With all these already decent champions getting buffs, can Nasus get some love?

HateDaddy··25 votes·1,657 views

I mean, shit.

53 Comments

XxRinkyDinkyxX13 votes

It's pretty sad actually. Riot described him as the perfect juggernaut....

Yet he is by far the worst one currently. He is outclassed in every aspect, even in lategame potency, which is his supposed "fantasy"

Truth is right now, nasus is a midgame champion who fails miserably in most matchups, and becomes decent if he is lucky enough to snowball into lategame, but in lategame 5v5's when everyone is at full build, nasus just flat out sucks compared to other champions in his class. He doesnt have very many, if any situations where he can do something better than a different jugg, not enough for it to matter.

Penns1 votes

Nasus is also the most cancerous champ of his class tho lul. Its kinda like Yorick, even if he needed buffs, no one really wants to see them..

ChuChuMuthaDucka1 votes

More cancerous than Darius healing off you with a q and chunking you for a lot of damage? Please.

Nasus gets dumpstered by any player able to deny farm. His early game is pathetic without stacks. The only ability that meaningfully affects enemy champs early is his wither.

Penns1 votes

At least you can try to deny Darius Q heal, you cant really stop Nasus alone once he has 1 item or even earlier anymore. And unlike basically every other bruiser or juggernaut or whatever, he doesnt have to build 1 offensive item to do damage, trinity just makes it 3 times worse. Vayne isnt "meta" or "good" atm either and many people still complain about her getting buffed because she isnt exactly fun to deal with, and Nasus is even less fun with his free item 3153 life steal at level 1, item 3072 life steal at level 13, 5 second point and click slow with a higher range than most adcs can auto attack from and his 0 cooldown nuke... impossible to dodge of course.

HateDaddy1 votes

{quoted}

At least you can try to deny Darius Q heal, you cant really stop Nasus alone once he has 1 item or even earlier anymore. And unlike basically every other bruiser or juggernaut or whatever, he doesnt have to build 1 offensive item to do damage, trinity just makes it 3 times worse. Vayne isnt "meta" or "good" atm either and many people still complain about her getting buffed because she isnt exactly fun to deal with, and Nasus is even less fun with his free item 3153 life steal at level 1, item 3072 life steal at level 13, 5 second point and click slow with a higher range than most adcs can auto attack from and his 0 cooldown nuke... impossible to dodge of course.

So let's understand a few things

Let's say you run 12/0/18 on Nasus. His base AD isn't very good, so typically you're at around 70 AD with runes and masteries, giving you 13% LS at level 1. Assuming you're able to freely auto attack minions, you're only getting 9 hp back per auto attack, with his Q having 30 base damage, this increases to around 13. Naturally, this is level 1 and his base AD and Q damage do scale up but long story short, his sustain is average early game. Once he hits 7, it does start noticeably scaling up pretty quickly. But Nasus usually wins/loses his lane well before 7 and if he's forced to try and catch up, his sustain won't matter because he will be zoned pretty hard.

Nasus gets more sustain from item 2033 and health potions early game than he does his own sustain. And while I don't think it's bad, he doesn't become this "immovable" wall later on and by then he's either won or lost. To argue that his sustain is significant early is foolish, it really isn't and this is also when he's most prone to being zoned off creeps. Now if you want to argue whether this is healthy or not, you've got a good damn case that it's not and I won't dispute that.

This is why I don't want his lane phase super buffed. 175 range simply makes weaving around through minions a bit easier. 10 extra range on wither gives him an actual threat to the backline in teamfights to the point where you have to account for Nasus withering a target. In exchange, I wouldn't actually mind a slight cooldown increase to stop chain withering, which is pretty unhealthy

As it stands, Nasus isnt that good. The things you have to do to make him work require too much effort and time and it's easier to just play Darius or Illaoi. He doesn't feel rewarding anymore, not for the risk of picking him.

Penns1 votes

Its not that impactful early, but it feels kind of stupid when he finished item 3110 or item 3065 at level 7+ or even 13 and just life steals back to full HP in a few seconds after a trade while youre sitting there like "...wtf?"

HateDaddy1 votes

{quoted}

Its not that impactful early, but it feels kind of stupid when he finished item 3110 or item 3065 at level 7+ or even 13 and just life steals back to full HP in a few seconds after a trade while youre sitting there like "...wtf?"

By the time he's completed those items, he's either completed them quickly and is doing well, in which case you notice his sustain or he doesn't complete them quickly and his sustain is irrelevant because he dies if he goes near creeps. Again, I didn't say this was good design but there are definite windows of vulnerability he faces

Penns1 votes

Well I guess a Nasus player sees his weaknesses more than someone who occasionally gets a top laner that feeds one and has to deal with a 3-4k hp raid boss as assassin. I could tell you 10 reasons why Fizz is kinda bad, or at least not really worth playing over other mid laners, but you would probably still hate playing against him as well (not sure about that if you main Nasus actually lol).

HateDaddy1 votes

{quoted}

Well I guess a Nasus player sees his weaknesses more than someone who occasionally gets a top laner that feeds one and has to deal with a 3-4k hp raid boss as assassin. I could tell you 10 reasons why Fizz is kinda bad, or at least not really worth playing over other mid laners, but you would probably still hate playing against him as well (not sure about that if you main Nasus actually lol).

He's my most played champion but I don't play him much anymore, he's just not worth the risk of picking. I definitely don't think he's exactly fun to play against and I'd prefer a rework to make him healthier but I doubt he's on riots radar tbh

Zerenza1 votes

Yeah the only reason i'd say that a buff would make nasus unhealthy is the fact that if they make him strong enough to safely farm or something, he would probably become insane. It already doesn't matter what you do to a nasus in lane, he's eventually going to reach his power spike where he's unbeatable(and yes i mean unbeatable) and there's nothing you can do about except win the game before he gets there and deny him farm so it takes him longer.

Wither btw is a 90% slow, and nasus can chunk pretty much anyone for 1000+ damage Q's and also health off of them, darius has a limit, nasus does not.

HateDaddy1 votes

{quoted}

Yeah the only reason i'd say that a buff would make nasus unhealthy is the fact that if they make him strong enough to safely farm or something, he would probably become insane. It already doesn't matter what you do to a nasus in lane, he's eventually going to reach his power spike where he's unbeatable(and yes i mean unbeatable) and there's nothing you can do about except win the game before he gets there and deny him farm so it takes him longer.

Wither btw is a 90% slow, and nasus can chunk pretty much anyone for 1000+ damage Q's and also health off of them, darius has a limit, nasus does not.

Nasus sucks late game, the only thing he can do is farm for 35+ minutes to start two shorting structures. And even then, he still can't push as fast as 5 and if Nasus has done nothing but farm for 35 minutes and you haven't taken advantage of 5v4s in a game where TP flanks suck now, you deserve to lose. It takes a long time for Nasus to get to a point where he's hitting you for 1000 damage after armor mitigation. We are easily talking at least 700 stacks.

Carnarius1 votes

{quoted}

Yeah the only reason i'd say that a buff would make nasus unhealthy is the fact that if they make him strong enough to safely farm or something, he would probably become insane. It already doesn't matter what you do to a nasus in lane, he's eventually going to reach his power spike where he's unbeatable(and yes i mean unbeatable) and there's nothing you can do about except win the game before he gets there and deny him farm so it takes him longer.

Wither btw is a 90% slow, and nasus can chunk pretty much anyone for 1000+ damage Q's and also health off of them, darius has a limit, nasus does not.

unbeatable? if we talk about late game, around 50% of top laners will beat him in a 1v1 scenario

PermabannedGaren1 votes

{quoted}

unbeatable? if we talk about late game, around 50% of top laners will beat him in a 1v1 scenario

What top laners are you suggesting can duel a late game Nasus with stacks?

HateDaddy1 votes

Fiora if played well, Jax if he's smart enough to build QSS until 700-800 stacks and Yi until Nasus can one shot him.

PermabannedGaren1 votes

{quoted}

Fiora if played well, Jax if he's smart enough to build QSS until 700-800 stacks and Yi until Nasus can one shot him.

I doubt Fiora tbh, simply because she has to build damage and tends to get bursted down. I've also seen like one good Fiora though, and never while I was playing Nasus.

I consider 700-800 stacks late game on Nasus personally.

Yeah I know Yi can. Though he's uh, not really a top laner.

But see, homie said 50% of the top laners. I'm pretty sure that's not true tbh, lol.

HateDaddy1 votes

{quoted}

I doubt Fiora tbh, simply because she has to build damage and tends to get bursted down. I've also seen like one good Fiora though, and never while I was playing Nasus.

I consider 700-800 stacks late game on Nasus personally.

Yeah I know Yi can. Though he's uh, not really a top laner.

But see, homie said 50% of the top laners. I'm pretty sure that's not true tbh, lol.

No, not at all. Those are literally the only melee champs that can beat Nasus, and fiora would have to hit all vitals and heal A ton from her ult/hydra.

Carnarius1 votes

{quoted}

What top laners are you suggesting can duel a late game Nasus with stacks?

fiora, riven, gnar, jax (with proper build), irelia (with proper build), trundle, tryndamere, gp, olaf, kayle, just to name some of them. nasus would need to have ridiculous amount of stacks to beat them, which never happens in high elo, games are too fast

Only Play Darius2 votes

He **was ** a perfect juggernaut when they said that. At the time, Darius Garen were useless late game, Illaoi didn't exist, and the other juggernauts didn't have items like item 3748 item 3053 item 3071 (none of which Nasus can viably build). They used the "Nasus bar" as the standard of what a juggernaut should be able to do but neglected to do anything for Nasus himself and in the end he got powercreeped by new juggernauts who approach his levels of damage and durability without lacking hard CC or being stuck with a crippled early game.

Gosh Darn1 votes

This. It's not a problem with Nasus it's a problem with items. Ghostblade and cleaver both counter Nasus and it doesn't help that they're super strong on champions that already give Nasus trouble. Meanwhile frozen heart and other defensive items are pathetically gold inefficient and just plain weak.

HateDaddy6 votes

downvoted by Renekton

That's why you got locked into a tomb with xerarth, idiot haha

Zerenza6 votes

It's hard to buff a champion that can't be shut down...He just has to farm properly and he get's fed, if they buffed him, likely at all, he would probably become insane. He already has a 90% slow and infinitely scaling damage along with a pretty good ultimate to keep himself alive, he's just not meta right now because he's bad against champs like Irelia.

HateDaddy2 votes

{quoted}

It's hard to buff a champion that can't be shut down...He just has to farm properly and he get's fed, if they buffed him, likely at all, he would probably become insane. He already has a 90% slow and infinitely scaling damage along with a pretty good ultimate to keep himself alive, he's just not meta right now because he's bad against champs like Irelia.

I would prefer a rework that fixes a lot of his more unhealthy gameplay issues but honestly if brand and Malphite can be buffed, so can Nasus!

bigambrus4 votes

Brand buffs didn't go through, they got removed from PBE before hitting live.

Zerenza1 votes

Yes, that and they don't scale infinitely which is kind of a big deal.

HateDaddy1 votes

{quoted}

Yes, that and they don't scale infinitely which is kind of a big deal.

His infinite scaling hardly matters tbh

TheOvermind2 votes

When was the last time u saw a nasus do somethingike that ?

https://youtu.be/GbX4NzSHaG0

Only Play Darius2 votes

Good days, back when Nasus actually felt like a raid

Now no point in farming 800 stacks when I can farm a mere 5 stacks Darius and do pretty much the same thing

Mr Alexius 272 votes

I don't know if is a good idea buffing him, he as already one of the most powerful slow/attack speed slow with a high base movement speed. Where should you buff him btw?

THE RlVER KlNG2 votes

I think lowering E cooldown early and taking away ult mana cost would fix some of his problems.

Admittedly, though, he still shits on a couple matchups, and I wouldn't want to see buffs that lead to the old S2-S3 jungle rampage.

HateDaddy1 votes

[{quoted}](name=THE RlVER KlNG,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FqmnBYmP,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2016-08-24T12:00:46.505+0000)

I think lowering E cooldown early and taking away ult mana cost would fix some of his problems.

Admittedly, though, he still shits on a couple matchups, and I wouldn't want to see buffs that lead to the old S2-S3 jungle rampage.

Hes ult mana only cost 100 mana, which is standard for ultimates. I don't think he actually needs his cooldowns reduced or his mana costs reduced. His Q cost is negligible and his W/E cost a lot to prevent him from being really good at trading with all his spells. It's what limits him very early on.

I think a good buff would be to give him 175 range and 700 wither range back considering how cheap QSS is and how easily accessible Mikeals for a support is.

THE RlVER KlNG1 votes

Well Renekton has basically the same ult with no cost (admittedly, he does use fury). And his E helps him trade. Giving him his 700 Wither would be a bit strong, although yes, he should have 175 like Tahm and Sion and whoever else.

HateDaddy1 votes

[{quoted}](name=THE RlVER KlNG,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FqmnBYmP,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2016-08-24T18:37:50.298+0000)

Well Renekton has basically the same ult with no cost (admittedly, he does use fury). And his E helps him trade. Giving him his 700 Wither would be a bit strong, although yes, he should have 175 like Tahm and Sion and whoever else.

Yeah but Nasus' ult is way better than Renektons and it's also on a lower cooldown iirc

redfeenix2 votes

We all agree that nasus needs some buffs to improve win rate, however we have to be very careful buffing someone with infinite scaling.

Suggestions: increase base stats Building HP increases the amount of HP gained when ulting

I'm very hesitant to touch his q passive or w for buffs as those could snowball the fk outa control

ChuChuMuthaDucka1 votes

His w has plenty of power how it is, I certainly don't think it needs a buff. His q stacking is his identity, so I hope they won't touch it. That's working just fine, because most champs can deny him farm early if they play right and end the game before Nasus scales enough.

Marshbouy1 votes

Probably not. He's pretty cancerous to fight IMO. Low level powerhouse, not so great at high elo. If you don't know how to kite you get destroyed, if you don't know how to zone, you get destroyed, if you don't know how to stop a splitpush, you get destroyed. He's just not fun to face in low elo. He's basically a slightly more complicated master yi.

PermabannedGaren1 votes

{quoted}

Probably not. He's pretty cancerous to fight IMO. Low level powerhouse, not so great at high elo. If you don't know how to kite you get destroyed, if you don't know how to zone, you get destroyed, if you don't know how to stop a splitpush, you get destroyed. He's just not fun to face in low elo. He's basically a slightly more complicated master yi.

Yi is considerably more complicated than Nasus, lol.

Marshbouy1 votes

lol no

PermabannedGaren1 votes

{quoted}

lol no

Yep, mechanically there is no comparison. Both have low skill floors (though Nasus' is still lower), but Yi's mechanical skill cap is much higher than Nasus'. Nasus does require a fair amount of game knowledge to play, but by that same token so does Master Yi.

What makes you think Nasus is more complicated than Yi?

Maximum Morde1 votes
morris11 votes

I'd suggest a slight decrease to his mana costs. He shouldn't all in at earlier levels but even using W defensively takes a chunk out of his mana. At max rank his E also costs 130 mana, which is later only used as an unreliable armor shred.

Poske1 votes

The fact that laneswaps got nerfed is his buff

A Bad Nasus1 votes

No because Nasus mains are the most cancerous players in the game. No one wants to see them and its all part of Riot's plan to make League great again.

He will never be even remotely viable like he was in season 3, that was devestating for League, a mistake they learned from and have since moved on to bigger and better things. Hasagi is where its at, Z-drive is true balance, and you just need to take a Leap of Faith and see for yourself the masterpiece that is League in its true glory Arise!

Shahamut1 votes

Yasuo Ekko Illaoi Azir

Did I get them all?

agbudar1 votes

make his Q zero mana costs

edit: against a riven counterpick that will be the only thing keeping him in lane enough for him to get were he needs to be

his main weakness that during laning he will go OOm in a couple of trades with the use of W+E then again this is something that could make him very very toxic

safer would be to increase his base health regen+scaling a bit

Shahamut1 votes

I refuse to accept any nasus buffs until they do something about Whither... that thing is waaaay too stronk.

EDIT- Unless of course you are Riven. 4 dashes and a flash CAN in fact keep you in range or get away as needed.

Lugg1 votes

Nasus is completely fine. They just need to gut the OP top laners to some sense of balance.

paperbIade1 votes

which top laners are you talking about

Lugg1 votes

Irelia itemizes WAY too well right now. You can absolutely dumpster her in the laning phase, but she will be a monster still around level 9 and later Jax same as Irelia Swain Vladimir are both very safe and so hard to deal with mid and late game Gangplank has needed gutting since the rework. He is probably the strongest champ in the game. Darius same as GP, just not quite as strong. He either needs to lose the heal or the ult resets. Illaoi is just plain broken. She is stupidly OP in a lot matchups and very weak against some. Yasuo tank Yas needs gutted like Fizz and Ekko. Kayle probably the best ult in the game and doesn't pay for it anywhere in her kit.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

is Nasus in the LCS, LKS, ect? no? then most likely not til hell freezes over

TyrekGoldenspear1 votes

He could, just shoot Riot some suggestions and they can cook up a hot Ascended girlfriend for him or something.

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Oh wait a minute, you didn't mean like that...

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