Irelia passive and R are her biggest design problems

Moody P··36 votes·12,201 views

and imo the reason she will consistently be a pro/high elo problem until addressed.

Her passive is several modest-to-strong steroids that starts off valuable, scales excellently, and is on for the entire period of any fight she takes. She also gets multiple stacks for ragging multiple enemies with her passive, unlike, say, Darius who has to hit the same person 5 times. Why this ends up being an issue is that Irelia is very good at continuing a fight, and especially in the mid lane but also in favorable top lane matchups, she can come off as almost unfairly good at just running you down if you don't zone yourself off the wave after she starts stacking up minions, on top of how well her kit scales.

Second, her ultimate is just never a tool that is bad. A while back they removed the disarm mechanic and then buffed its damage and slow (to 90%) and I think they should have done the opposite. This very generic and effective tool is IMO a huge contribution to her everlasting pro presence because its almost always valuable and its value is never weakened by what the enemy team has picked.

Lastly, her W; I see complaints from time to time that her W feels like a bit of a dead spell, and its only useful for getting your stacks up. I've played a little bit of her myself and I can say, I sort of understand that sentiment.

I feel like her ultimate is the easiest to fix; enhancing her niche and giving her a stronger and clearer identity as the antiADC backline diver, and cutting out the fat of generic power in her R for returning its disarm, is the best choice.

I believe that the best way to fix her passive is changing it back into something like her old Hiten Style; where she has a simple button tap, a cool down around it, and she plays to that strength. You can add a condition to that effect where she still has to work for optimized damage beforehand, but having a clear steroid downtime is definitely something that would make her design healthier. I think it would also make her more accessible, which would help bridge soloQ and pro performance if she's easier to pick up.

What catches me on this proposal is that I don't know what her passive should be if I had my way on this. But I think this is the right track.

18 Comments

ihateyouallmuted14 votes

when you give a character infinite instant dashes, they are essentially immune to skill shots at a certain level (kek yasuo but his aren't literally blink of an eye). throw back to that time irelia went through a j4 eq combo with her q in lck.

TheBrothersGrymm8 votes

the q healing and the fact it procs tiamat is also bullshit

we havent met3 votes

I dont see how, it's on hit. Fiora q does the same exact thing.. as do pretty much all on hit abilities

AS I LAY FEEDING2 votes

{quoted}

the q healing and the fact it procs tiamat is also bullshit

Thats because you can dance around minions without dying to them, thats where the high skill high reward thing is with irelia.

FSRER5 votes

Straight up remove her and put her on "pending a rework". Her design for all things you already mentioned is bad, really really bad. They took the old Irelia which was a champion who's speciality was going to the backline and with her passive taking less damage and applying pressure leaving her team to fight the frontline, to this abomination who dashes into the frontline, the to the backline, front, back, front, back until everything is dead within seconds and she is still alive because any stun/heavy damage skillshot was impossible to hit her. Honestly, i prefered to fight and play old Irelia way more than now

voidscaler3 votes

Imo irelias problem (as has already been stated) is her mobility With her q getting instant resets and being so fast she is effectively immune to skillshots and can't be locked down or ran away from This outs her in such an awfull spot to play against Imo her q should be where the change is Infinity dashes should NOT be in the game, no matter the champion "identity" or what they had before Her q should get a flat nerf, the reset should be removed in favour of just a shorter cd (2 seconds on kill for instance) and only 1 reset per w or ult (all other marks consumed when one is)

GilxeN5 votes

Old Irelia also had Q reset's and no one cried about... Also she had true damage, NO ONE cried about her, she was weak and shit champ, viable only top.

Z3SIeeper3 votes

I don’t know about that one bud. There’s a reason she got nerf after nerf after nerf.

The main complaint back then was her E though. And before that just how overloaded her entire kit was.

Moody P2 votes

only thing I dont like about her Q is that it puts her behind me and I swear it lets her phase through skillshots that would have hit any other champion

Z3SIeeper2 votes

She really doesn't even need it either. She already has 50 more range than every other melee champion.

Doesn't even put her at max range behind you either so you don't have the option of outplaying by moving forward (w/out dashing). It puts her like directly behind you, probably something like 25 units.

voidscaler1 votes

Old irelias q cost more mana and had a longer cd, and it only reset on minion kill meaning you didn't get multiple Vs champions And her true damage was nerfed a dozen times

Also she wasn't "weak and shit"

Z3SIeeper3 votes

Her passive needs to be reliant on her skills and proper skill usage.

Imo the basic attack duration extension should be removed. She should have to land and space out her abilities if she wants to keep it up.

Linna Excel2 votes

While it's possible to fix her, I think I'd be happier if riot took her back to the drawing board. For me the psychic blades idea was a failure from launch largely because I think that kind of theme needs a champ to be ranged and would probably require her to be half xayah and half katarina. It's not a terrible idea, but it's too far from the diving bruiser irelia is meant to be. If it were up to me, I'd drop everything but the Q and start over on her.

For her passive, I think I'd just give her a few small stats every time she AAs that last a few seconds. So basically Jax, but not AS. Maybe she could get AR, MR, and tenacity. This would be slightly better than her old passive, but would require her to work for it and she wouldn't necessarily have it up at the start of a fight.

Her W I think I'd make it toss her blades out to a point, damaging stuff along the way, and disable her autos and E. If she presses W again it comes back her and if she presses Q she dashes right to it. I think this would be an interesting tool to use either as an engage, a reposition, or an escape. Give it a 20 second CD though so it's not endless mobility and that with the fact she can't auto or E while the blades are out means you'd have to be very smart about using it because you are giving up a lot of damage for a few seconds.

I'd make her E a stunless version of her old E. It's a basic hit that heals her for %missing health plus a tiny bit extra and does damage based on %current health plus a small/medium amount. If her Q is a finisher, I think her E being a starter or held for the heal would make it complementary and less reliable as a killing tool as things go on. I think it would make her easier to balance in the long run. If she needs a stun, that could be moved to her ult.

Not sure what to do with the ult.

Sathelight2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Linna Excel,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BahzI%%%,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-08-05T04:36:54.241+0000)

Her W I think I'd make it toss her blades out to a point, damaging stuff along the way, and disable her autos and E. If she presses W again it comes back her and if she presses Q she dashes right to it. I think this would be an interesting tool to use either as an engage, a reposition, or an escape. Give it a 20 second CD though so it's not endless mobility and that with the fact she can't auto or E while the blades are out means you'd have to be very smart about using it because you are giving up a lot of damage for a few seconds.

That's an interesting idea. It would give her an uncoditional disengage and she could be played as a squishy assassin, which would probably be healthier in mid lane. Her current W is useful vs turrets, mitigating ad burst or managing minion wave but it's terrible in teamfights since they removed ap dmg reduction. Repositioning or disengaging might make more sense.

I'd make her E a stunless version of her old E. It's a basic hit that heals her for %missing health plus a tiny bit extra and does damage based on %current health plus a small/medium amount. If her Q is a finisher, I think her E being a starter or held for the heal would make it complementary and less reliable as a killing tool as things go on. I think it would make her easier to balance in the long run. If she needs a stun, that could be moved to her ult.>

If she's meant to be played in top lane she needs a stun. Her current E stuns for 0.75 sec so it's more of a marking tool than anything else. It's also telegraped and easy to dodge unless you're engaging with ult.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Sylas had a skill that healed him for % missing health and dealt dmg based on current health and it was kinda hard to balance.

Not sure what to do with the ult.

I really like OP's idea to lower the dmg and bring back disarm. It was a cool mechanic combined with shieldbreaker but I guess it became too powerful once they switched her dmg output to auto attacks. It wasn't as oppressive when she had to land all her spells to kill someone but they tried to force her back into top lane and here we are.

SiG DxD1 votes

they were going to nerf irelia they said

but then they released prestige /project

so no more nerfs ,exactly like pyke

BremerdanGorst1 votes

I think it would help if they allowed autoattacks to stack it, but Irelia was unable to stack on minions (I suppose they can leave it on monsters), because as it is now, it just allows her to trade too favorably simply by last hitting with Q to keep passive stacks and fishing for an all-in on an E hit.

Scorpio Szn1 votes

This wouldn’t solve anything but lower her solo queue performance. Her passive is quite literally the only thing keeping her remotely relevant (obviously, since all her damage goes into it) and without it fully stacked she’s arguably the easiest champion in the game to all in.

preternatural1 votes

she's not a problem though she's a skill matchup.

More from Gameplay

More by Moody P