i like how you win lane top just by being ranged

Eyesack·Oct 26, 2016·7 votes·770 views

there needs to be an actual reason to pick melees... I recommend lowering the base movespeed or mobility of ranged champs overall by an amount that actually makes them susceptible to ganks early on.

You could also consider fixing creep block so that melees can actually trade and cs in lane, would be nice to be able to have fun in lane again instead of just pathing around dying to some clown jayce who literally just right clicks me while i cs under my tower.

30 Comments

XinCrinOct 26, 20165 votes

There is a reason to pick Melees: They are tanky and have cc. You pick range top laners to win the early game and transition that to mid and late game. You pick melee top laners to win team fights and provide utility and tank.

Some champions are just designed to win the early game and some are not. Thats part of the game. Ranged top laners are meant to win the early game. Its your job not to fall too far behind. But if you do shut down a ranged top laner, they are really quite useless until late game when they have there items and are relevant again.

ProfDrDeathOct 26, 20161 votes

Even in the late game, chances are that the enemy team is unbalanced in their composition and features for instance a weaker frontline or not enough CC.

Also, the assassin update should shake things up somewhat - too many squishies in a team are an assassin's wet dream.

paperbIadeOct 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

There is a reason to pick Melees: They are tanky and have cc. You pick range top laners to win the early game and transition that to mid and late game. You pick melee top laners to win team fights and provide utility and tank.

Some champions are just designed to win the early game and some are not. Thats part of the game. Ranged top laners are meant to win the early game. Its your job not to fall too far behind. But if you do shut down a ranged top laner, they are really quite useless until late game when they have there items and are relevant again.

Kennen Jayce

PermabannedGarenOct 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

There is a reason to pick Melees: They are tanky and have cc.

Tryndamere Fiora

Also, ranged top laners aren't tanky and don't have CC?

Kennen Builds a lot of HP and some resistances, gets a resistance steroid from his E, and has a huge big boy AOE stun with lots of burst.

Gnar This champion is a ranged top laner who literally scales into a super tank, while building very bulky. Gnar has no weaknesses beyond the person playing him. He's possibly the worst-designed champion in the game.

Jayce Less CC and durability (though he does have a resistances steroid on his ult) than the others, but makes up for it with his incredible poke game and peeling, as well as his ridiculous all-in manfighting early game.

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with ranged top laners. I don't like laning against Quinn, but she's fair. She has the drawbacks picking a ranged top laner like her should have.

Gnar, Kennen, and Jayce do not have those drawbacks. If they are good there is no reason to pick a melee champion.

McFatalOct 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

There is a reason to pick Melees: They are tanky and have cc. You pick range top laners to win the early game and transition that to mid and late game. You pick melee top laners to win team fights and provide utility and tank.

Some champions are just designed to win the early game and some are not. Thats part of the game. Ranged top laners are meant to win the early game. Its your job not to fall too far behind. But if you do shut down a ranged top laner, they are really quite useless until late game when they have there items and are relevant again.

jayce kennen win both early game and dont fall off whatsoever late game. your point is invalid. ranged champs do not have a tradeoff for being picked into lane. had u played a melee vs a good jayce or kennen you would have known this.

XinCrinOct 26, 20162 votes

Look at my euwest account on op.gg: Scorpiour You can see I play Jayce. I played Jayce before those buffs he received. -Jayce offers very little utility. His only utility is his gate and his knock back. -Shut him down in lane and he is pretty bad -Does not scale as hard as some people believe. The armor pen build (the most popular one atm) does not work well against tanks. While he can one shot squishys, his range is a problem. He needs to go to hammer to one shot. Also, Jayce is quite squishy. -His team fights are alright, not great. He kind of acts like a 2nd adc but if your team does not have a proper front line, you can easily get blown up and do nothing.

I don't really play Kennen myself though while he brings utility, its really only his ultimate. Kennen has no hard engage, his poke is kind of bad, his range is pretty low and he only does magic damage meaning he is terrible against tanks.

McFatalOct 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Look at my euwest account on op.gg: Scorpiour You can see I play Jayce. I played Jayce before those buffs he received. -Jayce offers very little utility. His only utility is his gate and his knock back. -Shut him down in lane and he is pretty bad -Does not scale as hard as some people believe. The armor pen build (the most popular one atm) does not work well against tanks. While he can one shot squishys, his range is a problem. He needs to go to hammer to one shot. Also, Jayce is quite squishy. -His team fights are alright, not great. He kind of acts like a 2nd adc but if your team does not have a proper front line, you can easily get blown up and do nothing.

I don't really play Kennen myself though while he brings utility, its really only his ultimate. Kennen has no hard engage, his poke is kind of bad, his range is pretty low and he only does magic damage meaning he is terrible against tanks.

he has no hard engage? its really only his ultimate? thats all he needs. a gigantic aoe stun and insane damage with a point and click and he is in zhonyas stasis to take no damage for it as well.

XinCrinOct 27, 20162 votes

He has no engage. All he can do is run up towards you which is a SOFT engage. Yeah he has an aoe stun but really does nothing else once his ultimate is on cd. Also, someone can lock him up with cc or one shot him. If he goes in zhonya, then he cant move which means people can leave the ult zone.

McFatalOct 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

He has no engage. All he can do is run up towards you which is a SOFT engage. Yeah he has an aoe stun but really does nothing else once his ultimate is on cd. Also, someone can lock him up with cc or one shot him. If he goes in zhonya, then he cant move which means people can leave the ult zone.

actually with the items he builds, hes incredibly hard to kill. he goes rylais zhonyas and is fucking tanky as shit

SubIimationzOct 26, 20164 votes

I am a top laner and i approve of this message

EtyrnaIOct 26, 20163 votes

Recommend taking away move speed from ranged champions that most already have a base of 325..?

Move along.

EyesackOct 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Recommend taking away move speed from ranged champions that most already have a base of 325..?

Move along.

back in my day some champs had base movespeeds as low as 300.

RalanrOct 26, 20161 votes

Dark times.

SeenanOct 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Dark times.

Zyra used to have 290 or so. :K

ProfDrDeathOct 26, 20161 votes

Back in the day, EVERYONE had 25 less movement speed.

Guess what, it resulted in 5 times item 1001 + 3 item 2003 per team.

ZephyrDrakeOct 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

back in my day some champs had base movespeeds as low as 300.

yeah and EVERYONE got an increase of 25 MS... lowering it isnbut now't going to do anything but make those champions be completely worthless. 300 used to be the lowest MS but not anymore for good reason

ProfDrDeathOct 26, 20161 votes

There is actually not too big an issue with ranged champions in the top lane, save for Kennen, who is slightly too strong after his changes during the season, and Jayce, who is pretty much too strong after his recent buffs.

Even with those two, melee champions still make up the majority of top lane picks - top 20 in popularity in plat+ is split into 4 ranged champions, one of which has a 46% winrate, and 16 melee champions. Of these 16 melees, 14 have winrates of 49.5% or higher, and only Ekko has a winrate of under 49% (with 46.77%). The other ranged champions of top are so unpopular that you might see them in one of 20 games ON AVERAGE. If your champion of choice is countered well by ranged champions (say, for example, because it is Darius or Riven), of course you are going to see more ranged champions against you. Same is true in reverse if you main Irelia, for instance - you get to deal with Darius, Malphite and other anti-melee melees more often, since those champions work better against you.

Of course, being in lane in a melee vs. ranged match-up can suck major balls if you picked the wrong melee. Even then, lane is only a phase of the game, and you can learn to play around these kinds of match-ups by smart itemization, coordinating with your jungler and learn when you have to concede pressure. Also, more often than not, having a ranged top laners results in the enemy team's composition being somewhat gimped.

Unfortunately, the vocal minority that complains about these kinds of match-ups is not up to the challenge of changing their playstyle, QQ'ing when their balls-to-the-wall style no longer works.

JPlayahOct 26, 20162 votes

i like the idea of fixing creep block. It's simple. Make it so that champions either don't collide with their own minions, or push their minions out of the way when they walk into them.

DarkRitualOct 26, 20162 votes

Doran's Shield, or a mastery to decrease damage from ranged attacks would be the easiest options.

CrazyBear1987Oct 27, 20162 votes

"there needs to be an actual reason to pick melees" - There is, to be tanky and be an initiator mid/late game.

" I recommend lowering the base movespeed or mobility of ranged champs overall by an amount that actually makes them susceptible to ganks early on."

No. Thats a huge nerf to both range and mages, and removes their normal advantage of being range in the first place.

I agree, Jayce and Kennen Top is stupid AF to play against when your a pure melee Champ, but so it Rumble or Gragas Some champions are going to be weaker in roles and lanes when matched up against another champ with a better or counter kit.

Learn to adapt to the situation, Try different champs etc there are multiple others solutions to beating Jayce or Kennen Top lane, you dont have to 1v1 a wreck all game to do it.

The DeckownerOct 26, 20161 votes

The biggest problem is Rito has state they can't just flat out remive or simply fix creepblock, it is a huge amount of codes created over many years by many different coders and programmers, it will take years to make any beneficial change to creepblock without fucking up the spaghetti code that ends up in bigger problems.

AttackOnTeemosOct 26, 20161 votes

-.- Why are people catching so much hell against Range tops? I mean isn't 90% of the jungle melee? You got no problem ganking a range champ.

I mean Hell I played a mundo top against range (We all know where that's going too)

Nasas life steals away.

Sion can literally just cancel all, Renek can easily gap close...same with riven.

How many ranges are you seeing top that are pwning you man??

ProfDrDeathOct 26, 20161 votes

If he mains Darius or Riven, probably more than average. But, then again, taking most melees into Darius is tatamount to suicide...

McFatalOct 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

-.- Why are people catching so much hell against Range tops? I mean isn't 90% of the jungle melee? You got no problem ganking a range champ.

I mean Hell I played a mundo top against range (We all know where that's going too)

Nasas life steals away.

Sion can literally just cancel all, Renek can easily gap close...same with riven.

How many ranges are you seeing top that are pwning you man??

jayce kenne quinn kayle swain teemo. oh and gnar.

AttackOnTeemosOct 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

jayce kenne quinn kayle swain teemo. oh and gnar.

Not sure who the hell plays kayle anymore, not sure how you can say she is owning when her main range is her E. Jayce just has early game advantage MR stops Kennen perioid. Swain again, MR Teemo Hell once more MR, even a tryndamere would work. Gnar o.o...He is a hybrid boss

RequiemsfireOct 26, 20161 votes

Yeaaah but if I pick Irelia that's how you lose. ;)

McFatalOct 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Yeaaah but if I pick Irelia that's how you lose. ;)

irelia isnt balanced so yea she wins lane most of the time.

RequiemsfireOct 27, 20161 votes

Irelia is the probably the best anti-range melee laner in the game. She punishes your mistakes and deals a lot of burst with sustain to deal with harass.

It makes more sense to pick another fighter or tank into irelia than Teemo or Quinn because you'll just end up being outscaled and bursted in the mid-lategame

People choose to complain about Olaf Irelia Hecarim because they're good at dealing with champions who do not build tanky against them transitioning from lane as Anti-carries.

oSEXYPLATYPUSoOct 26, 20161 votes

just losing lane dont mean you lose game

and just cuz you win lane dont mean you win game

420 gramsOct 27, 20161 votes

I think melees should have a noticeable base damage advantage because getting cleaved with a giant sword should hurt more than being hit with pixie dust (tryndamere vs lulu)