http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1579176
and now, for some reasons you give us a 10% refund for all the runes that are being removed
but it's okay, because league has new players now since then, and those new players wil white knight every single action you do.
DariusDemiurge72 votesThey needed us back then, and they had a soul.
Now they are loved by little chump boys with e-sports dreams waving thier tsm and skt signs buying 300 dollars worth of capsules for a crappy sivir chroma.
Penns28 votesI mean.. we still get free stuff with hextech crafting, free new runes, even more free stuff with unlimited leveling and stuff like that.
Dodge runes were just one type of rune (and.. did anyone even use them?), 100% refunding ALL runes would be a huge loss tbh.
iamthegoatofwar13 votesDude junglers in particular used dodge runes for quite some time.
Khristophoros3 votesI mean.. we still get free stuff with hextech crafting, make free runes, give us even more free stuff with unlimited leveling and stuff like that.
Dodge runes were just one type of rune (and.. did anyone even use them?), 100% refunding ALL runes would be a huge loss tbh.
Yes they were the most popular seal especially at high elo and combined with the nimbleness mastery (+10% MS whenever you dodge an attack) they were degenerate af. they got removed because they made the game worse.
NiceTryVi5 votesHow would it be a loss? nobody paid for runes, they were IP only.
Velzard of Koz12 votesSome people have the logic that we cannot complain because it's not real money so wanting it back is entitlement but Riot would still bancrupt If they gave away back the virtual currency, while it would only reduce amount of champs bought by RP, which still would be dumb excuse in game that is Free to Play, as they like to point out.
NiceTryVi4 votesI'm sorry, what? riot gets their money off skins, champions go on sale so regularly, there is no way that is where they regularly get their money, plus skins come out way more often than champions.
Velzard of Koz4 votesWell it's not my logic, but some people like to act like it would make Riot go bancrupt.
NiceTryVi3 votesI didn't mean to imply it was, sorry if I did. Just. How man, I don't get it. [slayer-jinx-unamused]
NineTailedMystic4 votesI just don't know why people are making such a big deal out of it. Like, who fucking cares?
NiceTryVi5 votesI mean, id like my 60k IP back if runes are gonna be deleted and replaced. That's like if my school was like "were not gonna have classes anymore, ever, and your credits are no longer good. However from now on, everyone gets a diploma in their field of choice from here on out! BTW, here's 15% of the money you paid us back."
Like no, I have paid $80k, i want my $80k back. Ive spent what I calculate to be about 60k into runes, and I want the 60k back if the runes are being deleted. I don't want lust 9k back, that's pitiful. And yes, I know its not real money, but it is time, which i could have used to get IP to buy champions i wanted instead of runes.
NineTailedMystic1 votesI bought a lot of runes and I just honestly don't care. I'll make back the IP.
NiceTryVi2 votesThat's nice. But as you can see, most of us want our investment back now that its going to be made worthless
GayFluffyUnicorn3 votesIsn't it completely irrelevant WHY rp are bought? It's not like you directly pay X amount of money for a champ only. You buy rp for 20 bucks and then it's up to you anyways for what you use it so i never understood the logic of money lost because people buy champs with IP then instead of RP. Can't remember ever using RP for champs but sure as hell for skins and RUNEPAGES WHICH I LOSE NOW.
Búbblegum26 votesThey are reworking runes* not removing them.
When they removed dodge runes it made sense, they weren't replacing them with something else that is FREE, so obviously they gave you a full refund.
Now people like you need to stop making useless threads about this and deal with it.
Ahristocats23 votesi see you're new here, so i will explain to you
they removed dodge runes and gave us the IP back because we SPENT IP on them the new rune system might be free, but since it's free it doesn't mean they don't have to refund the ip, else it means we payed the new system with our old IP spent on old runes
this is not what free means, if the new system is free they have to give us what we paid on the old system.
it's like you pay a computer, the company who sold it tells you "hey we're going to make computers free for everyone, and if someone paid a computer before we won't give the money back because it's free now" new people will get free computers, while old people will be screwed because they already paid
Salson4 votesI take it you never experienced the joys of communism.
KuroCaliber7 votesActually, when you pay for something on league it's a rental. You are paying riot to use their product for as long as it exists. Runes in their current state will no longer exist, and this "refund" is just a consolation prize.
Iota Theta8 votes[{quoted}](name=i am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LIN5LdIs,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2017-09-02T13:57:02.377+0000)
i see you're new here, so i will explain to you
they removed dodge runes and gave us the IP back because we SPENT IP on them the new rune system might be free, but since it's free it doesn't mean they don't have to refund the ip, else it means we payed the new system with our old IP spent on old runes
this is not what free means, if the new system is free they have to give us what we paid on the old system.
it's like you pay a computer, the company who sold it tells you "hey we're going to make computers free for everyone, and if someone paid a computer before we won't give the money back because it's free now" new people will get free computers, while old people will be screwed because they already paid
Actually, no they don't.
And that scenario is a valid scenario. You paid for it at the time, the merchant decided it should be free after the fact. It's up to them in that instance if they refund you or not. The merchant abided by the agreement at that time, and they have no obligation once the transaction is completed. Yeah it may suck, but that's how it works for that.
Ahristocats10 votesi didn't say the merchant has obligations but if riot cares about their old players then yes they do
Iota Theta8 votesSo first you say they don't, then you say they do if they care about old players. They can care about players and not be obligated to a full refund, especially when said players made full use of the runes the purchased.
Lets not forget that they're also releasing the BE sale shop and selling a bunch of RP items for BE.
UnboundHades4 votesWhich you need a stockpile for which most people have in runes that are now worth shit
The steam life4 votesNo because you payed for an advantage in the game for over 5 years i assume, as you know about dodge runes and basically what youre asking is for that advantage to be free of charge because you only got to use it for 5 years. Idk why you think youre entitled to a full refund when you got something in return for your payment. Even then they are giving you a higher than 10% refund because its a different system which is pretty fair so just suck it up.
Ahristocats16 votesWHAT THE FUCK IS THAT ARGUMENT
yeah i used the runes for 5 years and? if they become FREE FOR EVERYONE then i'm losing what i paid for before why is it so hard to understand
UnboundHades10 votesBecause they are new and they are getting free stuff while we get fucked over
Velzard of Koz6 votesNo because you payed for an advantage in the game for over 5 years i assume
Advantage? What advantage is system you must use to even have chance. People act as If it was easy for average player to play runeless.
ModAcademy Kayn3 votesThat example about computers, that's an actual business thing. You buy to be able to use that computer first, to be ahead of the game. 4 years later, it becomes free, but that's 4 years of usage you got before anyone else. It's the buying of convenience.
CudyDarkyz3 votesYa but the computer makers don't come into your house and take it back after those 4 years.
ModAcademy Kayn2 votesAnd then give you a completely new computer that's up to date.
ChaoticPinecone2 votesHow many runes do you have? Cause I've noticed that the people who dont give a damn are usually the ones with a small number of runes.
And giving a full refund (or half, not this 15-30% thing they have on now) doesnt hurt you in any way. Are you really that sour that you cant want nice things for others?
And the thread isnt useless. This thread tells Riot that players arent happy with their decision.
King of Demons13 votesYou take it out of context just to shit on them, which isn't very fair either.
This system is supposed to fix the isisue of having too much IP. Guess what happens if we got 100% of IP back
Considering all this IP spent will never have to be spent on runes again, this is a massive gain and not a loss at all.
Ahristocats27 votesWHAT DO YOU MEAN I TAKE IT OUT OF CONTEXT???
dodge runes were straight out removed from the game and they used to cost 820 ip, and riot gave us a full refund of them
the entire rune system is removed, and we get 10% refund? nice joke, i like it.
[{quoted}](name=Taku of Rivia,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LIN5LdIs,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-09-02T10:06:16.568+0000)
This system is supposed to fix the isisue of having too much IP. Guess what happens if we got 100% of IP back
i don't care, i will use those IP to rename as much as i want, buy new champ, buy rune pages (that are still here)
King of Demons7 votes[{quoted}](name=i am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LIN5LdIs,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2017-09-02T10:08:21.516+0000)
WHAT DO YOU MEAN I TAKE IT OUT OF CONTEXT???
dodge runes were straight out removed from the game and they used to cost 820 ip, and riot gave us a full refund of them
the entire rune system is removed, and we get 10% refund? nice joke, i like it.
i don't care, i will use those IP to rename as much as i want, buy new champ, buy rune pages (that are still here)
Back in the day there weren't any people with a million IP. Riot has changed a lot since then. The game has changed a lot since then. And yes, you are taking it out of context. Dodge runes have never been replaced by anything.
But whatever. People will give you upvotes because you complain about not getting enough free shit while downvoting everybody with half a brain for disagreeing with that. Enjoy your circlejerk. Peace
Ahristocats17 votes[{quoted}](name=Taku of Rivia,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LIN5LdIs,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2017-09-02T10:11:37.930+0000)
Back in the day there weren't any people with a million IP.
how much people with a billion of ip do you think there are here? HOW MUCH? if we complain about 10% refund it's because we DO NOT HAVE IP, i myself have little ip because there are so much to buy and i don't spend RP on this fcking game except if there is a skin that i like (which is rare) i use 13900 ip to rename every month, i have to buy rune pages with ip because i don't want to spend RP, and new champs on release cost 7900 ip
stop fcking lying about billion of ip, those who have this are an extreme minority everyone else spent their life to buy runes and rune pages AND buying champions with ip because they don't want to spend rp
King of Demons6 votes[{quoted}](name=i am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LIN5LdIs,comment-id=0000000100000000,timestamp=2017-09-02T10:15:04.417+0000)
how much people with a billion of ip do you think there are here? HOW MUCH? if we complain about 10% refund it's because we DO NOT HAVE IP, i myself have little ip because there are so much to buy and i don't spend RP on this fcking game except if there is a skin that i like (which is rare) i use 13900 ip to rename every month, i have to buy rune pages with ip because i don't want to spend RP, and new champs on release cost 7900 ip
stop fcking lying about billion of ip, those who have this are an extreme minority everyone else spent their life to buy runes and rune pages AND buying champions with ip because they don't want to spend rp
WHAT DO YOU EVEN WANT TO BUY WITH THE BLUE ESSENCE?
Champions? You'll be able to afford those or get more free ones from chests you get with the new system.
Is it becasue you won't get the Urfwick skin? Tough shit. Not many are going to get that one
And I am sorry, but there are far more veteran players than you realize. Personally I have over 20 friends who have way too much IP and it's safe to assume that I am not the only one like that.
You're conveniently forgetting that there is no way of spending blue essence outside of champions left once that limited sale has ended. That is until they introduce something else you can do with it with this insane IP sink completely gone. That in itself is a huge gain. I repeat: You will never have to spend anything to get the full benefit and possibility of the new system while runes were sitting behind a paywall.
GigglesO19 votes[{quoted}](name=Taku of Rivia,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LIN5LdIs,comment-id=00000001000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-02T10:25:02.140+0000)
I repeat: You will never have to spend anything to get the full benefit and possibility of the new system while runes were sitting behind a paywall.
You act as if it hasn't always been a paywall... You either pay RP or you pay in time...
Malchior Dagon4 votesWhy would you possibly want to rename once a month...?
TyrekGoldenspear13 votesbut it's okay, because league has new players now since then, and those new players wil white knight every single action you do.
What a wonderful and insightful way to shut down counterargument. /s
Karfuss7 votesBut not a necessarily incorrect one.
Anyone that started in Season 7's pre-season stands to benefit and those that party invested or didn't invest at all benefit, why would they necessarily care?
That seems the source of this contrarianism shenanigans. It is unemphatic, rather than any meaningful counter argument.
r4ndomkill1 votesthe thing is is that the people arguing for refunds are the people who dont need the ip because the literally biggest and most bullshit reason for needing ip(runes) is going away and getting replaced with "better" ones, so if they gave full refunds to a veteran who doesn't get skins then they could buy almost every champ as soon as they come out and they wouldent make any money.
Karfuss5 votesVeterans can do that anyway. I bought Kayn and Ornn off the bat.
I'll probably be able to buy URFwick, that free gemstone and more with my IP stockpile and the refund as it is right now. The difference is that I still understand the shafting this represents, and am empathetic to those who this will most hurt.
DrCyanide6 votesThey gave you a full refund so you could dump it back into the same Rune system, which still cost IP to play.
They're giving you more IP than those Runes would be worth in the new Rune system.
What's the value of a rune that gives +0.91 armor in a system where runes of the same tier can reduce your Ultimate CD by over 50%? It's absolutely worthless in such a system. 100 IP for it is about right.
You spent IP in the IP sink, and you're complaining that the IP sink isn't returning the same amount back. It's a "sink", not a "bank". It's suppose to move IP out of circulation.
RainbowIcee4 votesYou make a bad argument do you know why? runes are staple in the game atm. Even if you decide to wait until the new system is release you'll feel every match the pressure of needing and not having runes. Runes are a requirement in the game that's the problem, it wasn't just some benefit you can't even effectively jungle without runes unless you're nunu. And let's not even get to trades in lane's or pushing with no runes. I get what you're saying that we at least get something out of it but you're entirely ignoring the fact that we were basically forced into it and it's also a very low value. 10% is pretty damn low for what some people spend, lastly some players spend RP and a ton of ip on rune pages there are just thing not being accounted for here. Should we all get mad and rage? no but i reckong there's people that have good motives and reason for doing so if you are to remove something that cost time at least give a reasonable compensation for it. Especially when it was practically forced on because the game was balanced around them.
Cryptocurrency5 votesRunes shouldn't have been behind a grindwall in the first place. That felt like pay to win for me since you needed to buy the runes to be competetive and had nothing to buy champions.
Buttèred Biscuit4 votesBeen playing League since Vel'koz release and I'll white knight this action, because Riot could have been "Fuck you guys you get no compensation for all that hard earned IP you spent on Runes, just suck it up and enjoy this new way of playing League". People who have been playing since Season 1 have gotten the full use and value out of their Runes, while new players, who either joined the beginning of this year, or are joining now won't be able to get the full value of playing with runes. The reason behind those guys getting full refunds on said runes.
ForFoxSakes6 votesNo they cant and wont do that because they will guarantee outrage a lot of players who may quit and thats the last thing they want players to do
Now with the shitty compensation they'll just outrage less. Most people arent even asking for a full refund, just a % return so the super high cost runes that cost nearly a champ to get a single one arent grouped with the ultra cheap ones
Blakiepug3 votesAs a player who doesn't even own that many runes myself, I entirely agree that more of a refund should be offered. I know some players genuinely enjoyed experimenting with runes, but for me I only ever bought runes because I knew that not having any runes at all simply put me at a disadvantage in all of my matches. I didn't buy runes because I was excited about them, I bought them because I felt like I had to. And now that they are going away I can only imagine how bad someone who owned every single rune before this season must feel with how small the IP return is currently slated to be.
Daddy Braum3 votesGoing through these comments and realizing a lot of people either haven't played that long or just never bought a lot of runes I want a full refund because its a lot of time just thrown away when we only get a portion of them back
Rozzeta3 votesAt that point, it was 9 runes at most per player. Now it's entire pages. Some people might as well purchase 10 6300 champions if they got full refund. So, from a business perspective, they cannot give full refund.
They could have made a system to exchange old runes for new ones, avoiding this situation and keeping dissatisfaction to a minimum; but that'd cost additional resources, and Riot is greedy as fuck to allocate resources to anything other than moneymakers.
All we can do now is hope that, at least, a new full runepage will cost 10% of an old runepage.
Glory ln Death3 votes[{quoted}](name=i am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LIN5LdIs,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-09-02T10:04:25.201+0000)
and now, for some reasons you give us a
10%[12-100%] refund for all the runes that are being removed
Just to add a bit of accuracy to your post. 100 IP for marks, seals, and glyphs is between a 12% and 100% refund, based on the various prices. 300 IP for quintessences is between a 15% and 58% refund.
Is it a bit low? Yeah. Is it 10%? No.
However, your analogy with Dodge runes isn't quite applicable here. Dodge runes were fully refunded largely because they were being completely removed with no replacement of any form. With the Runes Reforged update, everything from the original runes is being replaced by new runes, stat changes for champions, or new starting items. They aren't just disappearing.
That being said, I do agree that the refund could stand to be increased a bit. That, or the prices in the BE store lowered.