"We are terrified that Amumu and Sejuani might be relevant again and will be monitoring them."

Uiru·Mar 12, 2015·4 votes·921 views

Christ, Riot.

Additionally, joking about Sona's completely unnecessary nerf train doesn't make it any less of an embarrassment for you.

I will say that there appears to be some effort made with this patch to fix several monumental fuckups, and that's good. Now how about for next time we focus on actual problems instead of nerfing the shit out of random champions while four year old tumors go not only untreated, but undiagnosed. ~Uiru

14 Comments

Matthias9119Mar 12, 20152 votes

Amumu and Sejuani have had higher solo queue win rates than Lee (except maybe at very, very high tiers where they're only marginally better) for a long time.

Lee is flashy, and with his mobility he doesn't have many terrible match ups. But he doesn't usually win games singlehandedly unless he gets insanely fed early on.

BlackRavenMar 12, 20151 votes

and nidalee is just as weak as before. never bring her up, just bring up the bandwagon champion. you are too original to even insult! nidalee is the best jungler and the most broken champ but lets keep bringing up lee.

Bears Dont CareMar 12, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Maximum Lee Sin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GE7VHcjH,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-12T01:31:11.770+0000)

and nidalee is just as weak as before. never bring her up, just bring up the bandwagon champion. you are too original to even insult! nidalee is the best jungler and the most broken champ but lets keep bringing up lee.

Nidalee got nerfed so that she wasn't so powerful early game. On top of this, while Nidalee has incredibly clear speed, she lacks CC and is quite reliant upon activating a hunt in order to get to her target.

Lee Sin? One of the most reliable junglers out there.

Now... he isn't the best at everything, but you don't NEED to be the best at it. Sustain? You only need a certain amount to keep yourself full/near full, where as a crab will let you refill what is left.

Damage? Lee Sin has some of the highest damage in the game considering his base damage and AD ratios. Not the best, but its competitive. Let's not have none of that "but he falls off", no duh, anyone who builds defensive items will fall off in terms of damage. Everyone will be squishy if they don't build defensive items. This is not exclusive to Lee Sin!

CC? Lee Sin has 2 of them. While he doesn't have as much as say, Maokai, he doesn't need to because he makes up for it with his damage capability.

When Lee Sin is viable, only a handful of champions are capable of competing with him INCLUDING nidalee. Simply because he has everything you can want from a jungler.

If nidalee is considered the "best" jungler, it is only because of how she can

A. Clear camps so quickly. B. Counter jungle due to clear speed. C. Carry due to her damage output.

Even that is debatable,.

You'd be taken a lot more seriously if you acknowledged there were issues with the Champion, rather than constantly trying to displace it.

BlackRavenMar 12, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Nidalee got nerfed so that she wasn't so powerful early game. On top of this, while Nidalee has incredibly clear speed, she lacks CC and is quite reliant upon activating a hunt in order to get to her target.

Lee Sin? One of the most reliable junglers out there.

Now... he isn't the best at everything, but you don't NEED to be the best at it. Sustain? You only need a certain amount to keep yourself full/near full, where as a crab will let you refill what is left.

Damage? Lee Sin has some of the highest damage in the game considering his base damage and AD ratios. Not the best, but its competitive. Let's not have none of that "but he falls off", no duh, anyone who builds defensive items will fall off in terms of damage. Everyone will be squishy if they don't build defensive items. This is not exclusive to Lee Sin!

CC? Lee Sin has 2 of them. While he doesn't have as much as say, Maokai, he doesn't need to because he makes up for it with his damage capability.

When Lee Sin is viable, only a handful of champions are capable of competing with him INCLUDING nidalee. Simply because he has everything you can want from a jungler.

If nidalee is considered the "best" jungler, it is only because of how she can

A. Clear camps so quickly. B. Counter jungle due to clear speed. C. Carry due to her damage output.

Even that is debatable,.

You'd be taken a lot more seriously if you acknowledged there were issues with the Champion, rather than constantly trying to displace it.

the only issue is that he does his job perfectly and you are too ignorant to realize that. all you want to think is "op this" "op that" theres a reason no one likes you band wagon riders. j4 and nidalee do lees job with less effort now, but you continue to ride that bandwagon till the death.

IcyPepperMar 12, 20151 votes

He had the decency to explain his reasoning but you just rehashed what you already said and just insulted him, adding nothing credible to your argument.

Just saying. Gotta work on that logos.

Bears Dont CareMar 12, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Maximum Lee Sin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GE7VHcjH,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2015-03-12T01:42:20.780+0000)

the only issue is that he does his job perfectly and you are too ignorant to realize that.

Oh no, I disagree with you here. He does his job very well, and other junglers should be at his standard. You are too ignorant to realize most champions are not at his level, and as such, they cannot compete with him. How is Amumu going to compete with Lee Sin? Or Warwick? Or Fiddle sticks? Or Nautilus? They don't.

all you want to think is "op this" "op that" theres a reason no one likes you band wagon riders.

Let me rephrase it for you.

"All you want to do is underplay Lee Sin's strength. He's balanced! There is a reason no one likes Lee Sin mains.

j4 and nidalee do lees job with less effort now, but you continue to ride that bandwagon till the death.

Um..no they don't. J4 saw less play than Lee Sin did in S4. J4 was nerfed. Lee Sin was not nerfed.

If Lee Sin > J4 in S4. Why would Lee Sin < J4 in s5 after Jarvan has been nerfed? Nidalee is all damage, she doesn't have the utility Lee SIn has.

UiruMar 12, 20151 votes

Nidalee has been buffed to shit and is a problem for certain but the thing is, Riot is aware that Nidalee is a problem and occasionally does something about it. Lee Sin doesn't even get wrist slaps anymore. The last time Riot considered doing something about Lee Sin being above average or better at literally everything, the delicate LCS flowers raised such a flood of tears that they went back on the whole thing (because balancing for what looks good vs balancing for balance's sake are two different things and Riot is doing the wrong one right now). ~Uiru

UiruMar 12, 20151 votes

I just now noticed the name, hahaha. ~Uiru

Leti the YetiMar 12, 20151 votes

champions becoming relevant is a bad thing? ;l dafuq riot

360D3GR3SSMar 12, 20151 votes

In this case "relevant" means, "too relevant" meaning they would be so strong all other picks would be drowned out.

360D3GR3SSMar 12, 20151 votes

Lee does not offer nearly as much utility as Sejuani or Amumu. You really can't compare them because Lee is notorious for early game power but falling off while it is the often the exact opposite for Sejuani and Amumu, except their early games are not nearly as comparably bad to Lee Sin's late game.

TLDR: Sej + Amu have opposite power spikes of lee sin however their early game is not as bad as lee's late game.

UiruMar 12, 20151 votes

I'm not sure which is worse, appealing to the lategame falloff (nobody on the receiving end of Lee cares that he will "suck" in 40 minutes when he's making every decision right now), or assuming there will even be a lategame. ~Uiru

IcyPepperMar 12, 20151 votes