I noticed the strongest early game champs all have 1 thing in common.

Radiant Wukong·Jul 21, 2018·2 votes·3,442 views

Damage Reduction/Nullification

Maybe even but I can't say for sure, depends on the match-up. Theoretically, I can see her dominating mid lane against a skill shot champ that relies heavily on 1 ability to set up their combo, come to mind.

Edit: To simplify it for people since the term "early game" can be interpreted in multiple ways, instead, I'll say, strong 1v1 duelers in early game. Same can be said for champions with a heal/shield. Like Rumble has a ridiculously strong laning phase against every melee champ there is, with Illaoi probably being the absolute only exception. When I say, early, I mean champions you don't want to fight 1v1 at level 3

26 Comments

feintfiendJul 21, 20183 votes

" MasterYi and Irelia are early game champions" Lmao this is so untrue, Fiora is a late game champion but her early isn't bad because of parry and passive Lux Is widely considered to have the most bullshit hitboxes on her spells and Veigar 's abilities aren't that tough to land. You get a guaranteed w and q if the cage(which is very easy to hit) hits them.

redniwediSJul 21, 20183 votes

Garen does not have a strong early game. He is a mid game champion through and through. Champions that actually have strong early games force him to play passive, he's just good at punishing mistakes.

He's also a rather weak duelist as duelists go. He really is only good at punishing people when they make mistakes.

Madsin25Jul 21, 20182 votes

Punishing mistakes? Didn't realize farming under the turret was a mistake.

There is no counterplay against garen when you are playing an immobile squishy. You get silenced and you die.

redniwediSJul 21, 20182 votes

An oversimplification if I've ever seen one. Garen is strong right now because the meta is preventing his strongest counterpicks from seeing regular play. He can get a lead, and with that lead he can do some silly stuff, but it's a lead that does not describe how two champions interact when on equal ground.

There's plenty of counterplay if you kite and don't miss whatever CC you have, however limited it may be. Also if you can actually name a champion that is immobile, squishy, and gets shut down by silence I'd be very surprised.

feintfiendJul 21, 20181 votes

{quoted}

An oversimplification if I've ever seen one. Garen is strong right now because the meta is preventing his strongest counterpicks from seeing regular play. He can get a lead, and with that lead he can do some silly stuff, but it's a lead that does not describe how two champions interact when on equal ground.

There's plenty of counterplay if you kite and don't miss whatever CC you have, however limited it may be. Also if you can actually name a champion that is immobile, squishy, and gets shut down by silence I'd be very surprised.

Garen is busted against squishies that rely on abilities. He just braindead runs at you silences you with q procs grasp gets in a few autos and runs away with nothing you can do because the silence is so damn long.

redniwediSJul 21, 20181 votes

Busted no, strong yes.

Squishies that rely on abilities either have CC that can easily land on someone who has to run at you, or are not so immobile that he can just run you down at all times. Every squishy that is completely shut down by a 1.5 second silence has tools that can be used to prevent Garen from getting on top of them.

If you want to talk balance/counters/strategy I'd be happy to, but you're sounding posting like someone who will deny reality just for the sake of not being wrong. Not saying that's how you are, but your post here really does have that style to it.

NalisaiJul 21, 20181 votes

{quoted}

An oversimplification if I've ever seen one. Garen is strong right now because the meta is preventing his strongest counterpicks from seeing regular play. He can get a lead, and with that lead he can do some silly stuff, but it's a lead that does not describe how two champions interact when on equal ground.

There's plenty of counterplay if you kite and don't miss whatever CC you have, however limited it may be. Also if you can actually name a champion that is immobile, squishy, and gets shut down by silence I'd be very surprised.

Umm... Fiddlesticks support is one of the most banned right now more because of the silence than the poke. The silence shuts down EVERYBODY. No combo for you. Don't pass GO. Don't collect $200. Immobile squishies that get shut down by this? Caitlyn Blitzcrank Heimerdinger Jhin Jinx Karthus KogMaw Morgana Nami Quinn Nunu Sona Soraka Maokai Malzahar Thresh Veigar Varus Twitch Xayah Vayne Ziggs Zyra .... I miss anyone? That's a long list that get stopped by ONE ability. (And now my cat got out of the bag... sigh )

[EDIT} And yes I did include a few tank supports there, because they're squishy early on and very susceptible to free auto-targeting poke.

redniwediSJul 21, 20181 votes

Fiddle also doesn't have to get into melee range to apply it. Ranged silence is significantly stronger than melee range silence.

As for the list, you've listed a few champs that are not squishy and more than a few that rely on auto attacks over abilities, and are therefore not shut down by silence. There's even a couple with decent mobility.

I will admit you have a few on there that I wasn't thinking of, that are immobile, squishy, and get shut down by silence (at least immobile mages have CC, rip Sona), but most of your list is just squishy people who get wrecked when out of position.

Silence does not stop auto attackers. Don't even bother listing them.

Colton147Jul 21, 20181 votes

{quoted}

An oversimplification if I've ever seen one. Garen is strong right now because the meta is preventing his strongest counterpicks from seeing regular play. He can get a lead, and with that lead he can do some silly stuff, but it's a lead that does not describe how two champions interact when on equal ground.

There's plenty of counterplay if you kite and don't miss whatever CC you have, however limited it may be. Also if you can actually name a champion that is immobile, squishy, and gets shut down by silence I'd be very surprised.

Veigar

TheUrbanKitsuneJul 21, 20182 votes

O_o

Garen Irelia MasterYi Fiora Sivir Veigar

Early game???

(Also when was the last time you saw a Sivir in ranked? I honestly cannot recall seeing her in the past year or so)

Radiant WukongJul 21, 20181 votes

You clearly didn't read the post it all, the fact that you included Sivir or Veigar is proof of that. Don't comment on my shit if you don't actually read what I typed. Shit is annoying, begone troll.

TheUrbanKitsuneJul 21, 20181 votes

I did read. "Maybe even Sivir but I can't say for sure, depends on the match-up. Theoretically, I can see her dominating mid lane against a skill shot champ that relies heavily on 1 ability to set up their combo."

Since when was Sivir ever good early? And the way you set up the post insinuates you think these are all good early. SO either YOU'RE the one trolling me, or you're bronze? :p

Radiant WukongJul 21, 20181 votes

Add me in game, I pick Sivir, you pick Lux Morgana Ahri Veigar and I'll show you.

TheUrbanKitsuneJul 21, 20181 votes

I mean Sivir's spellshield is 22 / 19 / 16 / 13 / 10 cooldown

Lux's Q is 10s Morg Q is 11s Ahri E is 12s Veigar E is 18 / 17 / 16 / 15 / 14s

So unless for some reason you decide to max spellshield first.... lol plus you're assuming you time it properly and don't get baited into using it.

I'm not even going to bother with the childish "add me in game" thing.

Radiant WukongJul 22, 20181 votes

Education is childish? You sound like a horrible teacher and an even worse student. If you can't put your theory to test, you should just not talk.

Words without action hold 0 weight. Get your weight up.

TheUrbanKitsuneJul 22, 20181 votes

LOL how on earth is that education? And it's not a theory, I've played Sivir mid before for the lols with friends, and if you ask literally anyone else they will probably tell you it's a bad idea. She can only spellshield 1 ability every 22 seconds, her waveclear is pretty much the only thing she has going for her in mid lane where almost all the champions focus on burst, and with ADC's taking so long to scale up right now and games being extremely short, it's just not a logical pick.

horrible teacher and an even worse student.

At least I am giving actual reasons as to why this won't worl as opposed to your:

Theoretically, I can see her dominating mid lane against a skill shot champ that relies heavily on 1 ability to set up their combo

As you proceed to list off champions who's hard cc ability is on a shorter cooldown than Sivir's spellshield.

Radiant WukongJul 22, 20181 votes

plus you're assuming you time it properly and don't get baited into using it.

You some type of skill shot God?

TheUrbanKitsuneJul 22, 20181 votes

I'm not talking about myself. I'm talking in general, a concept your "1v1 me bro" focused mentality doesn't seem to grasp.

Personally I'm pretty decent at landing my skillshots, I'm no pro, but yes, I could probably outplay a Bronze 1 Wukong main if I had to.

But to clarify, I meant if you took Sivir mid, you'd probably get dumpstered if you laned against any semi-decent player.

Radiant WukongJul 22, 20181 votes

If you can't prove it, you're irrelevant and dismissed. I live on Earth, the show me planet. When you get out of fantasy land, I'll welcome back the right way. Notice on all my not diamond accounts, I rarely ever use Wukong. Since he's being permabanned in high elo right now anyway, I've been learning new champs.

For example, I'm on a 27 match losing streak trying to figure out how to use GP, while my Wukong still sits at a 71% win rate.

Then you have my 100% win rate champs, Yorick Illaoi that I use when I know I need to climb.

11 losses in a row with Aatrox.

Keep in mind, these are all ranked matches. What better way to learn.

Back to the topic since you can't stay on subject. Sivir spell shield works for every other ability and is on lower CD at later ranks. I only need Sivir's spell shield for every other ability.

Furthermore, Sivir has god tier wave clearing and her 1 skill shots goes through minions and champions. Her other bounces between minions and champions. So if you're stupid enough to put yourself behind enemy minions to try to land your skill shot, you'd die.

I never challenged you to 1v1, I asked you to send me a request so I can show you. Customer match, summoner's rift, early game. I did specifically say mid lane, which is a freaking 1v1 situation.

Anyways, as a 25 year old college graduate with 2 careers, I feel extremely stupid having this conversation with you. I'm done stooping to your level. Enjoy your entire life, noob.

TheUrbanKitsuneJul 22, 20181 votes

52% Win rate on Wukong 54% Win rate Bronze 1 with 171 ranked games this season Bronze 3 last season Shitty KDA's on pretty much every champ

Yeah sure, you're Diamond kid.

Didn't even bother reading the rest bc I'm laughing too hard. Cya around~

Radiant WukongJul 23, 20181 votes

That awkward moment you realize I haven't played on this account in 5 months and I play daily. I stopped using this account because I didn't like my placement.

You want to know hilarious? You have a 39% win rate of you last 50 games [zombie-brand-clap]

Might be time for you to start making other accounts, too buddy.

TheUrbanKitsuneJul 23, 20182 votes

47%, not sure where you got 39% from XD Which is still sorta oof, but that's probably from playing silly shit with my friends in norms~ I know having friends to goof around with is probably a hard concept for you.

La BelloJul 21, 20182 votes

Actually the strongest early game champions usually rely on

-Range to bully their opponents with Aatrox Caitlyn Gangplank Heimerdinger (SEE:Ranged champions at top lane such as Quinn Jayce Kennen Gnar or Teemo ) -Sustain and/or lack of mana so they can win the lane via aatrition Aatrox Garen Chogath Tryndamere Gnar Soraka Illaoi Akali -Extremely strong trading which gives them the ability to zone the opponents off the creeps by mere prescence Renekton Aatrox Darius Rumble Riven Illaoi

Fízz v2Jul 21, 20181 votes

Irelia strong early tho?

Radiant WukongJul 21, 20181 votes

To simplify it for people since the term "early game" can be interpreted in multiple ways, instead, I'll say, strong 1v1 duelers in early game. Same can be said for champions with a heal/shield. Like Rumble has a ridiculously strong laning phase against every melee champ there is, with Illaoi probably being the absolute only exception.

When I say, early, I mean champions you don't want to fight 1v1 at level 3.