist. Her AA range is short so she needs to put herself in danger in order to hit you. Every bruiser has a gap closer that can be used on her. She's just as free to skillshots as anyone else before she gets in range and she can still be hit even when she's hopping. Her only real problem is that she destroys in lane which is being fixed with the upcoming changes. As someone who's been enjoying Kali since she was released, she's not invincible. People just don't know how to handle her.

Its so weird how every champion except the support thinks its their right to walk up and murder the adc. I havnt been playing that long its a little striking to me. Yes I think she is too strong in lane. Her w is brutal and un-trade-able. Yet its not getting a nerf. Not even draven can hope to really trade with her i think.

LaowPing1 votes

{quoted}

Its so weird how every champion except the support thinks its their right to walk up and murder the adc. I havnt been playing that long its a little striking to me. Yes I think she is too strong in lane. Her w is brutal and un-trade-able. Yet its not getting a nerf. Not even draven can hope to really trade with her i think.

Luckily her laning is getting nerfed since her rend will do a lot less damage in lane. Riot actually buffed her w after he release because solo que wasn't using it enough. It's about they they changed it back.

Nameless Voice2 votes

My honest thoughts are that her passive should not exist. It is the single word piece of game design in League of Legends.

I don't usually play bruisers, but that doesn't mean I can't see how terrible her mechanic is.

You're saying that bruisers shouldn't be able to just dive in and murder the ADC - but marksmen are supposed to be fragile, they need to use positioning and teamwork to keep themselves alive. Generally speaking, a bruiser should win against a marksman in a 1v1, but lose against a marksman in a 5v5 because the team should be protecting and peeling for that marksman. Why is a marksman so fragile? Because they have reliable ranged damage with very high DPS. Note the emphasis on ranged. If a mêlée champion is almost impossible to reach, they can still be avoided or kited. If a ranged champion is impossible to reach, then there is literally nothing her opponent can do to stop taking the sustained damage.

Compare two champions who are able to deal very well with bruisers jumping on top of them: Vayne and Kalista. Vayne can outplay opponents with her self-peel and her repositions/stealth. It can be hard to deal with, but can still be played around - drop a pink ward, use a red trinket, attack her from an angle so that her condemn won't shoot you against a wall, etc. Kalista can endlessly kite opponents who have no way of reaching her or even interacting with her.

Woook3r1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nameless Voice,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PBuhn3ka,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2015-07-07T01:30:13.578+0000)

My honest thoughts are that her passive should not exist. It is the single word piece of game design in League of Legends.

I don't usually play bruisers, but that doesn't mean I can't see how terrible her mechanic is.

You're saying that bruisers shouldn't be able to just dive in and murder the ADC - but marksmen are supposed to be fragile, they need to use positioning and teamwork to keep themselves alive. Generally speaking, a bruiser should win against a marksman in a 1v1, but lose against a marksman in a 5v5 because the team should be protecting and peeling for that marksman. Why is a marksman so fragile? Because they have reliable ranged damage with very high DPS. Note the emphasis on ranged. If a mêlée champion is almost impossible to reach, they can still be avoided or kited. If a ranged champion is impossible to reach, then there is literally nothing her opponent can do to stop taking the sustained damage.

Compare two champions who are able to deal very well with bruisers jumping on top of them: Vayne and Kalista. Vayne can outplay opponents with her self-peel and her repositions/stealth. It can be hard to deal with, but can still be played around - drop a pink ward, use a red trinket, attack her from an angle so that her condemn won't shoot you against a wall, etc. Kalista can endlessly kite opponents who have no way of reaching her or even interacting with her.

adc's are supposed to kite. Im sure ashe used to do the same thing before every champ had a gap closer. Kalista can still be killed and her team can still loose. I suggest you dont miss your skillshots because she is here to stay.

MigYalle1 votes

Champions Kalista General Damages increased to 57.5 from 53.45 Damages by level increased to 3.5 from 3.25 Martial Poise (Passive) New effect : Basic attacks now inflicts only 90% of her total AD Pierce (Q) Can not anymore be casted when jumping Sentinel (W) Max delay to trigger the bonus damages after your ally attack has been removed Minimum damages against creeps removed Rend (E) AD ratio on additional spears removed All additional spears now increase active damages by 50% instead of 10/14/19/25/32 (+0.2/0.225/0.25/0.275/0.3 AD)

The damages were increased to make up PARTIALLY for what the passive lost, What they are doing is balancing her passive, No champion in the game can constantly jump with every Auto-Attack unlike Kalista, so when she's fed it's a complete terror. As for the Q, It means that Kalista actually has to stop her movement to cast the spear, so she can't double instant jump, Once again to add more risk to her passive, since it makes her relatively safe. As for her E, I have 0 clue how that is going to affect her. You have to admit, no other champion has her mobility in terms of an ADC. Positioning is the key as you said, Position yourself correctly and your passive should let you dodge anything.

Woook3r1 votes

I mean, this meta is a dive/engage meta and the squishiest characters in the game have a base move speed of 330. You cant just chase kalista down unless she has nowhere to go and I think that is fine. Stop assuming you can because you are a melee with wardens mail and high base dmg. Try developing an actual tactic or strategy rather than just coming in as a member of the league of rapists.

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