So Xin got buffed

GlockHammer·Feb 10, 2016·44 votes·3,419 views

May I ask why?

Is he below 45% winrate?

Is he not a viable pick?

What was the problem with this champ seeing as he needs a hefty buff out of the blue, would someone please explain this to me?

52 Comments

A Miss FortuneFeb 10, 201619 votes

Even if he wasn't viable I wouldn't mind. Xin's kit revolves around him smashing QWE as fast as he and locking down anyone of his choosing. It's not healthy for the game by any means.

GlockHammerFeb 10, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Miss Fortune,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NwxOQtAs,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2016-02-10T11:38:36.896+0000)

Even if he wasn't viable I wouldn't mind. Xin's kit revolves around him smashing QWE as fast as he and locking down anyone of his choosing. It's not healthy for the game by any means.

This, I don't know why some of the absolutely easiest champs in the game have to have such an immense freaking powerbudget. Just as you've written, roll face on keyboards and collect freelo, well not before, but now at least... sigh Riot...

ParoeFeb 10, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Miss Fortune,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NwxOQtAs,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2016-02-10T11:38:36.896+0000)

Even if he wasn't viable I wouldn't mind. Xin's kit revolves around him smashing QWE as fast as he and locking down anyone of his choosing. It's not healthy for the game by any means.

You know what the difference between an assassination pattern and a duelist pattern is? Duelists are required to be in combat for more than three seconds, assassins are not.

with all the new items, xin really didnt have to good an ability to duel; he just gets bursted out.

VerxintFeb 10, 20162 votes

Fiora is the only one who can actually duel right now in the land of thunderlords, duskblades, and runic echos.

The last 2 patches have all been about who casts their spells first. Duelists are actually doing bad, it's just fiora is OP enough to survive

A Miss FortuneFeb 10, 20164 votes

I don't see how the differences between an assassin and a fighter are relevant? Xin spams his abilities on his target like most assassins, however unlike most assassins his cooldowns are extremely low and he actually has them lowered significantly as he continues fighting. Xin's dueling ability is still pretty strong too, if he has a gold lead you're definitely not going to outduel him and you certainly won't be escaping his 600+ range targetted dash and low cooldowns slows/knockups.

LF AnnieFeb 10, 201611 votes

riot's new owner from china, prob pressured them into it.

LVL 5 POROFeb 10, 20169 votes

He's not underpowered, in a bad spot, or unviable. He can solo Baron for crying out loud, and 100 to 0 anyone that isn't a tank. But apparently, that isn't enough.

GlockHammerFeb 10, 20165 votes

[{quoted}](name=L Ange Noir Von,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NwxOQtAs,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-02-10T11:49:54.551+0000)

He's not underpowered, in a bad spot, or unviable. He can solo Baron for crying out loud, and 100 to 0 anyone that isn't a tank. But apparently, that isn't enough.

I am just trying to make sense of this all, becuase it just makes no gorram sense no matter how I twist and turn it.

LVL 5 POROFeb 10, 20166 votes

Its ok man. I've been struggling to understand Riots design/balance philosophy as well. The only logical explanation I've come to is: the balance team is just really really bad at their job.

StellafreyjaFeb 10, 20166 votes

On the PBE, his crit damage was nerfed like 3 times and I honestly won't be surprised if they nerf it again.

In the next patches notes, if there is a nerf for Xin, Riot's gonna be like "omg we never predicted xin would be so broken!!1!! oops!!1!" or something like that. Because that's what they always do when the community is screaming about something being overtuned.

ParoeFeb 10, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ace of Eden,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NwxOQtAs,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-02-10T16:33:36.457+0000)

On the PBE, his crit damage was nerfed like 3 times and I honestly won't be surprised if they nerf it again.

In the next patches notes, if there is a nerf for Xin, Riot's gonna be like "omg we never predicted xin would be so broken!!1!! oops!!1!" or something like that. Because that's what they always do when the community is screaming about something being overtuned.

the crit is actually to help him compete with ultra fast clears like udyr, yi, and jax... the AD scaling is to make hybrid (what devourers is really meant for) xin more viable.

GlockHammerFeb 10, 20164 votes

{quoted}

the crit is actually to help him compete with ultra fast clears like udyr, yi, and jax... the AD scaling is to make hybrid (what devourers is really meant for) xin more viable.

Ok, so he is supposed to have clears on par with the fastest while having almost exclusive early game and ganking power all while scaling nicely since no stat is wasted on him. Hmm... that makes sense. Really.

And also, if this were true, why add an AD ratio to his heal? He's already extremely sustainy in the jungle, beaten only by warwick, who has abysmall clear speed.

foinhasFeb 11, 20161 votes

except his late game sucks...

if you build damage, you get desintegrated in team fights. if you build tank, people can just ignore you since you deal 0 damage

ZorasamaFeb 11, 20161 votes

{quoted}

except his late game sucks...

if you build damage, you get desintegrated in team fights. if you build tank, people can just ignore you since you deal 0 damage

If anything, max CDR CC bot Xin is pretty useful.

GlockHammerFeb 11, 20162 votes

{quoted}

except his late game sucks...

if you build damage, you get desintegrated in team fights. if you build tank, people can just ignore you since you deal 0 damage

This is a lie.

Devourer/ Guinsoo / tank xin will demolish any and every squishy in the game while fighting bruisers on his own without a problem. There is only 1 champ in the game that straight up beats him and that's Jax. No one else, so I don't know what the fuck you are talking about.

VekknaFeb 10, 20164 votes

Because he builds AD, therefore he must have all the special attention.

GlockHammerFeb 10, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Because he builds AD, therefore he must have all the special attention.

Is there anyone that even find these to be good changes? Heck I haven't even seen a xin main come out and say: Well guys, we all know Xin was in a crappy position so this is fully warranted... - Just Riot making changes no one asked for and even less people desired. Are these guys deliberately trying to ruin the game? Cause that's how it feels atm.

VekknaFeb 10, 20166 votes

/tinfoil hat

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if they did this just to get people to stfu about Lee Sin for 5 seconds. Just watch...Xin will own jungle, Lee will get a compensation buff to bring him up to par. Xin will get nerfed.

GlockHammerFeb 10, 20169 votes

{quoted}

/tinfoil hat

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if they did this just to get people to stfu about Lee Sin for 5 seconds. Just watch...Xin will own jungle, Lee will get a compensation buff to bring him up to par. Xin will get nerfed.

Hah, should have known there was a dirty master plan behind it all.

Riot: Seeing as Lee Sin is no longer the most dominant jungler in the game, we're now buffing his ult to instantly kill every champion it affects. We compenaste this move by nerfing Lee's base movement speed by 5. Balance achieved.

VekknaFeb 10, 20165 votes

No, they'll just add a new AD item that triples damage against targets kicked by an ultimate ability. "Everyone can use it! It's totally not a Lee buff!"

SkelenthFeb 10, 20162 votes

Shen "A demonstration of superior judgement" I find this quote sarcastically fitting

elon wątrobaFeb 10, 20165 votes

Nocturne Aatrox both building AD and got little to no attention.

Auz the RipperFeb 11, 20161 votes

I'm fine with that

LatetotheRaceFeb 10, 20164 votes

Literally everyone said no, but they went ahead and did it anyway. What the hell even riot?

ZorasamaFeb 11, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Literally everyone said no, but they went ahead and did it anyway. What the hell even riot?

Let's not forget that literally everyone also said no to Duskblade, and they went ahead and add it on the same patch. wtf rito

DyslexaiFeb 10, 20164 votes

For a long time, I've thought that Xin was numerically one of the most balanced junglers in the game. If he got ahead, he stayed ahead, but if he built full damage he was easy to kill. No escape but his ult, which was unreliable, and exactly one primary play pattern which was easy to exploit if you were looking for it.

Seeing this buff actually make it out of the PBE has changed my perspective of this game. Being "balanced" isn't good enough to warrant picking a champion anymore. Why pick "balanced" when you could just as easily pick "strong"? Xin wasn't in a bad spot, and as far as I could see, his playrate wasn't even low.

I'm really not sure how I feel about this.

PiVoRxFeb 11, 20161 votes

Cause stupid Riot buffs balanced champions (if they actually buff them at all) to catch up with overpowered ones, instead of nerfing what op to make room for others.

Only Play DariusFeb 11, 20161 votes

"Nerfing what's OP" is exactly what turned Rek'Sai from underground predator into a wannabe tank knock up bot that no one enjoys playing even when strong.

Sometimes it's just better to buff the old champs so that you can allow the new ones to stay strong and preserve what's fun about them.

AkesgerothFeb 10, 20163 votes

XinZhao THE DARK SIDE OF THE MOOOOOOOOOON

Riv x KobeFeb 11, 20163 votes

And Riot's reasoning? Xin has been "left in the dust" and is "under-preforming in all roles".

I'd laugh if this wasn't so sickening.

dangopeeFeb 10, 20161 votes

No idea he wasn't even bad. RekSai JarvanIV XinZhao are all slightly below average right now but not bad to where they would need those kind of buffs that Xin is getting.

GlockHammerFeb 10, 20165 votes

Sadly, he wasn't recieving these buffs, He already recieved them, they are in the patch 6.3 notes.

RyùuzakiFeb 10, 20161 votes

{quoted}

No idea he wasn't even bad. are all slightly below average right now but not bad to where they would need those kind of buffs that Xin is getting.

well such buffs are usually followed by big a$$ nerfs i just hope they don't buff my vi

dangopeeFeb 10, 20161 votes

Same.

KaygeFeb 11, 20161 votes

{quoted}

No idea he wasn't even bad. are all slightly below average right now but not bad to where they would need those kind of buffs that Xin is getting.

RekSai isnt sub-par right now. Shes actually in a pretty decent spot. But I agree. Xin didnt need a buff at all

dangopeeFeb 11, 20161 votes

47% win rate with decent pick rate.

WadeWilson1337Feb 11, 20161 votes

I for one welcome our new Xin Zhao overlords.

DEN15 512Feb 11, 20161 votes

i played mostly xin to plat, and i hope this doesn't make him 100% ban, since he was doing completely fine before.

MisterLayzeeFeb 11, 20161 votes

While he got buffed in every way that isn't Devourer, apparently his W no longer works with Sated passive. So in reality he got a nerf mid/late game.

Only Play DariusFeb 11, 20162 votes

His heal works with the sated passive.

XosraFeb 11, 20161 votes

I faced a toplane XIn as Mundo. We were even early and i got a kill on him. Pretty soon though i was forced to start farming with Q just to lane because he would all in me and full health somehow. Even with ganks from our Lee i just could not keep up with him and his healing and crits. He was outsustaining me Mundo who had armor. When i looked later he didi this all with just a Static Shiv. I get the heal, but the crit is just too much and is bull.

Only Play DariusFeb 11, 20163 votes

He is a DPS fighter and as such is well equipped to deal with HP stacking champs like Mundo (same reason Yasuo top works against Mundo even though you would expect otherwise). His weaknesses are hard CC and burst, neither of which Mundo has. That's why you couldn't deal with him

XosraFeb 11, 20161 votes

Well that sucks. I just kind of figured he would at least need a damage item first is all.

Only Play DariusFeb 11, 20161 votes

Xin has very high base damage and his passive amplifies it even further. Xin top is kind of cheesy since he has no access to sated therefore causing him to fall off late game but maybe it works now with the buffs

GlockHammerFeb 11, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jelly Mac,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NwxOQtAs,comment-id=000d000000000000,timestamp=2016-02-11T10:41:07.331+0000)

Xin has very high base damage and his passive amplifies it even further. Xin top is kind of cheesy since he has no access to sated but maybe it works now with the buffs

It worked before as well, he just couldn't faceroll every matchup. I'm hard pressed to find any champ that can deal with him now barring Jax.

CppLFeb 11, 20161 votes

Well what did you expect? its seaosn 6 League of the AD champions.

Silents429Feb 11, 20161 votes

Well did you read the patch notes or? Probably not, because nobody seems to do that.

Xin Zhao's been left in the dust as far as stabbin' folks goes, underperforming in every role across the board. One of our old-school 'melee carries', Xin's always had a lot of flexibility in builds - able to swap between 'max cooldown lockdown machine' or 'crit-fueled basic-attacking monster' based on his team's needs. That said, itemization changes in 2016 have impacted that flexibility pretty heavily. These changes are aimed at bringing back Xin's ability to opt-in to an early snowball rather than feeling pressured to always aim for the lategame (via Sated Devourer and Guinsoo's on-hit synergies).

A point of clarification: To those of you worried about Xin's new crit mechanic's getting out of control with the already-popular Sated Devourer builds, it's important to note that the crit occurs every third attack, not every third hit. This means Sated's Phantom Hit passive won't let him double down into more crits, so you're better off with regular ol' attack damage and attack speed to make the most of his new Battle Cry.

Literally answers everything, and gives clarity on them being aware of any possibilities of him getting out of hand.

GlockHammerFeb 11, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Well did you read the patch notes or? Probably not, because nobody seems to do that.

Literally answers everything, and gives clarity on them being aware of any possibilities of him getting out of hand.

Only a brainless monkey couldn't figure it would get out of hand, and it already has, fuck this fucking brainless monster of a champ. I will dodge every game I see him in and if I lose lp that's a fucking fine price to pay.

Silents429Feb 11, 20161 votes

Would you like to sit down?

You must be tuckered out after that.

Only Play DariusFeb 11, 20161 votes

He is a very old champion and has fallen behind in comparison to other DPS carries. Riot had a new strategy of giving older champions significant buffs to keep them relevant until they can give them a proper gameplay update