Honestly, patch 5.16 was the biggest "Fuck You" riot could've done to Nasus

HateDaddy··23 votes·2,131 views

His winrate saw an immediate drop by 4% from 51% to 47% in 5.16 alone, it went down to 46% in 5.17 but that was likely due to his Qs bug.

5.16 saw a huge buff to the fighter class and as not only just a Nasus main but a fighter player in general, I was ecstatic about this. Finally, after 3 freaking years, the class of fighters can finally be viable again. But in that same sense, as a Nasus main, I realized what this meant.

Fighters are traditionally very good against Nasus because they can beat him down pretty hard in lane and then snowball while he's trying to catch back up. Is this a problem overall? Yes and no, but mostly no. The few problems I have with this are that Nasus wasn't compensated for the frozen heart nerfs like other true tanks were, when quite frankly, as a champion with no innate defensive steroids, could've probably used it over all of them. And the other part is Nasus has lost his role.

Nasus is a mid game champ but he was also one of the few bruisers who could be very threatening late game if he got farmed enough, not to mention he's fairly versatile since he's more than just a dive bot. He's good at anti-tanking front lines because of his E and ults %HP burn, he's average at peel but again very good anti-tank mechanics for his carry. He was a massive split push force to be reckoned with. He had his uses and he had his roles, and that was fine. But that's all been nerfed one way or another or now, with new items and direct kit changes, juggernauts are doing it way better.

When top lane was full of tanks who could perform well with farm, Nasus has no issues with this. They couldn't threaten him in lane and he was more relevant than they were mid game where he'd be just as tabky but do way more damage. Late game tanks were better because they could peel him easier, were much tankier and and offered more utility. At this point Nasus would split push, that's how he remained relevant when he couldn't really teamfight anymore. He had his roles and uses, never much of a thing in competitive but good enough in solo queue.

But now? He doesn't have a role anymore. He can't lane against bruisers. He is outperformed by them both mid game and late game. Even if he manages to farm or get ahead, it likey comes at the expense of a Jungler living in his lane to help him - why take that risk when you can just play olaf? Jax? Darius? Fiora? Gangplank? Garen? Renekton? They all have items now, they're all allowed to scale now. And that's great, I'm so fucking happy about that, honestly I truly am.

But this is where Nasus' set of heavy nerfs from s3 and s4 are finally catching up to him. You gave these bruisers scaling, you gave them the ability to do more in teamfights than just damage soak. You gave Darius heals to stay alive longer for resets. You gave Garen a mechanic that allows him to fuck something up with almost no damage items. You have gangplank consistency, more depth and more impact. You gave Fiora utility and the ability to defend herself in a fight instead of being an R bot. You gave older bruisers items that allowed them to scale and offer utility or prolong their lives in fights to do more damage. None of this helped Nasus because these items aren't good on him (aside from plate and steraks) or these champions greatly outperform him with it.

In season 3, you nerfed his AS slow - that nerf was needed, it should never be reverted. 95% AS slow is retarded. But you nerfed his sustain, at the time I agreed with it. Dorans shield and LS quints were absurd and Nasus was abusing this in combination with his passive. But you nerfed d-shield. You nerfed LS quints, but you never compensated him for that. At the time it was fine though, you didn't need to. It balanced him. But then you nerfed the range on his wither while releasing 50 more absurdly mobile champs with impassable terrain, hard CC, the whole 9 yards. At the time it was fine, Nasus was the only thing that could be that durable late game while doing that much fucking damage. It balanced him. Since then? There are way better options for picking something to dive carries, they're sticking power is better. There are way safer and better bruisers who will be just as durable and just as strong late game and much more consistent.

See the thing is, last time Nasus was truly bad kinda like he is now, it was season 2. But back then if you managed to get farmed on him, it was fucking GG. The game was simpler, his strengths were made for late game and he had his weaknesses. But since then you've done nothing but take away his strengths and never compensate him for it. There's no reason to play him now, you would be stupid to do so honestly unless it was just love for the champ. He doesn't do much when he gets farmed because others do it better. Why take the risk of playing him now? He's been hit so hard directly and indirectly and 5.16 has finally made it all go full circle with how pointless it has made it to play him since he's been nerfed so hard with zero compensation since any of those buffs but a measly 25 range on Q that bugged him for a whole fucking patch and feels clunky as fuck.

I know the idea of nasus buffs aren't popular on here but I'm telling you now, in a few patches he's going to be considered the worst champion in the game again. I didn't think it would be this bad because I didn't realize how good bruisers would actually end up being and I don't want bruiser nerfs to be stacked on them, it's about damn time they're good. But Nasus needs some of his strengths back that you've stripped him of and never given back while indirectly only shitting on him harder and harder with each patch.

Thanks for the read, that's all I got

35 Comments

Critmaster Garen3 votes

ok. i think what people dont really understand is that bugs on a champion can largely affect his winrate.

what really fucked him up was the q bug that came with the patch imo. i stopped playing him after it absolutely screwed up a game for me. and riot didnt really adress it. theyre not disabling him, nor do i see anything in the patchnotes. so most people who play him dont even KNOW about it until it happens.

considering that the reworked champs are almost always banned, i dont think theyre more of a problem than his fucking bugged q. hes still a strong counterpick to auto attack based champions like irelia, and should actually be strong in a meta where vayne dominates.

if you dont know what im talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddC96ztrmxQ

Gostreiver2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KQ65ypJi,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-09-17T04:42:38.659+0000)

ok. i think what people dont really understand is that bugs on a champion can largely affect his winrate.

what really fucked him up was the q bug that came with the patch imo. i stopped playing him after it absolutely screwed up a game for me. and riot didnt really adress it. theyre not disabling him, nor do i see anything in the patchnotes. so most people who play him dont even KNOW about it until it happens.

considering that the reworked champs are almost always banned, i dont think theyre more of a problem than his fucking bugged q. hes still a strong counterpick to auto attack based champions like irelia, and should actually be strong in a meta where vayne dominates.

if you dont know what im talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddC96ztrmxQ

Sirhcez is the coolest. And this is unacceptable.

Critmaster Garen3 votes

tldr, nasus should be disabled, until its fixed. its gamebreaking for him and probably most of the reason why his winrate so drastically dropped. this shit happens in a teamfight, it can and will lose you the game.

HateDaddy2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KQ65ypJi,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-09-17T04:44:21.163+0000)

tldr, nasus should be disabled, until its fixed. its gamebreaking for him and probably most of the reason why his winrate so drastically dropped.

It was fixed in 5.18 apparently but his winrate dropped in 5.16 alone from 51% to 48% and it's going to likely continue to go down. Even still, that's just a small element of my argument to consider. At the end of the day, when it boils down to it, there really is no reason to play Nasus anymore. His job is done better by everything else and at best, you get a champion that can be an annoying split-pusher late game.

Critmaster Garen2 votes

{quoted}

It was fixed in 5.18 apparently but his winrate dropped in 5.16 alone from 51% to 48% and it's going to likely continue to go down. Even still, that's just a small element of my argument to consider. At the end of the day, when it boils down to it, there really is no reason to play Nasus anymore. His job is done better by everything else and at best, you get a champion that can be an annoying split-pusher late game.

the statistics for 5.18 arent in yet. if its fixed (i havent seen any mention of it), we have to wait and see how it changes his winrate. i expect it to have an overall rather significant impact.

HateDaddy2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KQ65ypJi,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2015-09-17T04:51:04.538+0000)

the statistics for 5.18 arent in yet. if its fixed (i havent seen any mention of it), we have to wait and see how it changes his winrate. i expect it to have an overall rather significant impact.

No it was fixed, a rioter confirmed it in Report a Bug.

Critmaster Garen2 votes

{quoted}

No it was fixed, a rioter confirmed it in Report a Bug.

but the actual winrates for this patch cycle arent in yet. pretty much all the sites take at least 3 days to collect data.

you can see on championgg that youre supposed to check back in 3 days. and lolkings statistics end 3 days ago. they havent updated yet either. all im saying is, wait and see how the bugfix is going to affect him. because that bug really screwed him up.

otherwsie they havent forgotten about nasus. i mean he did get a buff with the update and they probably wanted to see how the item changes affect him. theyre not only beneficial to the reworked champions.

titanic hydra, and steraks with a triforce can actually be quite nasty on him and increase his q damage by a lot. the hydra active can easily hit for 500 damage lategame. add that to a nasus q on a squishy and you have a recipe for 1 shots.

if he needs futher buffs, he should get them imo.

HateDaddy2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KQ65ypJi,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-17T05:03:37.786+0000)

but the actual winrates for this patch cycle arent in yet. pretty much all the sites take at least 3 days to collect data.

you can see on championgg that youre supposed to check back in 3 days. and lolkings statistics end 3 days ago. they havent updated yet either. all im saying is, wait and see how the bugfix is going to affect him. because that bug really screwed him up.

otherwsie they havent forgotten about nasus. i mean he did get a buff with the update and they probably wanted to see how the item changes affect him. theyre not only beneficial to the reworked champions.

titanic hydra, and steraks with a triforce can actually be quite nasty on him and increase his q damage by a lot. the hydra active can easily hit for 500 damage lategame. add that to a nasus q on a squishy and you have a recipe for 1 shots.

if he needs futher buffs, he should get them imo.

I'm not disagreeing with any of this, my point is there are now several champions who do this much better, much more reliably while being way safer. There's no point in playing Nasus, at best you become a split-pusher.

LadyRenly1 votes

We've already got Riven and Corki disabled, what is another champ, really

HateDaddy2 votes

{quoted}

We've already got Riven and Corki disabled, what is another champ, really

no you misunderstand, his Q is fixed now.

BeMyFriendPlease3 votes

Did you say compensation? Inb4 riot nerfs his ult and makes his q a skillshot.

Then they will declare nasus has been "compensated"

Veigar

AtheosisX1 votes

His win rate tanked because of the bug on q, not the Juggernauts.

HateDaddy2 votes

{quoted}

His win rate tanked because of the bug on q, not the Juggernauts.

his winrate went down by 3% alone from 5.15-5.16, the bug on Q wasn't until 5.17

AtheosisX1 votes

{quoted}

his winrate went down by 3% alone from 5.15-5.16, the bug on Q wasn't until 5.17

No, it was 5.16.

HateDaddy2 votes

{quoted}

No, it was 5.16.

P sure I don't recall having that issue with him at all in 5.16

Black Vomit1 votes

He lost his power spike with the nerf to his core items......... -.-

SouL1ess1 votes

Welcome to any MOBA game

Where the patch cycles ensures that someone will always be better than you at your pre-determined job!

. . .

Although this is just significantly more true in League because champions are largely similar to each other.

BluePolarizer1 votes

Nasus has the problem of being in a mobility creep meta as an immobile melee.

Back in season 2/3, the game was not as mobile so if Nasus got big, he'd win easily since you couldn't escape him. Now, slows are pretty much not CC since everyone has them and everyone except Nasus has a dash or slow removal.

Cowgirl Ed1 votes

Nasus is not a tank, stop treating him like that. Building him as a tank doesn't mean he is a tank

also the bug is just pathetic and it still isn't fixed

The Bíg Ticket1 votes

Well I agree with everything you said. There really is no reason at all to pick Nasus at the moment unless you wanna have a rough time. Basically every change hurt him, only thing that got buffed for him was Spirit Visage which he can rush vs MR matchups but thats only 5 MR.
He is still a better pick than Jax though.

Ant Reformed1 votes

Riot could give him a small ms buff (5) and then increase his scaling armor.

HateDaddy2 votes

{quoted}

Riot could give him a small ms buff (5) and then increase his scaling armor.

He already has one of the highest base movement speeds of any champion in the game, behind pantheon, Yi and Talon if I'm not mistaken. I wouldn't mind a buff to his scaling armor but I suspect he will need more.

Ant Reformed1 votes

[deleted]

HateDaddy2 votes

{quoted}

I think a ms buff would be nice, with other items you can be pretty mobile

Okay but let's think about that for a second my friend: why go to all this trouble when you could just pick any other bruiser and not be completely dependent on farm and weak early? And while Trinity, plate and Steraks give his teamfight presence something more than he's had in recent years, he's still heavily outperformed by bruisers now because they have mechanics to make their kits work whereas the mechanics Nasus had have been nerfed into the ground, some of which were needed but others not so much.

I made a thread a long time ago requesting a few changes to Nasus because his gameplay can be pretty frustrating to fight, especially chain withering. I basically said make withers Cooldown not scale down with levels, change its flat cooldown to 13-14 seconds and with 40% CDR, wither has roughly an 8-9 second cooldown. In exchange, give its 700 range back, have it grant him a percentage of the movement speed he slows and reduce its mana cost to 70 at all ranks. This would be a huge buff to his teamfight, make his frustrating mechanic of chain withering dead and make him more consistent overall. I would honestly like to see some sort of armor compensation too because quite frankly, even though he's not a true tank, frozen heart was his best item. I don't know if buffing his sustain is a good idea but he has had so many indirect and direct nerfs and they've now caught up with him.

Mongoose1 votes

i see no issue

KONO RUBICK DA1 votes

Nasus isn't a late game hero, he can't even touch people after 40 min and get killed in 4 seconds, additionally armor reduce so much his damage

Carnarius1 votes

well, i agree on most of this, nasus has been put in unreasonably bad spot which makes it pretty much pointless to pick him anymore. there is almost no reward for doing good with him, as you lost your ability to 1v2 after so many indirect nerfs. even 1v1 starts to be problematic, as it makes you absolutely impossible to split push, which was his main role till now. he needs wither tweaks and changes in itemization (better tank items), to become at least viable

refering to armor items, i don't understand why penetration even exists in this game, as it makes building armor and magic resist pointless. multiply it with fact that there are insanely powerful ad/ap items, and there we go

imagine if there was pure defensive version on (in my opinion) broken black cleaver:

cost 3k +400 hp +60 armor +20% cdr +every time you take physical damage, your armor is increased by 5% for 6 seconds, stacking up to 6 times +every time you take damage, you gain 20 movement speed for 2 seconds

this item would be gutted into oblivion. but the ad version is perfectly fine, right?

HateDaddy1 votes

{quoted}

well, i agree on most of this, nasus has been put in unreasonably bad spot which makes it pretty much pointless to pick him anymore. there is almost no reward for doing good with him, as you lost your ability to 1v2 after so many indirect nerfs. even 1v1 starts to be problematic, as it makes you absolutely impossible to split push, which was his main role till now. he needs wither tweaks and changes in itemization (better tank items), to become at least viable

refering to armor items, i don't understand why penetration even exists in this game, as it makes building armor and magic resist pointless. multiply it with fact that there are insanely powerful ad/ap items, and there we go

imagine if there was pure defensive version on (in my opinion) broken black cleaver:

cost 3k +400 hp +60 armor +20% cdr +every time you take physical damage, your armor is increased by 5% for 6 seconds, stacking up to 6 times +every time you take damage, you gain 20 movement speed for 2 seconds

this item would be gutted into oblivion. but the ad version is perfectly fine, right?

Because there's a difference between tanks and bruisers, who rely less on durability than tanks do. Riot doesn't wank tanks to be dependent on tank itemization, if they are, one of two things are the case: tanks are underpowered or tank itemization is overpowered, likely the latter. This is why riot buffed several tanks over the last two years to be more innately durable and less dependent upon items.

Nasus isn't a tank but he depends on items like spirit visage, which the buff to that was awesome and frozen heart, the nerf to that hurt him more than it did real tanks because they don't care much about the loss in value of the item. Tanks can be tanky and that's fine but armor pen and Magic pen does need to exist. Now, do the values need to be so high? That's kinda a different discussion altogether but tank items are fine for tanks, for champions like Nasus they're even good. I just don't think its unreasonable for Nasus to not get compensated for the nerf to FH

Carnarius1 votes

that's why it makes no sense, there are strong bruisers and weak bruisers as well as strong tanks and weak tanks, it's all depend on their itemization. they should have made items more specialized, like some items only buyable by champs with no mobility, some for champs with mobility, some for ranged champs. without this, having a balance is impossible, there will be better kits and worse kits, as it is now

Blkninjar871 votes

They should make his w steal pplz move and attack speed instead of just slow them... Also devourer master yi shits ionn nasus.

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

One less cancer yay Anyway there's barely a champion that can beat nasus in lane,only deny him farming

Ant Reformed1 votes

Maybe they should nerf Nash's because of steraks and deadmans

Maximum Morde1 votes

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