Just played a match where both teams had multiple Bruisers and no ADC.

Bouncemaster Zac·Jan 16, 2018·109 votes·5,192 views

And it was the most fun match I've had in ages. Rotations and map plays meant more than just "we caught this guy he's dead now, push mindlessly." Teamfights were knockdown, drag-out fights that lasted over a minute and target selection actually mattered. It wasn't just "adc targets closest person, everyone else targets adc." Taking towers required coordinated effort, rather than one person being given 5 seconds of space and just popping them. The match lasted a whopping 70 minutes with a total of 5 normal dragons, 3 elders, and 4 barons (plus Harold) being taken before a siege finally brought down a nexus. A match that long was immensely draining, but god damn was it fulfilling even though I lost.

Can we go back to lower damage and longer matches where choices matter beyond who the adc clicks on?

96 Comments

MordepoolJan 16, 201849 votes

You sir have just experienced Season2. That feeling is why it is considered the best season. It was fun

AhristocatsJan 16, 201821 votes

i don't remember season2 being played without adcs

https://youtu.be/FKwO_McUcjQ?t=204

this was a high elo game and a team tried to play with full bruisers back when atma was "op" and got facerolled by the team playing with caitlyn explain to me when we played a game without adcs? adcs were always requiered in this game, and if you didn't have them you lost

Moonfall SaberJan 16, 201813 votes

I used to play pantheon adc with a volibear support. Good ol days

Baron Von BanginJan 16, 20187 votes

That was when you were leveling or had low MMR. Season 2 two had a very established meta. The holy Trinity of Graves, Ezreal, and Corki ruled bottom lane and the only mids that mattered were Karthus and Orianna. If supports needed gold to function they were trash. Shyvanna, Mundo and Lee were the meta junglers. Renekton, Jayce, Rumble, and Shen were common tops.

You all were too new if you think Season 2 was some weird wild west.

OrbvJan 17, 20181 votes

Xerath was also very popular mid. He was at the time one of the heaviest lane pushers. Toyz was really the only competive person worth watching with Orianna. The rest abused the karthus revive/teleport .

Baron Von BanginJan 17, 20181 votes

I don't remember, was AP Yi in Season 2 or 3? Because that was really meta warping.

OrbvJan 22, 20181 votes

That feels like so long ago, feeling old lmao. I think season 3 was the AP Yi season, 2013. I forgot about that.

I don't know what was worse. The reach of his damage if there was a single minion between you, or how you can burst him, and if he had a sliver of life left, he would go back to 100% and pretend that never happened.....or was it how he could gank another lane in 5-10 seconds and have your team blame you for not following? That went on for half the year

CytheGuyJan 16, 20183 votes

I think he's referring to Season 1 before Fnatic showed up

Andrey0345Jan 16, 20183 votes

I guess they just weren't as op as they are now?

Psi21Jan 16, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LT2yV8cj,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-01-16T07:50:37.878+0000)

i don't remember season2 being played without adcs

https://youtu.be/FKwO_McUcjQ?t=204

this was a high elo game and a team tried to play with full bruisers back when atma was "op" and got facerolled by the team playing with caitlyn explain to me when we played a game without adcs? adcs were always requiered in this game, and if you didn't have them you lost

The only bruiser in that game is Udyr.

23 Minutes into the game critPlank doesn't constitute as a bruiser but more melee.

You are trying to glorify ADC when ADC in most case are the only ones that can touch a bruiser making mages and true tanks (think Braum) feel like garbage even to this day.

True Bruisers (tankie dps) make this game stupid and unfun to play.

AhristocatsJan 16, 20182 votes

Nocturne built warmog and atma, Nocturne was a bruiser back then believe it or not

Talon isn't a bruiser, but assassins didn't have an itemization and built bruiser too

that was back when atma was "op" i put a " because it was only op in low elo in high elo bruisers were still melees and kept in check by the game that is hostile towards melees

Love DramaticJan 16, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LT2yV8cj,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-01-16T07:50:37.878+0000)

i don't remember season2 being played without adcs

https://youtu.be/FKwO_McUcjQ?t=204

this was a high elo game and a team tried to play with full bruisers back when atma was "op" and got facerolled by the team playing with caitlyn explain to me when we played a game without adcs? adcs were always requiered in this game, and if you didn't have them you lost

Are you everywhere on every gameplay post!??!?!??!?!?!?!??!!

Bouncemaster ZacJan 16, 20185 votes

{quoted}

You sir have just experienced Season2. That feeling is why it is considered the best season. It was fun

I joined at the very tail end of S3 so the bulk of S4 is what I identify as the fun game I fell in love with.

Baron Von BanginJan 16, 20184 votes

Season 2 by no means was problem free.

Players HATED Lee for his constant jungle dominance. They hated the Holy Trinity of bot lane. Early game focused champions were considered garbage. Supports were only allowed to buy gold generation items, aegis, tier 1 boots, and five million wards. Modern champions were of much higher quality than the original cast and VUs like Kayle, Gangplank, and Tryndamere weren't cutting it. Riot dumpstered champions if they were "too hard" to balance.

You were just too new to be in the know.

MordepoolJan 16, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Baron Von Bangin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LT2yV8cj,comment-id=00010003,timestamp=2018-01-16T21:28:16.876+0000)

Season 2 by no means was problem free.

Players HATED Lee for his constant jungle dominance. They hated the Holy Trinity of bot lane. Early game focused champions were considered garbage. Supports were only allowed to buy gold generation items, aegis, tier 1 boots, and five million wards. Modern champions were of much higher quality than the original cast and VUs like Kayle, Gangplank, and Tryndamere weren't cutting it. Riot dumpstered champions if they were "too hard" to balance.

You were just too new to be in the know.

I'm very aware S2 had its problems but for all its rough edges it was fun as hell.

Also they Dumpstered Mordekaiser just as you described in S2 iirc.

But the point of my post was to convey that the feeling of the game he played was very similar to 8/10 games in S2

Baron Von BanginJan 17, 20181 votes

Eh, bruisers weren't that much of a thing in season 2. The game now has problems just like the game then had problems. The issues are different but it wasn't like everyone was all hunky dory and singing Riot's praises all season.

MizayaJan 16, 20181 votes

ADCs felt better to play in S2 than now though. But so did bruisers and mages

MordepoolJan 16, 20182 votes

{quoted}

ADCs felt better to play in S2 than now though. But so did bruisers and mages

Individual skill had a much greater affect on the game

The Bad TouchJan 16, 20181 votes

{quoted}

You sir have just experienced Season2. That feeling is why it is considered the best season. It was fun

Amen. Game has been downhill since them. Season 6 onward has just been garbage. Whole game is first ADC to build 2 items wins.

MordepoolJan 16, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Bad Touch,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LT2yV8cj,comment-id=00010005,timestamp=2018-01-16T23:13:56.821+0000)

Amen. Game has been downhill since them. Season 6 onward has just been garbage. Whole game is first ADC to build 2 items wins.

What made the game fun is gone in order to cater to internet cafe players in China

The Bad TouchJan 20, 20181 votes

{quoted}

What made the game fun is gone in order to cater to internet cafe players in China

After a 2 month break I came back to give it another shot.

It's actually pretty fun.... IF you play adc/jungle/support. I'd hate to play top/mid though. They generally have little impact. Unless they are smurfing well below their elo.

Flawless FetusJan 16, 20182 votes

Nope. Season 2 had adcs damn near every game. Lol. Most of the champs that can "replace" adcs didn't even exist back then, so the odds of not having one were even less. Good try though.

Critmaster GarenJan 16, 201848 votes

if your fights took that long compared to the 10 second fights that are normal, it means damage in this game isnt too high.

it just means adc damage is too high.

AirKingNeoJan 16, 20184 votes

Yeah, but if you play ADC, your damage doesn't really become absurd until 3 items, and doesn't outbreak bruisers and decently damage tanks until Last Whisper upgraded.

That's why I think you give -10 AD to IE and ER, minor nerfs to other ADC items, and nerf the fuck out of LW, and then also nerf pure tanks (Maokai, Ornn, Thornmail, Adaptive Helm, Grasp, and Aftershock).

DoozkuJan 16, 201821 votes

Who knew picking only bad champions would create a balanced game [slayer-jinx-wink]

XIVIVIXJan 16, 201820 votes

New game mode: Every champions range set to 150.

ArakadiaJan 18, 20181 votes

You just eliminated 75% of the roster's viability.

SlythionJan 16, 201819 votes

70mins is excessive, but I'll take 45-55 min games over 15-25 any day

YaskamasandwichJan 16, 20188 votes

{quoted}

70mins is excessive, but I'll take 45-55 min games over 15-25 any day

^ this, I do love long games and this time is perfect. 70 minutes is way to long for me and very draining. 40 minutes is just right because it was long enough and not draining enough to stop playing if I still have some free time. Although truthfully it's more of what happens in that game. A game could last 40 minutes with one team having all the dragons and barons just ducking around before ending it. That's more torture than a game ending quick sadly.

IfnethJan 16, 201813 votes

Maybe that was fun for you, but as someone who plays both AP and AD carries, the thought of games regularly reaching 70 minutes sounds nightmarish. They wouldn’t be worth it.

Those roles aren’t just named for their damage. Come the mid and late game, their players can feel the weight of the game on their shoulders. The jungler is just there to make the play. The top laner is just there to follow up. The support is just there to keep them safe. Once those jobs are done, the game is up to the mage and the marksman. And both teams know it, so everyone dives the enemy carries.

Like junglers live for ganks, supports for saves, and top-laners for brawls, carry players like me live for that feeling. Put the game on our shoulders, we say, and we will see it through. But it drains us more than you might imagine, especially once the game passes the point when one lost teamfight means defeat. All we can do is wait and watch as the rest of both teams maneuver, trying to keep up, hoping ours will play it right, and nearing every brush and corner and shadow with dread.

Please, no 70 minute games. I don’t wanna end up like Omega Squad Teemo. :(

AIIanJan 16, 20186 votes

{quoted} Like junglers live for ganks, supports for saves, and top-laners for brawls, carry players like me live for that feeling. Put the game on our shoulders, we say, and we will see it through. But it drains us more than you might imagine, especially once the game passes the point when one lost teamfight means defeat. All we can do is wait and watch as the rest of both teams maneuver, trying to keep up, hoping ours will play it right, and nearing every brush and corner and shadow with dread.

Jhin "I get nervous before every performance, but I need that feeling."

Past the 40 minutes mark, the atmosphere on the Rift gets thick. The slightest misstep, a small error in positioning and that's around an hour of play down the drain and victory with it.

IfnethJan 17, 20181 votes

{quoted}

"I get nervous before every performance, but I need that feeling."

Taliyah “You’re no artist—just a hired gun!”

AIIanJan 18, 20181 votes

{quoted}

“You’re no artist—just a hired gun!”

item 3070 Jhin

Èreb YsondreJan 16, 20187 votes

I absolutely love that feeling of pressure as an ADC main, Jinx OTP I'd even say, a 40+ minute game is exactly what I'm looking for and even if I loose I'd still enjoy the game. Feeling the pressure, all the eyes on you for that one team fight where you have to make the difference the stakes are so high that is a huge part of why I play ADC, also Jinx is best girl but that's not the point. Please more 70 minute games I want to end my games in tears of pure stress

CHODES AND LOADSJan 16, 201810 votes

back in my day ulting twice in a fight wasnt unheard of with some champs. now sometimes im lucky if i can ult once. [sg-poppy]

ArakadiaJan 18, 20181 votes

Well yeah.

If you go into a fight without your ult you should pay for it.

Omen46Jan 16, 20186 votes

I would like this, if I felt itemization was more diverse and/or effective. Furthermore, I would like game that weren't always an hour long. I would also want rewards based on time spent. And I hate to admit it, but faster games lets me play more cast of fun champions. I just wish I could actually play them instead of staring at a grey screen the second I get back to lane from the damn near resource-less 1 shot many of the champs are managing at low levels.

I would LOVE a game with complicated options of attack and where 1 shotting the right champion didn't win you the whole game. [sg-soraka]

Sand ÄhlämJan 16, 20186 votes

You have no idea how jealous I am that you could play a game like that [zombie-nunu-bummed]

Athenes LuluJan 16, 20186 votes

Meanwhile the last time I had a game where there were no ADCs but were replaced by mages and tanks, it ended quickly as the team with more tanks won. Never in my life my team felt so useless as the tanks were "oneshotting" everything that ran in their way, and laning was extremely uninteractive as you can't do jack shit against them.

And that was early in the preseason, too.

SkorchJan 16, 20186 votes

Is it a problem if it is this easy to predict the first sentence based on EVERY post with a title exactly like that.

Although I agree ADC damage could be toned I am not the biggest fan of the whole "Matches are fun with no ADC" idea often passed around.

subhuman team XDJan 16, 20185 votes

godbless you , when i saw this post , i predicted your arguments , i knew deep down you were going to say it was a fun match , and i agree with everything you just said

chipndip1Jan 16, 20185 votes

Posts like these are a good reason why these boards are a joke. A complete fucking joke.

Blank SpaceJan 16, 20184 votes

While I don't really like that piss-weak turrets and first blood turret gold make the game super hard to come back from after one side's bot lane inevitably takes the first turret, I don't miss having Olaf and Irelia jumping down my throat and being impossible to kill, either. I also don't really miss the game being decided by whose jungler finished feral flare first. I agree that there are current shitty problems, but I think people look at previous seasons through rose-tinted glasses.

LegitBacon66Jan 16, 20183 votes

I had one of these matches this preseason and it was fun as hell

AzeranthJan 16, 20183 votes

It's cause ADCs scale too fast and do too much. Go look at the top article on Game play about math, it explains it

Lil Homie bustaJan 16, 20183 votes

Because playing around one player (ADC) isn't fun. The support role was much more fun when supports actually supported the whole team, not one member (when ADC wasn't so relevant as is today).

When you remove this shackle, the game becomes so much fun. I don't have anything against the ADC's, but i wish the game wasn't played so around them.

FourVsFiveJan 17, 20182 votes

I remember the days of close to melee range Soraka Starcalling, you could go into a fight and get that close without getting deleted in 2sec. Fun times.