Just because something is a skillshot that doesn't mean...

Kowe The Ewok··2 votes·499 views

...it has proper counterplay... Especially with the current "making stuff skillshots" I think this is an important topic.

The best example is Lee Sin's Q. The projectile is incredibly fast you can try to juke it, but re-active dodging (without using Flash) is close to impossible.

Riot always praises "how much counterplay" Lee offers (or Zed...), completely ignoring that just because something is a skillshot doesn't mean it has proper counterplay.

Take Zyra, or (hot topic:) Veigar as an example: Immobile champions with low movementspeed. Active dodging of projectiles as fast as Lee's Q is basically impossible.

Quit saying "It's a skillshot so by definition it has counterplay". That's true for abilities like Zyra E with low travel time, or Jinx W with a delay - but Lee and Zed are a whole different topic. (Especially sicne the mobility in their kit allows jumping to point blanc range to use it)

3 Comments

Schteltzer2 votes

qq

NorthernDruid1 votes

There's better counterplay in decisionmaking IMO, because it's in decisionmaking where you find the real play.

Ryze for instance, is a champion with low counterplay, not because you can't dodge his abilities, but because there's no decisions in his play pattern. There's no interesting choices to make in combat, outside when you use your ult (mostly you just tag it to extend your combo), which they could easily add by making his E a skillshot which needs to not only hit but hit well if you want your full damage output, and then make sure it's worth missing a Q in order to E right after your W instead of sneaking in a Q first.

But i suppose it's easier to skillshotify half his combo while ruining his only farming ability.

Karlyr1 votes

Implying clicking 2 buttons to kill an ennemy APC had any counterplay AT ALL.

Having a Q which is a skill shot allows either a flash, either a walk dodge, either standing behind creeps. And if you can't dodge a Lee Sin Q, either you have a bad ping (REALLY BAD PING) because I can do it with 110ms, either I have bad news for you.

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