Lucian Mid just solo killed Faker a few times, is he, or his build, nerf worthy yet?

JavelinJoe·May 15, 2017·18 votes·3,790 views

Lucian has been a pain for a very long time. Near unmatchable trading with his passive, ability to abuse item passives, built in escape, wave clear, poke, etc. Now he is taking over more than just the bot lane. Even SKT, the arguably (and statistically if we go off of worlds wins) best players in the world, could not handle it.

Lucian needs a bit of a nerf so he is not almost universally dominant and extremely likely to come out ahead and snowball out of control.

35 Comments

GrievousFetusMay 15, 201711 votes

Have you considered the Lucian player may have simply outplayed him or could be better than him?

FYI Faker's soloQ performance is substandard compared to his LCK and other Esports performance, remember last worlds? A lot of his strength lies outside of lane phase and his jungler dedicates a lot of attention to his lane when he plays as a 5-man team.

Zane ZephyrMay 15, 20171 votes

Xiye got two kills at 4 minutes in and then snowballed from there. turret dove faker shortly after that and solo killed him again later on

JavelinJoeMay 15, 20172 votes

Yeah tower diving an oriana and killing her and living from it as an ADC squishy champ is insanely broken

Supreme Senpai69May 15, 20172 votes

When Lucians ahead he can force fights with his E and R. But when he's behind he can avoid fights with E too. That's my only complaint about him. Too safe when behind and too oppressive while ahead

Iets run awayMay 15, 20178 votes

No, lol. Just because the best player died to it, doesn't mean it's op. It's called a counter for a reason.

xJLx MCHammerMay 15, 20178 votes

[{quoted}](name=Focus On Meh,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IKL0sPv6,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-05-15T00:17:17.873+0000)

No, lol. Just because the best player died to it, doesn't mean it's op. It's called a counter for a reason.

Funny

I thought AD champs should have a weak early game because they scale better Yet, here we are, a AP champion being bullied by a AD champion the entire game.....

RalanrMay 15, 201711 votes

That's not remotely true.

Iets run awayMay 15, 20173 votes

[{quoted}](name=xJLx MCHammer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IKL0sPv6,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-05-15T00:35:56.380+0000)

Funny

I thought AD champs should have a weak early game because they scale better Yet, here we are, a AP champion being bullied by a AD champion the entire game.....

He's an early to mid game champ lmao.

LankPantsMay 15, 20172 votes

He's an early/mid game champion who also scales well into late game just off of the back of being an ADC. IE he's a broken piece of shit.

AnidanMay 15, 20172 votes

If IE is broken then it's due to being a victim of the lack of itemization to compete with it. There's not enough in competition with it for ranged AD Casters that are supposed to fall off harder in the late-game.

To be fair, that's a lot of the problem with League itemization in general is that there just isn't enough, and a lot of them are stat sticks so it's just a matter of picking up the most abusable stick at that current moment because the items don't have strong identities beyond the stats.

LankPantsMay 15, 20172 votes

Ie. as in isto es, Latin for 'this is'.

MakharyaMay 15, 20173 votes

And being outscaled by his opponent :D.

Being ad is far from a garantee to have a good scaling, the best example that came to my mind is (and evene before) shaco ad.

What make adc scaling so well isn't the fact they are ad, it's the synergy between ad/as/critcal chance (and critical damage). Moreover their inherent build as a lot of importance.

xJLx MCHammerMay 15, 20171 votes

{quoted}

And being outscaled by his opponent :D.

Being ad is far from a garantee to have a good scaling, the best example that came to my mind is (and evene before) shaco ad.

What make adc scaling so well isn't the fact they are ad, it's the synergy between ad/as/critcal chance (and critical damage). Moreover their inherent build as a lot of importance.

He is an ADC He is not shaco

Shaco does not have the range...the mobility, the damage.. LIke you said, the synergy.

But what do I know. Shaco doesn't get picked into bot lane as an ADC. it's LUCIAN!!! DUHHHh

He may not have the scaling that vayne, kog, or cait have, but he has scaling..

MakharyaMay 15, 20172 votes

I was just pointing the: he is ad so he scale better. If you can't have a clear reflexion without everything else coming in the middle, i can't help you.

(but still Orianna outscale Lucian).

AnidanMay 15, 20171 votes

Not all ADCs scale the same. Some are going to be better early or mid, and Lucian happens to be pretty good in the early-mid game while he is statistically weaker in the late-game. He has scaling, but it's not particularly great by ADC standards, and as a result a lot of the ADCs and even Mages pass him up as the game goes on. That's the price he pays for being an early-mid champion. This does not mean he can't be OP, however, but him being strong early is not an indication that something is wrong by itself, just like Ezreal being strong early wouldn't mean something is wrong with him.

ShadòwMay 15, 20171 votes

i thought Orianna was once supposed to be a late game champion

TheFallenShawMay 15, 20174 votes

Faker is just a boosted Bronze 5 so that means nothing

Reaper SorakaMay 15, 20171 votes

idk why this troll post was downvoted.

Faker is clearly a boosted animal for losing to a lucian mid. He can choose his own animal to be; he's earned the right since we know his name. But he remains boosted.

nm1010May 15, 20173 votes

Faker's laning has been sub par ever since keystones became a thing and every champion can 100-0 each other.

Sexy Jack RabbitMay 15, 20172 votes

Faker is good but he's not the best/ or at least the most perfect player in the entire fucking world. Iirc his SoloQ performance isn't that great compared to some others.

He's capable of being out-played.

AnidanMay 15, 20172 votes

I remember when Apdo would routinely give him a run for his money in SoloQ, and that was arguably during Faker's peak. Faker is damn good, and he's great at working with his team and coordinating with them, but in a strict 1v1 he's not the best player in the world.

But at the same time, I remember a while back when someone said it wasn't that unusual for Plat players to lose trades in lane against bronze players because that's almost all a lot of those bronze players practiced. You gotta beat the whole picture for it to matter, not just one element.

BALDG1VEN BOOMERMay 15, 20171 votes

Needs the build path to be more geared towards the appropriate class, when Lucians build path was garbage his win rate plummet

hhaavviikkMay 15, 20171 votes

of course it's nerf worthy, adc's aren't supposed to have a great early and late game

ParoeMay 15, 20175 votes

{quoted}

of course it's nerf worthy, adc's aren't supposed to have a great early and late game

Corki "I got sheen! early game over." Caitlyn "I got a BF sword. Early game over." Draven "I got a BF sword. Early game over." Ezreal "I got a sheen! Early game over." Sivir "I got an essence reaver. Early game over." Yasuo "I got a zeal. Early game over." Xayah "I got a rakan. Early game over."

You realize that the "weak early hyper strong late" is a fallacy nowadays? It hasnt been true for years, ever since the standard marksman items got ALL the stats they need without any compromise.

statelesskillerMay 15, 20172 votes

Gangplank i fucking disagree with you there mate

TwinkieProMay 15, 20171 votes

Weak, yes, but fairly safe if the gp knows what they are doing.

hhaavviikkMay 15, 20171 votes

{quoted}

"I got sheen! early game over." "I got a BF sword. Early game over." "I got a BF sword. Early game over." "I got a sheen! Early game over." "I got an essence reaver. Early game over." "I got a zeal. Early game over." "I got a rakan. Early game over."

You realize that the "weak early hyper strong late" is a fallacy nowadays? It hasnt been true for years, ever since the standard marksman items got ALL the stats they need without any compromise.

the problem is that it shouldn't be a fallacy

Acheron16May 15, 20171 votes

{quoted}

"I got sheen! early game over." "I got a BF sword. Early game over." "I got a BF sword. Early game over." "I got a sheen! Early game over." "I got an essence reaver. Early game over." "I got a zeal. Early game over." "I got a rakan. Early game over."

You realize that the "weak early hyper strong late" is a fallacy nowadays? It hasnt been true for years, ever since the standard marksman items got ALL the stats they need without any compromise.

The compromise is that they are made of wet paper all game long.

ParoeMay 15, 20172 votes

{quoted}

The compromise is that they are made of wet paper all game long.

Corki and ezreal are safe. every other ADC becomes a drain tank so the whole "squish" argument isnt valid.

FourVsFiveMay 15, 20171 votes

well if he is that broken would they not have banned him in champ select?

JavelinJoeMay 15, 20171 votes

He was last picked and they first round picked Ez. Also no one expected him to actually do it. Some hoped, but no one fully thought he would. ALso maybe SKT thought better bans were there.

Sire HippingtonMay 15, 20171 votes

Does lucian require nerfs? Maybe, though nerfing BotrK wouldn't be a bad idea either.

Is Xiye performing well on lucian vs faker a valid reason to nerf lucian? Hell no, what the fuck is wrong with you people!!!

XIII VanitasMay 15, 20171 votes

Cool, we've found a new way to balance the game: the Faker standard. Anything below is fine, anything above needs to be nerfed because, if it was a fair 1v1, Faker wouldn't have lost against it.

lolipopevelynnMay 15, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Lucian has been a pain for a very long time. Near unmatchable trading with his passive, ability to abuse item passives, built in escape, wave clear, poke, etc. Now he is taking over more than just the bot lane. Even SKT, the arguably (and statistically if we go off of worlds wins) best players in the world, could not handle it.

Lucian needs a bit of a nerf so he is not almost universally dominant and extremely likely to come out ahead and snowball out of control.

so if faker died to a DrMundo mid, would we also have to nerf mundo?

Dianna LeveretMay 20, 20171 votes

I agree Lucian is disgusting, but he isn't broken. His synergy with BotrK and BC breaks him. The last time Riot touched him, several patches ago, he received some QOL buffs as well as Q buff, then soon after, BotrK was reworked and it is a core item on Lucian, combined with his buffs - makes him a pain to deal with. Many times he is unpredictable with how he can dash into you, trade with you with his passive and win the trade if it is 1v1, because his passive is pretty strong. I think he should either get a new passive or he will be very weak in 7.11 , where they nerf BotrK. But a new passive feels in order, because he is either OP or UP.