I see too many people rushing 
against me and it's annoying because building penetration against it costs so much gold compared to the 1300 gold that needs to be spent to drastically lower magic damage taken. It's so good that people don't bother finishing the item.
If rito nerfs hextrinker and buffs maw, poeple buying the item will have to buy the whole item for maximum item efficiency.
MunchCrunchLunch3 votesyeah maw kind of got hit too hard. its just meant to be defensive but its not good enough to do anything anymore after they nerfed the mr off it. I think hex could lose 5 MR and full item gets +10 mr
Pierce The Veal2 votesThe last part makes sense.
But let's not forget that seeker's armguard gives 45 armor.
Doodlzzz4 votesJust saying that even though seeker's armguard is pretty good, finishing the item into 
is much more beneficial because of the item active.
Pierce The Veal1 votesJust saying that even though seeker's armguard is pretty good, finishing the item into
I agree. However, in the case that you need damage, it might behoove you to rush an actual damage item instead of zhonya's.
undesirable team3 votes
gives +1 gold per kill, 7 ad, and 3 life on hit for 450 gold?!?!?
wow rito psl
Muzét1 votesActually it gives 170gold. 1x100 + 350 (gold bonus for 100kill) and 170g on sellback :D
Pierce The Veal1 votes
Yeah it's too good. Gut it so it is guaranteed a 0% winrate.
Muzét4 votesLet's not forget that you need to farm before getting those you "waste" time while AD just can buy Hexdrinker and sit on it while building Lethality to "counter" your armor.
Pierce The Veal1 votesLet's not forget that you need to farm before getting those you "waste" time while AD just can buy Hexdrinker and sit on it while building Lethality to "counter" your armor.
Worst that can happen is you don't fight with them. Play safe. Is that so hard? You'll outscale them. But wait, sitting back and farming like the AD is content doing is hard.
They buy lethality and magic resist? Buy haunting guise, gives hp, AP, and magic pen. But noooo, that ruins my dream build as AP.
After you get an AP item or two they're still pissing you off? Get a deadman's plate. More mobility, armor, and HP. They won't kill you anytime soon.
I'm just really sick of AD'shaving to find something that works and playing a cookie cutter build, only for everyone to whine about it.
Odds are, unless they're graves or quinn, they're going to be melee. Bully the fuck out of them. Use your auto attacks. Yes, your auto attacks, they deal PHYSICAL DAMAGE.
Muzét2 votesI'm not against playing safe. I usually do it. But, they tend to roam a lot more if you're playing too safe. So don't start acting like a omnipotent being.
I do built Liandry path only on champions who can make a use of it. I won't build it on Lux cause I want heavy AP and a Void Staff rather than a flat MPen Atm. I want to shred them specially if they're starting to build 
or 
. Let's face it, if they build at least two of those item the little 15Mpen from haunting Guise won't help you AT ALL.
Of course i'm going to build 
on most of midlaners (if not any of them). Specially when I prefer to play artillery mages or burst one that don't want to be at auto attack range (which means that AD can easily reach you)
Na. It's not AD Shaving. I'm just tired to see AD just sit on a middle tier item throughout the game like it was a complete item and can win most of the trade cause even if we're even he'll still have a shield 250 (without taking in account the item resistances) that can fuck any AP Midlaners Burst Combo.
I do use them. A lot more with Lux than any other Midlaners tho. But as I stated earlier you need to take a consideration a lot of factors and usually AD Melee Mid are assassins and got dashes / blink that can be pretty much punitive sometimes even when you just want to cs with your auto attacks.
Hexdrinker should be nerf let's face it. The item is too well-rounded.
Pierce The Veal1 votesI'm not against playing safe. I usually do it. But, they tend to roam a lot more if you're playing too safe. So don't start acting like a omnipotent being.
I do built Liandry path only on champions who can make a use of it. I won't build it on Lux cause I want heavy AP and a Void Staff rather than a flat MPen Atm. I want to shred them specially if they're starting to build
Of course i'm going to build
Na. It's not AD Shaving. I'm just tired to see AD just sit on a middle tier item throughout the game like it was a complete item and can win most of the trade cause even if we're even he'll still have a shield 250 (without taking in account the item resistances) that can fuck any AP Midlaners Burst Combo.
I do use them. A lot more with Lux than any other Midlaners tho. But as I stated earlier you need to take a consideration a lot of factors and usually AD Melee Mid are assassins and got dashes / blink that can be pretty much punitive sometimes even when you just want to cs with your auto attacks.
Hexdrinker should be nerf let's face it. The item is too well-rounded.
Sure enough, hexdrinker is a strong item. But I won't say it's broken op like you're quick to jump to.
Roaming is countered by shoving lane. As a mage, you should be able to do that with ease, no?
Biggest problem is saying "I won't counter build on abc champion because I have to build xyz way." And then you whine about your opponent counterbuilding and it being too effective. Seriously stop whining about hexdrinker, everyone who builds it except graves is balanced or on the weak sids, if not utter shit. The only issue here is you're upset an item can make a champion be able to somewhat face you.
Muzét2 votesIt is.
Yeah kinda i'm okay with that since most of the time I get the First Tower since they're romaing but sometimes when they get fed through the roma i'm like "Hmm kay then."
Well as a mage you need immediate sustain and the armguard is clearly poor against its ad equivalent specially when mage got a harsher MANA-gement (mana management get it?) than AD (when they have it.) And Haunting Guise doesn't counter in anyway hexdrinker. Like 15Mpen against ~150 Shield (usually when you can but iy) + 35MR if I remember correctly. That just doesn't work at all? The only item you can build is Void Stafe and you need some CDR before > 
2900g and then you can consider the void staff that cost 2650g.
LongHair Fox2 votesHexdrinker might be too efficient but like zhonya you get a lot by completing it. It should also be noted that you should never be able to outrace defensive stats with flat penetration. Same goes for lehtality and armguard. If anything is too strong on hexdrinker it is the shield being on too low of a cd or the shield being too large.
Blakiepug1 votes[{quoted}](name=LongHair Fox,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FYPoLATn,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-04-23T20:01:11.787+0000)
Hexdrinker might be too efficient but like zhonya you get a lot by completing it. It should also be noted that you should never be able to outrace defensive stats with flat penetration. Same goes for lehtality and armguard. If anything is too strong on hexdrinker it is the shield being on too low of a cd or the shield being too large.
Personally I would say Hexdrinker's shield is probably a bit too large. But what OP is trying to get at is, yes Zhonya's you get a lot by completing that item, so why aren't people completing Maw? I see tons of players rush a Hexdrinker, then act like it's a full-build item. You never see anyone rush a 
and leave it like that for the rest of the game.
LongHair Fox1 votesThe reason for that is quite simple: hexdrinker does act as a small maw with its passive, and it can do so because maw passive while good is not exactly extremely good. Meanwhile armguard cannot have the active of zhonya because zhonya has the best active in the game.
I do get that there might be a problem with hexdrinker but the mr focus that op had is certainly not the reason why, heck his focus on building flat pen to counter mr is likely a factor why he feels it is too good.
Also note: the extra things maw gives beside a larger shield is mainly lifesteal and spell vamp, both of which are not good in lane when only applied for a short time.
Blakiepug2 votes[{quoted}](name=LongHair Fox,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FYPoLATn,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2017-04-23T20:39:03.604+0000)
The reason for that is quite simple: hexdrinker does act as a small maw with its passive, and it can do so because maw passive while good is not exactly extremely good. Meanwhile armguard cannot have the active of zhonya because zhonya has the best active in the game.
I do get that there might be a problem with hexdrinker but the mr focus that op had is certainly not the reason why, heck his focus on building flat pen to counter mr is likely a factor why he feels it is too good.
Also note: the extra things maw gives beside a larger shield is mainly lifesteal and spell vamp, both of which are not good in lane when only applied for a short time.
I get what you're saying about penetration and how it shouldn't be able to "outrace" resistances. However, when talking about Hexdrinker, this item also gives you AD. I do think it is the shield it gives that is the problem, but it should also be noted that Hexdrinker isn't a purely defensive item. AD champs who build Hexdrinker, and only Hexdrinker, for their MR itemization shouldn't be getting as many defensive stats until they finish the item.
LongHair Fox1 votesArmguard also gives AP though. Hexdrinker might be too good adefensive item due to its shield but on the mr side I am not convinced. The main reason why hexdrinker feels so good as a rush item compared to armguard is definitely the shield, and I think the reason riot has allowed that is because you can actually counter the shield by poking or disengaging when the shield pops.
Blakiepug1 votes[{quoted}](name=LongHair Fox,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FYPoLATn,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2017-04-23T21:57:49.462+0000)
Armguard also gives AP though. Hexdrinker might be too good adefensive item due to its shield but on the mr side I am not convinced. The main reason why hexdrinker feels so good as a rush item compared to armguard is definitely the shield, and I think the reason riot has allowed that is because you can actually counter the shield by poking or disengaging when the shield pops.
Yes I agree with you. The shield makes it too strong to rush and then leave as is. Armguard does give AP in addition to the armor, but the armor isn't overwhelming enough to shut out much AD damage. Hexdrinker's passive shield in addition to the MR work too well together at stopping AP damage. Maybe a good solution would be to make Hexdrinker basically the exact AD equivalent of Armguard where it unlocks more MR for kills. Then if you want that full shield you gotta finish constructing Maw. This might also lower Maw's cost slightly as a result, but at least it would push people to finish the item if they want to reap it's full benefits.
LongHair Fox1 votesYou could do that but then you need to make maw a rush worthy item. As it is zhonya has the best active in the game making it a decent rush item into certain matchups, meanwhile a shield and some vamp is not going to cut it for maw unless it has extremely good stats.
Geshultz2 votesIssue is that Maw is not gold efficient for its high completion price of 3250 gold and doesn't offer anything worthwhile on completion compared to just sitting on hex drinker and spending rest of the gold towards core itemization and that hexdrinker is also gold efficient unlike maw and already has the main benefit of maw already with the shield. meaning there is very little incentive to build maw. If they added something like lifesteal/omivamp passive I could see it being more useful to upgrade maw sooner and remove lifeline if they add lifesteal/omipassive.
Blakiepug1 votesI agree, especially lately I have seen many players get Hexdrinker but never finish the item. A mid-tier item shouldn't be so powerful that people feel they can reap all of Maw's benefits without actually finishing Maw itself.
Chembaron Yamada1 votesI can think of some items which are like that, though.
