Its like pple dont even look at the statistics on champion.gg. He has a HUGE dip in win rate during the middle of the game.
Edit: In case you were wondering, Phylol has said this about Draven and it just goes to show how poorly understood this champion is.
EcchiOtakuTM2 votesDraven is an early-mid game adc though. Early game is usually around 0-10 minutes while mid is 10-25min.
Woook3r1 votesBy your definition, late game is 25-60 minutes and is easily twice the length of the other phases of the game.
Early game is from the the start of the game until 20 minutes. Mid game is 20-40. Late is 40-60. Draven is early, if he snowballs, and late game if the teamcomps are right and there isnt an assassin...
Quepha3 votesBy your definition, late game is 25-60 minutes and is easily twice the length of the other phases of the game.
Early game is from the the start of the game until 20 minutes. Mid game is 20-40. Late is 40-60. Draven is early, if he snowballs, and late game if the teamcomps are right and there isnt an assassin...
25 minutes is definitely late game territory. The fact that it may last a long time doesn't change the fact that the game's tempo at that point is determined by team fights.
Furthermore, a 40 minute game is considered a long game of League, 60 minutes is downright brutal and incredibly rare.
Woook3r2 votesU can either guage the progress of the game by time or by item slot. Lol games last anywhere from 0-60 minutes. The "middle" of that is the 30 minute mark.
If you judge by number of completed items AND you count boots as a completed item, then ~25 minutes is mid game since three items out of six are generally completed by then. Again this is counting boots.
Either way, the middle of the game does not start at the 10 minute mark. Minions have only been spawning for 8 minutes, guy. A really appreciable part of your "early game" consists of standing near the entrance of the jg, dancing your ass off. Roughly 10-20% of the early game has 0 action according to you. WTF?
League is paced like chess and no one consideres the 15th move in chess to be the middle of the game. Its barely the last stage of the opening. The end of decent game of chess is generally around the 40th move
Quepha3 votesU can either guage the progress of the game by time or by item slot. Lol games last anywhere from 0-60 minutes. The "middle" of that is the 30 minute mark.
Exactly zero people other than you judge LoL game 'stages' by those qualifications, nor are either of those qualifications useful in understanding the game.
Early game/Lane phase: players are generally out in their respective lanes farming with their goal being to acquire resources as efficiently impossible until... Mid game/Roaming phase: Towers begin falling and when players can no longer farm safely in their lane they resort to roaming to other lanes to try and make plays and capture more objectives, but eventually... Late game/Teamfight phase: Only a few objectives remain, making the goals of each team relatively transparent and it is rare for a situation to call for fewer than 5 members to make a play at an objective or attempt to contest that play. While split pushing is still an option, it's generally considered suicide to perform anything other than a 4-1 split as a 3v5 should be a lost cause once champions have the core items for their builds and their comp comes together into a well-oiled team-fighting machine.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesIt's 0-10min for early game, 10-25min for mid, 25-40 for late and 40+ is endgame.
Woook3r1 votes20% of your version of the early game is spent waiting for minions to arrive in lane.
So basically, no.
EcchiOtakuTM2 votesWhat do you think early game is about....
Woook3r1 votesI think the early part of the game is laning + some of the roaming.
Middle is some of the roaming + 4v5 teamfights (splitting)
Late game is where splitting is a bit more dangerous than before and one team is getting close to 5 dragons.
But thats just what tends to happen during those periods. The periods themselves are defined by the time that has passed since death timers have the biggest impact on the actual strategy and gameplay.
Edit: another unique thing about the early game is that you cant surrender duriing that time.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesEarly I agree with however it tends to end slightly after laning phases so 10min is best estimation, and it emphasizes when players don't really have any core item or max rank skill yet. I don't agree that not surrendering is a feature of early game because by the 10 minute mark you should already have enough strength to start teamfights or begin split pushing if needed.
Mid game usually starts around ten minutes because that's when you probably have your first core item/max ranked skill then ready to open more options such as teamfight/splitting etc.
Late game tends to be past 25min because that's when you mostly see where you excel and decide whether or not you'll continue working with your team to victory (Most of your core items built and skills leveled)
Endgame which a lot of people don't talk about anymore is when you finished leveling and buying core items which should be around the 40min mark.
TL;DR: Most of the reason why mid game is pushed so early is due to how the game's flow was changed anyways making games faster pace. Still a shame riot hasn't fixed death timers to reflect it though.
Woook3r1 votes" I don't agree that not surrendering is a feature of early game because by the 10 minute mark you should already have enough strength to start teamfights or begin split pushing if needed."
Thats bronze mentality. WHy would you want to teamfight before your adc has infinity edge?
BladeSteel1 votes[deleted]
Woook3r1 votesThis guy said you should have ie by 10 minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBTvc8pSfwM
This is a clip of a fed draven walking out of base with his first completed item at 14 minutes. You can and should have ie before 20 min. But not at 10.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yK44iMzw94Q
here is another in which he doesnt have a completed item at 15 minutes. Bear also in mind that this is draven with kills. He has more gold than other adc's.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesaround ten minutes because that's when you probably have your first core item/**max ranked skill **
Since you need help reading.
And fun fact, the adcs tend to buy bf sword+pickaxe/hammer then rush zeal/completed zeal item. In case you didn't know and either way much more expensive than other laners completed item when they're the meat of the team.
Woook3r1 votesyou didnt say around ten minutes tho. this is what you said:
"by the 10 minute mark you should already have enough strength to start teamfights or begin split pushing if needed."
Quepha2 votesWHy would you want to teamfight before your adc has infinity edge?
Why would you want to team fight after the enemy adc builds an infinity edge?
Woook3r1 votesBy your definition, 0% of games end in the early and midgame. They all end in the late game. Thats a useful definition, bro.
Quepha2 votesBy your definition, 0% of games end in the early and midgame. They all end in the late game. Thats a useful definition, bro.
unless there's a surrender, this is true. Everything has a beginning, middle and end. You can't get to the end without a middle and you can't get to a victory/defeat screen without some late game.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesI'm pretty sure in plat+ and pro play they know to teamfight even if the adc has no essence/ie but I guess that eludes you.
Woook3r1 votesExcept they were still laning at 10 minutes. Idk what ranks you guys are, but its only bronze and silvers that try to teamfight at 10 minutes.
Quepha2 votesExcept they were still laning at 10 minutes. Idk what ranks you guys are, but its only bronze and silvers that try to teamfight at 10 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlsZn4oU_X0#15m6s Skirmish over red that involves 4 players on each side. Time stamp in game: 9:30 The bronze and silver teams involved: CLG and FOX
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesDude do you know what the phrase USUALLY or AROUND means? Also it's pretty obvious people are starting teamfights at that time, idk what type of elo you're in to think you shouldn't teamfight until 20min+ that's just dumb.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesWTF no late game is 25-40min, end game is 40+
Srsly noone remembers end game is a thing.
Miraweave2 votesBy your definition, late game is 25-60 minutes and is easily twice the length of the other phases of the game.
Early game is from the the start of the game until 20 minutes. Mid game is 20-40. Late is 40-60. Draven is early, if he snowballs, and late game if the teamcomps are right and there isnt an assassin...
15 minutes is definitely midgame.
I'd argue lategame starts at around 20 minutes since that's when a team can get baron and close a game.
Aeolian Melodies1 votesRandom quote from no one in particular too stronk.
Woook3r1 votesok. sure let me find someone who says this about draven. Oh. Phylol. That was fast.
OverpoweredSoap1 votesDidn't Phylol also say that ADCs aren't in the best spot right now?
Woook3r1 votesId almost agree, because the only adc's doing really well are ones that I dont like to play. But yea, kinda hard to justify that statement.
A few adc's have been stupidly overpowered in the past few months, but they all fall in the caster class and are in the process of getting nerfed. I can only think of three non-jungle adc's who have been strong in the past little while. One of them is Kog'Maw. No surprise there. What the actual fuck did they think they were doing with that buff? The other is lucian who is not very good after his nerfs. Corkie is still overpowered, but they probably wont do anything about it as long as the shoutcasters get to keep saying "triforce powerspike" in reference to him.
Id mention MF as well but she isnt that strong I guess. Shes just a stupid fucking champion. If she can wombo its gg. If she cant, its gg for her.
Anyway. Barring some really stupid shit like essence reaver and jungle graves, adc's arent doing that well.
Rustling Bush1 voteshighest skill cap champion, i faced a really good draven not to long ago, caught every axe and cashed in a few times, by the time i dueled him mid to late game he was on his 5th item while i was on my 3rd, needless to say 1 q took half my health.
Woook3r1 votesYea. His passive is unhealthy. I dont know why it is allowed.
Blitzidious1 votesBecause it's absolutely useless late-game.
Rustling Bush1 votes[{quoted}](name=Da Supawaffle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GvFMh2YG,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2016-03-15T03:16:34.038+0000)
Because it's absolutely useless late-game.
it maybe useless late game but he snowballs like no other adc.
Woook3r1 votesexcept that lucian snowballs harder. Plz
Rustling Bush1 votesexcept that lucian snowballs harder. Plz
not really, because of his passive, if draven can cs well with his axe and constantly cash it in hes going to have much more gold for items.
JRobin311 votesMaybe it is more accurate to say that if you let Draven cash in on his stacks at any point in early to mid game, then he will wreck your face? But that most of the time players are smart enough to kill him first?
Woook3r2 votesHes a champion that doesnt get the love he deserves. Thats all im trying to point out.
Fowus1 votesone of my friends can juggle 3-4 axes with him