Thoughts on an Active Spellshield item?

The Ecdysiast·Mar 3, 2016·5 votes·1,233 views

I don't have any clue as to what its stats would be. It just feels like Banshee Veil isn't always a good choice... When the enemy has a good number of ranged attacks that can pop it before the actual fighting starts, for example.

Edit: I've realized that it may be abused by Sivir and Nocturne, but that's no worse than a few champions' kits.

EDIT 2: I'm not asking for CC removal. That's Olaf, Gangplank, and Alistar. I'm saying a spellshield, like Nocturne and Sivir.
If there are problems specifically against mages, then it won't be an MR/Health item. It can be damage or armor, making it a reasonable pick against champions like Zed, without an AD champion needing to buy Zhonya's.

30 Comments

Me actuallyMar 3, 20162 votes

Vainglory has an item like that and its super nice.

RedCycloneMar 3, 20162 votes

There is already waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too many counters to mages already, can we not fuck them over even more?

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

It's intended for a counter to every ability. You don't see Sivir mid, do you? Mages can spam spells enough that it doesn't matter, which is also why Banshee isn't enough when the Mage opponent is smart.

And it'd be great to be able to buy something to counter, you know, ZED.

KillerKellMar 4, 20161 votes

Banshee's counters Zed. Zhonya's counters Zed. Cleanse counters Zed.

Again, plenty of things already... and opening up to your Summoners for even more.

And Barrier doesn't counter him but greatly increases survival when marked.

AngelFrost00Mar 3, 20161 votes

That very good for marksman and tank.

Savage DeviMar 3, 20161 votes

Same reason as with Duskblade: giving a player too much freedom over some item abilities makes things overpowered. Letting everyone select just which spell they want to block breaks many things. There's a reason there's so few spellshields to begin with, and there's a reason one of them is given to a champ with low kill potential, one can't block physical spells, and one can't be triggered on will. Nocturne? He got a good deal.

CrimsonReapsMar 3, 20163 votes

I am a nocturne main and the only skill required to play him is that spell shield, I wouldnt throw a massive fit if they re worked his w, but i think right now its fine , although an active spell shield item would cause problems if i found a yi able to block my one cc ability than alpha all of my other stuff it would be a bit bs

ZT XperimentorMar 3, 20161 votes

Well the banshee's veil was the original spellshield item, though passive; but it got nerfed hard before a bunch of spam playstyle champions came out. It used to recharge every 20 seconds, but in season 3 they gutted it by raising it to 40 seconds; only to make champions in the later seasons with hard-hitting abilities on a significantly shorter cooldown. I'd rather see this item returned to it's former utility; but I wouldn't see any issue with a similar item that you have to activate instead.

ErockandrollMar 3, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I don't have any clue as to what its stats would be. It just feels like Banshee Veil isn't always a good choice... When the enemy has a good number of ranged attacks that can pop it before the actual fighting starts, for example.

Edit: I've realized that it may be abused by Sivir and Nocturne, but that's no worse than a few champions' kits.

I wouldn't call them an abuse case. Actually, Such an item would devalue the unique strengths that Sivir or Nocturne has. Considering an active spell shield would also block the damage from spells that should otherwise be Very Reliable. (Like Karthus ult)

But if your problem is the CC and not the damage. We can already remove CC after the fact with QSS.

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

That'd put two spell shields on those champions.

Again, the problem isn't the CC. pointed out Noc and Sivir, not Olaf and Gangplank.

If it's a problem against things that should be reliable, then we'll make it an armor or damage item, rather than defense.

Hourglass already counters Karthus's ultimate, by the way.

Chaos Milk TeaMar 3, 20161 votes

Um item 3140 item 3139 Just saying activate AFTER cc harder to misfire like that

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

What's with all the people under some impression that Sivir and Nocturne use their spellshields purely for CC, despite the fact they can't be used to cleanse?

I'm asking for a SPELL SHIELD. Not an HP shield, not a Cleanse, NOT: Charm, Enlarge, Whimsy, Fear, Terror, Slow, Stun, Suppress, AS Slow, Stat reduction, or Aura. If you need a longer list of the things a spell shield isn't, I'm sure you can look at the wiki.

Slamurai JackMar 3, 20161 votes

QSS isn't enough for you?

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

QSS isn't the same mechanic.

I said Sivir and Nocturne, not Olaf and Gangplank.

The Yetii RiderMar 3, 20161 votes

In addition to the aforementioned QSS, we have Mikael's Crucible. So yeah, CC removal is in this game for days.

KillerKellMar 4, 20161 votes

And then the Shields, like Face of the Mountain and Locket of the Iron Solari.

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

And again, an HP shield is not a spell shield, just as Sivir's E isn't an HP shield.

KillerKellMar 4, 20161 votes

Just saying, tons of way to remove damages, to remove CC, or both.

What difference does it make if it negates the spell, or if it negates the Damage and CC of the spell?

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

Yes, yes it is.

I'm not saying CC removal. I'm saying a spell shield.

AckelopeMar 4, 20161 votes

Accidentally read the title as "spellblade" which makes me think an active item that applied stuff on your spells and/or aa's when triggered would be cool. oh wait, that's muramana, right?

KillerKellMar 4, 20161 votes

Mercurial Scimitar, Banshee's Veil, Mikeal's Crucible, Locket of the Iron Solari, Face of the Mountain, Sterek's Gage, Maw of Malmortious.

Cleanse, Barrier.

I'm sure I'm forgetting some others as well.

Plenty of Items and Summoner's in the game, and enough Champions as well.

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

I didn't say CC removal. I said Spell Shield.

You're confusing Olaf and Gangplank for Nocturne and Sivir.

KillerKellMar 4, 20161 votes

If it negates the Damage of the Spell and the Spell's Impact... might as well be a Spell Shield.

So combining your Cleanse (removes the CC) with your FotM (negate Damage up to X)... is pretty much a Spell Shield.

Popping your Scimitar while tossing up your Barrier... pretty much a Spell Shield.

And Banshee's... IS a Spell Shield. So having that WITH the other items...

So what I'm saying is you are asking for something that isn't remotely close to being needed. You have more than enough tools now. Use them.

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

Just... re-read what you said. You just said that two items, one of which being a support item, are required to partially do what I'm asking.

You're pretending something isn't needed, despite having such a weak defense. You suggested an entire tank support build, and the only champion who could possibly pull that off and do it for their allies is Morgana, who would lose all her damage in the process.

It's necessary, you're just not experienced enough to see why.

KillerKellMar 4, 20162 votes

No, it's not necessary.

The item would be to strong, to have a Banshee's on command.

Which is the point, and why the item you want doesn't exist.

And I didn't suggest an entire support build, I said from the list of items I gave you can find the right combination for the right situation. Well, apparently YOU can't... but others certainly do.

What you want is an on command get out of free card... but that's not going to fix your poor positioning or you lack of warding that is getting you caught to the point that you NEED a Banshee's on Command.

I haven't heard a single Pro Player say this item you described is 'necessary', or even ask for an item like this... and they seem to get along just fine.

So I ask... WHY is it needed?

Simplest answer... it isn't.

And so you know, I've been playing since Pre-Season 4... you've been playing since Season 4 (possibly Pre-Season)... to which I have a crap ton more games and hours invested. But please, tell me how you are 'more experienced' than I am that it tells you such an item is needed.

You have 37 Ranked Games since Season 4. I have over 100 Ranked Games on Multiple Champions, and over 200 on at least one (Leona). Not sure where I don't 'have the experience' to know this Item is needed or not. And all those Pros who've been playing way longer than either of us... guess they don't have the 'experience' to know your item is needed either.

What you want is a cop out, a get out of jail free card. One shouldn't exist, especially with Cleanse, QSS and Banshee's already in the game.

The EcdysiastMar 4, 20161 votes

"To have a Banshee's on command."

I didn't say anything about it being a tank MR item.

And that's not overpowered on Nocturn or Sivir. The window is only 1.5 seconds.

Savage DeviMar 4, 20161 votes

And that's not overpowered on Nocturn or Sivir. The window is only 1.5 seconds.

That's because their kits are built around that. Udyr's isn't.

KillerKellMar 4, 20161 votes

Exactly.

But hey, we don't have 'enough experience' to know how wrong we are and how badly this is needed!

DesideriumMar 4, 20161 votes

Yeah let's just make Nocturne even less special.

EcchiOtakuTMMar 4, 20161 votes

Banshee's is enough they just need to give it 10% cdr so it can be on par with visage.

And reduce CD by 10 seconds since they removed it's CD lowering in combat....

If those 2 things are done to banshee it would be much better then having an active spell shield item because it's CD would be ridiculous or retardedly broken. Cause old banshee was just way too strong until they nerfed it all 4-5 players on a team would buy it.