Syndra buffs!!@!@!@!@ :D :O :3

CatSith·Aug 20, 2015·42 votes·59,528 views

Syndra Transcendent (Passive) Dark Sphere now deals 15% bonus TRUE damage instead of increasing damage by 15% Scatter the Weak width increased up to 100% from 50%

262 Comments

NuSix3Aug 20, 201532 votes

I'm all for Syndra buffs but I'm not a fan of band-aiding every champ with True Damage.

Meep ManAug 20, 20159 votes

{quoted}

I'm all for Syndra buffs but I'm not a fan of band-aiding every champ with True Damage.

Well... at least its fitting. I think Riot is learning from League of Tanks that they should keep the Tank/Tankier Meta alive, but make sure there is some ways to get past their defenses, such as through true damage.

Leona Del RéyAug 21, 201510 votes

A tweak to her mana costs would benefit her more imo.

PopCorn Chick3nAug 20, 20155 votes

Our syndra is back baby :P. Now we just need arcade or popstar syndra skin.

Syndra

Charmed by AhriAug 20, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Our syndra is back baby :P. Now we just need arcade or popstar syndra skin.

Why would syndra be a popstar? She's not even linked to any popstar groups what so ever.

Edit: Syndra is SNSD too :O https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xap1/t51.2885-15/s320x320/e15/11142252_666217816823840_602339491_n.jpg

PopCorn Chick3nAug 21, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Charmed by Ahri,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Lq63Tvvw,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2015-08-20T23:45:23.547+0000)

Why would syndra be a popstar? She's not even linked to any popstar groups what so ever.

http://assets.diylol.com/hfs/3f3/dc3/197/resized/high-expectations-asian-father-meme-generator-lol-no-928465.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z37B3mSBfAw

Done. Next!!

Captain LitoAug 20, 20155 votes

Well...I suppose true damage fits her character. I mean, come on. LIMITLESS POWER. You would expect her to have some true damage in her kit -pout-

CalabokAug 20, 20153 votes

What for????? Outrageous!

CatSithAug 20, 201512 votes

Her mid Lane power has been weak since her last nerf.

FistOfSharkieshaAug 21, 20153 votes

Her reliability has been weak since her nerf. She's still got strong constant harass and one of the strongest ultimates in the game. She was nerfed because she was just setting down spheres and deleting enemies.

MansanaAug 20, 20153 votes

I like the concept on the true damage on Max Q, but the buff to Max E is a little strange since it was already maxed 2nd after Q. You would think Riot would do some changes to W to make it a contender with E since the efficiency of that spell isn't near comparable to how good E is.

RiotMeddlerAug 21, 201516 votes

We're still looking for a good change to the W upgrade, with you that it's neither a satisfying upgrade nor a good option to max until you have to. The challenge has been finding an appropriate effect that:

Feels at least somewhat noticeable at level 13 or 18 (assuming W still won't be a good choice to max first)
Augments Force of Will's existing functionality, rather than adding something completely new to master (should feel like an upgraded version of the spell, not a replacement)
Has a clear niche compared to the Q and E (so not raw damage or improved multi target peel)
Isn't way too strong (we did try putting the knockup that was there prerelease back on, felt great as the Syndra player but adding another hard CC wasn't appropriate).

Suggestions much appreciated! We'd rather ship improvements to the Q and E than delay them until we find a good W change, given Syndra could do with a bit of power at present. Would certainly be nice to bundle a W change in as well if something that ticked all the boxes could be found though.

Nagoh ShanAug 21, 201510 votes

Force of Will:

Returns 25% of damage dealt as mana.

Would not add damage, would create a new potential ability max path, would delay the true damage buff to later in the game which would both make defensive itemization feel better early vs Syndra while allowing the true damage later on, and would help mitigate some of her mana issues.

RiotMeddlerAug 21, 201516 votes

Really curious as to more people's thoughts on some form of mana refund or discount. It's something I'd shied away from, on the belief that by the time it's available you've already had to commit to mana items anyway, so it wouldn't help much. Would love to hear other opinions on that though.

LankPantsAug 21, 20157 votes

It would open up for things like W max tear build becoming a late game monster.

Syndra also struggles a lot with mana even with Morelo's, so it would help standard builds out a lot too.

Vistha KaiAug 21, 20156 votes

Of course you struggle with mana on a spammy caster mage champion with mana costs on 3 spells equal or higher than 80. That's why you build Athene's and forget about mana.

Morellonomicon is as good of a mana item as Nashor's Tooth or Will of the Ancient were.

I still can't fathom who people can trade infinite mana supply and magic resists for 20 AP.

Overlord ForteAug 21, 20154 votes

If you have Athene's and get kills, the passive is all the recovery she needs. Morello's doesn't suffice because it doesn't provide scaling Mana Regen or %mana recovery (Athene's) and no total mana size (Archangels), so it suffers the most of the three items in mana sustainability. Tear->Archangel's forces different attention in that 'if youre out of mana, you recall, end of story', rather than hanging around for regeneration. Not bad per say, but different.

Mana management is crucial to Syndra's tempo and making sure she has highs and lows, so a recovery mechanic makes me very leery. The proposed one above, for instance, would give a hefty amount of 'win more' in mana the more she kept fighting. At 400 damage on one hit, FoW breaks even with itself, anymore is a massive net gain of mana. So Syndra is, with any one mana item, at leisure to keep throwing out Qs and Ws all day without much concern for mana management (ala the old Ziggs and Xerath problems).

If you wanted to look at her in this area, I'd look at the base mana cost of Force of Will first before introducing a mana recovery mechanic anywhere in her kit.

Eph289Aug 21, 20158 votes

Shooting from the hip here, but if we're looking into W changes and added effects, what if maxing W gave it a cooldown-lowering mechanic (on W only)? Maybe 1 second if she hits a target with Force of Will, or 1 second per target struck with FoW, up to 3? It doesn't boost her raw damage, but it gives her a fallback mechanic if she's losing in lane. Maxing W second would allow Syndra to farm up a bit more from range. It fulfills her power fantasy of being able to toss things around and manipulate spheres/lesser beings. In teamfights, it doesn't really boost Syndra's rotation that much--if you're hitting more than 2 targets with W, your team is probably going to win anyway.

Another idea might be (and this is risky because it gives her more AOE) is that a maxed W has greater AOE on its damage radius. Meh. It'd have to be a lot to feel powerful, and if it's that much . . . lol.

Lastly, what if maxed W gave you a speed boost while you were holding something? I dunno how much sense that makes thematically though. I mean, you levitate a 500-ton rock monster and it lets you move faster?

SpicerXDAug 21, 20154 votes

One possibility could be that when upgraded the W would grab extra targets nearby the initial one(extra spheres if the initial target is a sphere or minions if the initial target is a minion). Then, when thrown, the extra targets would land in a semi circle forming off of the main target. Would make sense for launching a spread of e'd spheres or having some fun throwing a lot of minions.

Like this:

Pyrobob4Aug 22, 20152 votes

Okay, I'm not a syndra player, but hear me out... (always a solid way to start a post)

What if the mana cost depends on how long you hold the target? For example, maybe quick casting costs a moderate amount of mana, but holding it for a full duration reduces the mana cost to almost nothing. Dare I suggest that holding it for long enough could even refund mana?

Thematically, I see this as Syndra sort of draining the essence from her captured target. With that in mind, it could even be that grabbing an orb does nothing to the mana cost, but grabbing an enemy does (since orbs might not have an essence to steal from).

[I just got an insane idea that holding an enemy could restore HP... Should we even entertain that idea? Syndra with sustain?]

Or go the other way. Quick casting costs little mana, and does less damage. Holding it charges it up to full strength, dealing puns of damage, but costing much more mana. Think Janna's Q.

I feel like scaling the spell on the duration held has lots of potential, and shouldnt change Syndras 'feel' much if any. Not just mana, but damage, the slow strength or duration, the AoE radius, and even cast range could all scale this way. Leaving plenty of room for balance, and giving the ability tons of potential variety. Does Syndra need help with mana? Scale the mana cost. Does she need damage but you want it to be situational? increase the damage the longer she holds it. Do you want her to have a longer range ability? Probably not, but you could scale the cast range if you did.

If you tie this scaling into her passive, I could even see a crazy world in which it is balanced in a way that Syndra players might have a reason to max W first...

Scaling off duration seems like an amazing opportunity that, now that I am thinking about it, I am rather surprised you guys haven't capitalized on yet.

Solidair3Aug 21, 20152 votes

Maybe the missile speed of W could be increased at rank 5?

The only thing at present that could be changed without encroaching on E's niche is the slow (increasing its radius would be a little too close to improved multi target peel), but I don't think just making the slow stronger (which already happens as the skill ranks up) would be enough. Additionally it would really just be too similar to her Q's bonus.

Or, perhaps you could increase W's acquisition range for picking something up, but without increasing its offensive range or vice versa. However, given the skills' already higher than average range I'm not sure this is the answer either. Another option is halving its mana cost at rank 5?

What are your, her creator's, thoughts? What I mean is, what do you, personally, think could be amped up on her W?

RiotMeddlerAug 21, 20156 votes

I'd like to avoid anything that really changes the feel of the cast like missile speed, since that then forces you to relearn timings etc partway through the game, often for only a brief period (ranked 2nd or 3rd).

As above mana reduction's something I've been hesitant about, but very interested in other people's takes on.

W pick up range increase is an interesting one actually. Does have a bit of scaryness in terms of red/blue steals, other than that though might be appropriate. Now that I think about it red/blue might also just end up immediately turning around and leashing back if pulled much further.

I'm personally a bit stumped on this one. Was originally hoping that putting the knockup back on would be appropriate given other changes to Syndra and the game since we removed it. None of the other stuff I've looked into's hit the mark though, hence suggestions particularly welcomed.

WarWorkAug 21, 20151 votes

How about a 0.5 second silence

RiotMeddlerAug 21, 20159 votes

I'd be hesitant about a silence, suspect the main thing it would do is increase the window in which other casters can't respond to her after getting stunned, which I don't think's where she needs the help. Silences that short also tend to be pretty unsatisfying for the user, whilst feeling more like unresponsiveness than genuine CC to the victim (see: Blitz ult).

WarWorkAug 21, 20152 votes

Understandable how about an increase in the AOE of her W?

Or some kind of third cast if a dark sphere hits an enemy champion?

Maybe the W can mark enemy champions hit and give some benefits when she hit them with her dark spheres? (increase damage, bleed etc)

Or what if her power warped the area hit, creating some kind of zone

What if the dark spheres thrown attach to enemy champs hit, idk just brain storming. Hope i helped Somehow

Yoichi HirumaAug 21, 20153 votes

Instead of the knockup, it would be worth trying with a displacement like a mini Gragas ult, nothing exaggerated but that influences the flow of the fight... by force of will

roroiAug 21, 20152 votes

I've been thinking about a slow zone. What about ~~instead of~~ in addition to increasing the slow duration have it create a slowing zone that lasts twice (?) as long as the regular slow. Why a slowing zone you might ask, well here's why.

The way I see it, Syndra is a mage who sets up these areas of "power" with her Dark Spheres. The more she places, the easier she can land a stun - i.e pre teamfight, placing 3 and then shooting all 3 with E gives you a chance to stun up to 3 people in different places.

Stunning you means she can unload everything upon you. That's her wet dream. After she unloads her burst she's left with this pokey playstyle of back and forth Q and Ws until her E comes off cooldown.

So the proposed slow zone not only enforces the GET OUT OF THE BALL FIELD feeling/thinking but it allows for more counterplay. You are encouraged to get out of it to stop the slow and tenacity isn't the boring only counter to the slow.

Edit: I thought about this for a while and thought that if the W slow was ONLY a slow zone at rank 5, it would feel weird having it a direct slow applied for X seconds and then switched to a dodge-able slow zone. So basically, it slows for X seconds now, but at rank 5 it slows targets for X seconds and leaves a slow zone for 2X seconds.

LankPantsAug 21, 20152 votes

Isn't way too strong (we did try putting the knockup that was there prerelease back on, felt great as the Syndra player but adding another hard CC wasn't appropriate).

Maybe hard to thematically tie, but how about a snare? Would that still have the same problems as the knockup?

RiotMeddlerAug 21, 20157 votes

I'd expect so. One of the biggest issues with the knockup, even at really brief durations (0.5s) was that it made the E extremely reliable. E's got a pretty reasonable hit rate already, Syndra's pretty vulnerable when it's down though which is something we'd like to preserve (trade off for her burst in particular), so having some risk there's pretty important.

LankPantsAug 21, 20152 votes

Fair enough.

Just throwing random shit out there now (which I'm sure is the best form of design) but how about a cripple? It does make E more reliable, but only in circumstances where it probably should be.

Just to make sure we're on the same page http://smite.gamepedia.com/Crowd_Control#Cripple

RiotMeddlerAug 21, 201512 votes

We'll almost certainly do a cripple style CC at some point, it's an effect we've though would be a good choice for a while, potentially for multiple different abilities. Hadn't considered it here, gut reaction's that it's an effect to build a spell around, rather than something to add as a secondary effect, given the importance of communicating well to the victim why they can use some of their spells, but not all of them. Will think on that though.

FasmodeyAug 21, 20152 votes

{quoted}

We'll almost certainly do a cripple style CC at some point, it's an effect we've though would be a good choice for a while, potentially for multiple different abilities. Hadn't considered it here, gut reaction's that it's an effect to build a spell around, rather than something to add as a secondary effect, given the importance of communicating well to the victim why they can use some of their spells, but not all of them. Will think on that though.

Please dont touch her damage, she has to be burst mage. If her nerf hammer time has come, do it with different way.

CatSithAug 21, 20153 votes

How about making Force of will Leave a Aoe slow aura around the target Syndra throws at max level?

neTøAug 21, 20156 votes

Talon mains have been asking for this since the e was destroyed and replaced with that useless slow.

Please?

AbusiveEmuAug 21, 20153 votes

Talon mains still murder plenty of things without it. They just now have to put 5 seconds of thought into it before diving instead of .5 :) "Stabby foot" is still strong.

AzraeilAug 21, 20151 votes

I noticed all the comments seem focused on the second part of the W ability. Syndra's main power revolves around Telekinesis why not use that more when at Max level. First Part of W. Allow Syndra to pick up an Enemy Champion at level 5. This shows an increase(transcendence) of her Telekinetic ability. Make the Enemy Champion Immune to all Damage and CC effects while picked up just like the stasis minions are placed in. Maybe allow her to throw them a short distance like over a nearby wall or maybe they just drop in place. Make it after a short time(1 - 1.5s) or if re-activated or if Syndra walks out of Range of the spell. When they Drop they cause the Damage and slow effect of the second part of W to all surrounding enemies but does not effect the initial target to help Balance the spell. this can be similar to Tahm Kench swallowing an enemy but different because Syndra can't carry them off.

just an Idea.

AbusiveEmuAug 21, 20153 votes

Because that is what Skarner and Tahm do. Her current kinesis wouldn't work as it pulls away too far and would essentially have to be coded as an entire new ability.

Stan DandeliverAug 21, 20152 votes

I think if you just manage to fix ALL her bugs she would be fine, and this change would be less required (maybe not the E change). I like the Q change so you can interact with tanks better, but mostly think she would be fine if her stun ctually worked ALL the time instead of just 80-90% of the time.

MansanaAug 21, 20152 votes

Had a few ideas but there could be better ones floating around somewhere:

Larger 2nd cast radius with a knock-back from center rather than a knock-up? like a mini gragas ulti? But then again most of her spells are better fitted to keeping enemy champs clumped up for more centralized aoe damage from Q and E. It could also kinda take away Gragas' identity.
~~Another suggestion would be adding a third spell condition similar to Puppeteer. Those hit by W can be pulled closer?~~
How about actually leaving some sort of area of affect domain similar to Ori's W?
Ok, last suggestion. Make it so her W's internal cool down starts refreshing while she holds a sphere/object instead of after the 2nd cast. She can finally throw more sphere's around if you time the throw right before the 2nd cast time window ends. You could potentially make 7 sphere ulti's easier, better, faster, and stronger to pull off.

Edit: # 1 and 2 probably don't fit your criteria :P

Other than that mana issues that are present in this ability always comes up, assuming you are not getting kills/assists left and right to rejuvenate from athenes. Idk, maybe it's a weakness that should be kept similar to Lux's E cost, Anivia Q, etc.

mageNtaboxAug 21, 20153 votes

{quoted}

We're still looking for a good change to the W upgrade, with you that it's neither a satisfying upgrade nor a good option to max until you have to. The challenge has been finding an appropriate effect that:

Feels at least somewhat noticeable at level 13 or 18 (assuming W still won't be a good choice to max first)

Augments Force of Will's existing functionality, rather than adding something completely new to master (should feel like an upgraded version of the spell, not a replacement)

Has a clear niche compared to the Q and E (so not raw damage or improved multi target peel)

Isn't way too strong (we did try putting the knockup that was there prerelease back on, felt great as the Syndra player but adding another hard CC wasn't appropriate).

Suggestions much appreciated! We'd rather ship improvements to the Q and E than delay them until we find a good W change, given Syndra could do with a bit of power at present. Would certainly be nice to bundle a W change in as well if something that ticked all the boxes could be found though.

I think having her Transcendent bonus for Force of Will could be something as simple as giving her next basic auto attack a slow on the next single enemy she hits or something similar to Iceborn Gauntlet.
You can also make it more creative where while she is holding a dark sphere, all of her auto attacks slow for a very short duration or give a ministun until she uses the second part of Force of Will or it times out. Or instead of auto attack slows she gains a movement speed buff. Another suggestion is having the second part of Force of Will create an extra sphere though I'm pretty sure this might be too strong, but that's fine right? :^ ).

EddywardAug 21, 20152 votes

If you're looking to augment Force of Will by making it feel like an upgraded version, how about making it leave a brief slowing field that matches the max rank slow (currently 45%)? "The impact of the throw causes a gravity field to form in its wake." The "clear niche" here would be to give her the ability to zone with her W.

It would still act as "multi-target peel" in a way, but the ability itself already does that. The key is that this adds the functionality of her not having to hit someone with the ability to make an impact. This is similar to how she'll throw spheres on the ground (without hitting an enemy) simply to set up her E or her ult. This gives her the option of setting up spheres to zone enemies as well. I think it's a safer way of re-implementing her prerelease knockup, but it kind of keeps the spirit of that. What do you think? It would require art work, so that might be a problem.

KSHarrisonAug 21, 20152 votes

I've always thought of Syndra as a lane bully that evolves into a control / pick style assassin. She operates outside of the other team's range, poking with Q and seeking an opportunity for a long-range stun to set up an all-in kill with her ult.

So I'll throw some (probably wild) ideas out:

Picking up a ball leaves a copy of the original ball on the ground. This means W would create an extra ball. This would have ramifications for all of her abilities as well as any play style you prefer.
Tossing a ball at a location leaves a zone behind that slows targets inside. This would add a little to her control aspect to help her in a meta of Righteous Glory meatballs running at limited-mobility champions. The zone could optionally be tuned to benefit allies within.
Directly hitting a target refunds either half the mana cost or 1-2 seconds on the cooldown, and grants Syndra a small buff for a duration (examples: 1% movement speed, range, CDR, mana, shield, resists), stacking up to X times. This encourages players to role play Syndra's theme as a telekinetic mage who tosses targets around. I want to see Syndra flinging targets around her like Jean Grey in X-Men with the Phoenix Force. You could even lower the damage of consecutive strikes on a target to accommodate her power budget.
Vision is granted in a range around the landing area of W. This would allow Syndra to "face check" bushes safely at range, and help her as a pick mage who works around vision to set up a pick. The vision could even last for a small duration (the ball could have a red swirl animation around it to indicate it's "vision-empowered.")
Balls lifted by W gain increased size. This could increase the target area of her W as well as reliability of E (Make E's bonus increased range rather than width?) Not a big fan of intruding on E's design space, but I'm trying to think of ways to enhance her role at setting up picks. I suppose the first suggestion of creating ball copies would also help by giving her ult more damage to pick a target off.

Referencing the 3rd suggestion, something absolutely crazy would be to lower W's cooldown+mana cost on direct hits (ie. a small circle within the larger target area ala Zilean's bomb), but add a debuff that makes consecutive W hits deal zero damage for a duration. The reduced cooldown/mana cost means Syndra would be spamming W for the utility to kite/chase until she finally misses a direct hit (or the opponent dodges). There would be a lot of flying minions/balls around Syndra, which could be cool, and the action-packed mechanics might appeal to players in love with that mechanical ceiling of Syndra.

DolodinAug 21, 20159 votes

Couple of potential ideas for a W upgrade;

#1 - Upon impact with a champion, a W'd sphere will split into two dark spheres.

Pros:

Helps set up for a devastating ult a little easier and hit your E a little easier
Thematically looks quite cool, especially if you have the two new spheres both smaller than the original as if it's been split in half.

Cons:

Could make the E too easy to hit, à la pre-release knockup
Means less setup for your ult to do massive amounts of damage and less time for the enemy to be wary (unless you nerf the ult per ball damage slightly)

**#2 - W will cause the Dark Sphere to bounce in target direction, either reapplying its W effect or just the Q effect (damage). Think: Heimer's upgraded grenade **

Pros:

Helps Syndra to poke and seige a little more lategame, but not such that it's a spammable, annoying manoeuvre, as she has to cast two spells to make it occur and is gated by W's cooldown, like Jayce for example.
Also thematically fairly cool, ESPECIALLY if you make a little drag effect in the ground like Gnar's thrown boulder. Would feel very satisfying.
Easier to land the slow but doesn't make it stupidly easy to land the stun.
Even better waveclear if she can Q the first three minions to low health, and then W the same three minions to finish them off and hopefully one-shot the last three minions too. (you could optionally allow it to happen to minions rather than just spheres to see the little critters bounce on their friends... mua ha haa)

Cons:

Could feel a little clunky to cast a bouncing projectile at varying ranges, let alone at max range
Could bounce out of range of the E which would be frustrating to players, especially as it would mean putting a defensive / engaging spell on cooldown just because of a lack of kit synergy.

#3 - Creates a slowing zone that spreads out around the projectile which lasts a few seconds; like how Lissandra's ult works, but perhaps decaying or not as long lasting. (and on a much smaller scale of course)

Pros:

Synergises with her float and kite kit, allowing her to catch up to her enemies.
Gives her more presence in teamfights to those not paying attention to where she throws spheres.

Cons:

Could come across as a little lacklustre or feel a little lost in her kit, perhaps (Hard to visualise without testing, really)
Can't think of any more, but I'd say the previous point is worth about two cons.

#4 - Hitting an enemy (champion?) grants a small burst of movement speed.

Pros:

Great for kiting / chasing / escaping / positioning in a teamfight
A discrete but satisfying and sensical buff
More potential to see that awesome foreward lean she does when moving fast!

Cons:

...????

What do you think? ^-^

hakE69Aug 21, 20152 votes

With the changes, obviously you're gonna max E if you want to have more chance to stun people, and you're gonna keep maxing Q first for the true damage. For the W i would make the AOE larger, since W is used as a waveclear (when not used offensively as a slow) but usually only can hit half of the wave. That way, you can choose between E or Q depending on what you want to do in the match and, since that wouldn't increase damage or slow %, that makes maxing W the "defensive" option whereas E is the offensive one.

enddotAug 21, 20152 votes

*Force of Will's telekinetic power crushes lesser minions/monsters [with x amount of health remaining], creating a grasped Dark Sphere.

-I think it's strongest point would be faster +2 sphere ultimate setups where lesser minions/monsters are present. I believe the W pick up to W slamming travel time is more than enough of an indicator but the [*] could balance the upgrade out, leaving a more fair indication or warning to the opponent that Syndra's is present. [*] could make it balanced for using it on the larger monsters as well.

-It leaves less to think about in a hectic lane fight situation, trying to click a sphere in a pile of minions.

-Turning a lesser minion/monster into a sphere only makes half the spell feel new (the grabbed minion becomes a grabbed sphere), the other half functions as usual.

NullDragonAug 21, 20152 votes

Transcendent Force of Will: Hitting an enemy champion reduces the cooldown of Force of Will by 50%.

Definite increase in poke/siege ability at level 13/18, might even be a good first pick on a poke comp.
Simple cooldown decrease, dependent on the main interaction with enemy champions that Force of Will has.
Niche is primarily increased chase and sieging ability.
Doesn't affect her burst. Increases her sustained damage, but only if she lands the initial W.

I think it would have a really good feel to it too, flinging spheres and minions around at people.

IITranscendentIISep 11, 20152 votes

Should add a knock up to Syndra's W, it will only be like 0.50 secs, and decrease the slow down to 40% at max ranked. dont need any of her spells to return mana or such, because we have athenes.

I think its a good idea, considering people will take like merc treads for the stun on her E so they can have a better chance in getting away by flashing out after the stun wears off really quickly.