Can we make it so towers don't die when you sneeze on them?

HateDaddy·Apr 3, 2017·77 votes·2,949 views

I don't feel I need to explain this anymore. Towers are laughably easy to kill.

70 Comments

Alex h8721Apr 3, 201717 votes

Ziggs Atchooooo!!!

But yes valid point.

GlîtchyApr 3, 201711 votes

[{quoted}](name=Alex h8721,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HsdMuvqa,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-04-03T22:27:58.332+0000)

Atchooooo!!!

But yes valid point.

Ziggs' ability shouldn't be able to smash towers that have like 35% left, that's a HUGE amount to remove.

Alex h8721Apr 3, 20175 votes

Agreed 100%, this is effectively an execute at 1100 hp for the turret (inner turrets), and that is utterly stupid.

Votable JesterApr 4, 20175 votes

That is only when his W is maxed. At rank one, it's 25%. Plus, that's using his only escape/hard cc.

An Undead bratApr 4, 20175 votes

Yeah, escape of an artillery champion, such a lose...

ninjaroxasApr 4, 20175 votes

Uh ya it is since last i checked artillery mages aren't tanks so someone getting on you isn't the best thing

An Undead bratApr 4, 20172 votes

That's the thing, you get only on a stupid one, because they never even need to get close.

Laxfan52Apr 4, 20173 votes

It is barely an escape. The blast cone shoots people farther than ziggs w shoots him

AimléssApr 4, 20172 votes

99% of the time when you're getting a freakin' tower, you aren't in immediate danger, especially when you melt one in literally 2 seconds.

Iźuku MidoriyaApr 5, 20171 votes

Yeah but when im playing any melee champ so he throws everything on himself including ult and yells "ALLAH ACKBAR" and i die because i took 2000 damage, i dont think its a big deal

Support PositionApr 4, 20173 votes

Only thing good about him is that hes a tower destroyer... -sigh-

undesirable teamApr 4, 20176 votes

[{quoted}](name=Annies Mad Watch,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HsdMuvqa,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2017-04-04T12:19:20.875+0000)

Only thing good about him is that hes a tower destroyer... -sigh-

and he pokes and he nukes things and he zones and he 2 shots towers ???

MeritasApr 4, 20172 votes

None of those other things were relevant before he got his new W, so I don't see your point.

RalanrApr 4, 20173 votes

And there were people who were better than him at all if those things.

SzGamer227Apr 4, 20173 votes

This is true.

Ziggs' poke becomes very inaccurate at range, compared to other mages who maintain reliable accuracy at a distance.

Other mages can zone just by being a monstrously oppressive burst damage dealers (if you get too close to a Syndra or a Vel'Koz it's going to hurt... a lot) whereas Ziggs has to rely on an inaccurate spammable mini-burst spell to deal damage and must rely on zoning via mines and satchel charges, both of which have significant cooldowns.

Ziggs probably has the biggest AoW nuke in the game, but things like Vel'Koz ult and MF ult are more reliable and potentially deal more damage.

Ziggs can reliably burst a damaged tower, but an ADC will reliably melt a tower from 100-0 faster, as Ziggs is limited by cooldowns on his passive when getting a tower below execution range.

Support PositionApr 5, 20171 votes

And falls off 20 min in the game due to no damage output because he's ziggs. Or gets 2 shot by every assassin in the game. Which there is ALWAYS one in the game no matter what. PERIOD.

OelykApr 5, 20171 votes

Just gonna say, it scales 25%-35% and if you max it first of second, you are limiting your ability A LOT.

BTW thanks for making me type that, I want to try Support ziggs with someone, say Tristana, and just shove super hard.

The funny thing is, it wouldn't be half bad because the wave clear is ridiculous, and support gets inbuilt mana regen easily.

SintamaApr 4, 201715 votes

Can we also make it so diving is actually dangerous? No one is scared to dive solo. I'm not scared to dive solo. Most champions seem to be able to tank 6-8 tower shots, it gets them to half health, they get a kill, both summoners from the enemy, and push the next (or previous) wave.

An Undead bratApr 4, 20172 votes

6-8 gets them on half HPs? Maybe true for bruisers with 4 offensive items.

TheMinezApr 4, 20172 votes

*Hues in Mordekaiser *

TormentulaApr 4, 20172 votes

Most champions have heals, shields, invurnabilities, or mobility+burst in order to make towering diving easier.

Back in the old days this wasn't as big of a deal but as we see more champions with tower tanking/not caring mechanics, they just get weaker and weaker.

Look at the champions we recently got: Kindred : mobility to get in and out quick, an ultimate that lets them survive the dive Illaoi : A ton of healing while being generally tanky enough to do a full dive. Jhin : I don't have much besides increased MS to get in and out while doing burst damage as an ADC. AurelionSol : Half the time not even in tower range and can E away. Taliyah : Who? Oh right she doesn't need to dive she can just poke and run away with the 2 hits she'll take. Kled : A tower aggro reset, and another tower aggro reset.. and another... and another.. oh now he's dead. Ivern : Fucking green buff and janna shields on a lower cooldown than the tower shots. Camille : W heal, another tower aggro reset, high mobility to get in and out.

Fiora : A heal and mobility to not care Ryze : Shields Yorick : Minions to take aggro Ryze : a teleport Poppy : The tower doesn't exist Ryze : wave clear for minion block Warwick : see poppy Ryze : see poppy

Riot would have to steroid towers in order for them to ever be scared to dive due to the nature of champions in general today.

TimX24968BApr 5, 20171 votes

Tryndamere MasterYi Ziggs XinZhao

Tower? what tower?

SirLapseApr 5, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Can we also make it so diving is actually dangerous? No one is scared to dive solo. I'm not scared to dive solo. Most champions seem to be able to tank 6-8 tower shots, it gets them to half health, they get a kill, both summoners from the enemy, and push the next (or previous) wave.

I've seen so many tower dives go wrong at literally every elo range (including Challenger games) that I'd say it's already plenty risky when uncoordinated. Solo queue is the king of coordination as we all know.

Troll for TrumpApr 4, 20179 votes

is behind wins teamfight can't do anything as enemy minions maul on base and destroy everything

This has happened so many times..

GlîtchyApr 3, 20178 votes

I have to agree, especially the inhib towers, c'mon they're meant to be semi-last line of defense, the laser beams should come back.

HateDaddyApr 3, 201710 votes

{quoted}

I have to agree, especially the inhib towers, c'mon they're meant to be semi-last line of defense, the laser beams should come back.

It's just beyond ridiculous when you lose a close team fight at 28 minutes and they legit take down your tier 2, inhib tower, inhib, nexus turrets and nexus. Like what the actual fuck?

SweedishGunnerApr 4, 20171 votes

It seems like if any team gets aced after the 25 minute mark the game is basically over.

AxzariousApr 3, 20175 votes

Increase the damage too. Those diving assassins tanking shots like no tomorrow with only a cloth armor is kinda bull.

David HallerApr 4, 20174 votes

They should do what HotS does to some of their structures.

Don't make them just static damage.

Give them some form of utility like applying a slow or a debuff or something of that nature.

Hell you could take it another level and give turrets skills that they deploy when being attacked and changes depending on what is attacking them.

If someone's attacking a player under the turret, the turret could give them a shield. If minions attack them, they could shoot cluster bombs out or something to clear waves. If players attack them, they could summon 36 Baron Nashors behind them and trap them on Cassio's poison inside of a J4 ULT so they can't flash or escape.

Little over the top but it could be fun.

You could have a number of different skills that turrets could use. You could even have it unique to each turret and the players could choose from a pool of skills on the turret for their lane.

So something the bot lane uses might be completely different from something top or mid uses.

Joey TandJ50Apr 5, 20172 votes

I really, really like the idea of different turrets having different skills

BananaSlayerAMOApr 3, 20173 votes

By increasing tower defence, matches will take longer. I feel like matches are at a good length already.

The JigSAWApr 4, 20173 votes

I can't agree with this more.

I remember back in season 3 when we had turrets that could actually do damage and not be tanked near infinitely by various champions. Then Riot started playing with them and touching up the turrets so they had, if you remember, the shield on the 2nd turret in each lane and the laser beam on the base turret. Now, a full health turret can be taken down in less than 30 seconds by one champion after 10 minutes has gone by. Don't believe me? Use Xin Zhao with Sheen and Stinger or anybody with attack speed over 1.5.

I had a proposal to prevent turrets from being so easily destroyed but Riot would never do it since it involves balancing the game. So instead, how about giving turrets more health, MR, armor, and MAYBE some health regeneration on the 2nd turret at least? So they have a chance of not being destroyed in five seconds? Right now there is no consequence - tank champion dives the turret and takes aggro while 2-3 fighters destroy it in seconds and the tank still has 80% health after 5-6 shots.

ZT XperimentorApr 4, 20173 votes

And make them dangerous to dive? Their attacks are like wet napkins.

DunkinNoobsApr 4, 20172 votes

Aren't you a Nasus main? Don't you want weaker towers?

RalanrApr 4, 201712 votes

Weak towers means unsafe zone for last hitting under tower.

VelgamApr 4, 20174 votes

THIS GUY right here gets it.

HateDaddyApr 4, 20179 votes

{quoted}

Aren't you a Nasus main? Don't you want weaker towers?

Towers are always weak to nasus teehee

Only Play DariusApr 4, 20177 votes

When **everyone **takes towers easily Nasus no longer has a niche. What reason is there to play Nasus anymore when a Darius with ZZ'Rot will splitpush towers only slightly slower but is so much stronger early game and in teamfights?

sobi999Apr 4, 20172 votes

For how long has this issue been the top of our concern? Riot won't do anything anytime soon.

ChaosRider7Apr 4, 20172 votes

yes please I fucking hate it when I tp/roam to help my team and the enemy kills my tower after 2 waves of minions

VelgamApr 4, 20171 votes

When you lose a turret at 5mins into game you know there is something wrong.

MelvearApr 4, 20172 votes

{quoted}

When you lose a turret at 5mins into game you know there is something wrong.

Your laners?

VelgamApr 6, 20171 votes

I played many games and turrets go down by the 5-7min mark.

MelvearApr 7, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I played many games and turrets go down by the 5-7min mark_ in lanes that get crushed_.

FTFY

VelgamApr 8, 20171 votes

No, sometimes they get get ganked, they survive, and by the time they come back, turret from 100% to dead. I've done this to people and had it done to me., we didnt crush them and were pretty even till we got a gank and they escaped, but they came back to no turret at 7:46.

Laxfan52Apr 4, 20171 votes

They may be easy to other people but I normally play mages and unless I play ziggs, it will take me a while to destroy a tower

Hunted9000Apr 4, 20173 votes

Dude, I have took down a tower at 10 mins with xerath....XERATH his attack speed is garbage, but with the new ap numbers adding damage when you attack turrets they make taking towers a breeze on mages alike.

DivewingApr 5, 20171 votes

not to mention towers take forever and a day to kill 1 minion let alone 6

Shaco PsychoApr 4, 20173 votes

Isn't that how its supposed to be? Mages aren't supposed to be able to take towers quickly at all, in fact, that's the entire reason the ADC role existed in the first place.