Unnecessary power

Danny DeVito·Oct 4, 2016·81 votes·6,377 views

https://i.gyazo.com/6f232c9b41c152f8a7084eca1aebea70.png

175 Comments

Urf Mode Is LifeOct 4, 201623 votes

leesin is the most overloaded champion in league but most people disagree and say he is fine... that is till he presses R followed by a Q - Q dash and 2 shots you

Danny DeVitoOct 4, 201622 votes

[{quoted}](name=Urf Mode Is Life,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BMww7MLj,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-10-04T23:13:03.863+0000)

leesin is the most overloaded champion in league but most people disagree and say he is fine... that is till he presses R followed by a Q - Q dash and 2 shots you

He really isn't overloaded compared to some of the more recent champions Riot has put out. For an ultimate that game changing, that damage is really absurd. I remember once long ago there was a nerf to it one PBE where its base damage was going to be very small, but with an increased ratio. People cried and it was reverted.

Urf Mode Is LifeOct 4, 201622 votes

[{quoted}](name=l SHOT HARAMBE,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BMww7MLj,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-10-04T23:16:05.375+0000)

He really isn't overloaded compared to some of the more recent champions Riot has put out. For an ultimate that game changing, that damage is really absurd. I remember once long ago there was a nerf to it one PBE where its base damage was going to be very small, but with an increased ratio. People cried and it was reverted.

hes got a skillshot poke with good scaling hes got a gap closer hes got an attack speed boost hes got a defenssive / offenssive leap to jump to allies / wards he has a shield he has a stealth detect he has a slow he has life steal / spell vamp he has a high damage ult with a built in suppress

name ANY other champion with that many different things in their kit...

His kit isnt "OP" But it is most definitly overloaded

AstôlfoOct 4, 201621 votes

Let's see what I can do...

He gets a free ability every 5 autos, upon recalling, respawning, and starting the game.

He can deal up to 1000 true damage against a monster and heal himself with a scaling that includes 75% AP ratio. Each time he does this, he gains out of combat MS, max health, and size, and refreshes stacks every time he uses this ability.

He has a 12-second long attack and movement speed buff that can be self-cast which then applies it to the nearest ally as well.

He has a cheap, relatively short cooldown, point and click ability that deals damage with NINETY PERCENT AP SCALING and has a slow built in.

He has a gigantic AoE ultimate that immediately deals a 25% slow that increases to 95% and can deal up to 1125 base damage + TWO HUNDRED AND FIFTY PERCENT AP DAMAGE.

And... it's Nunu.

You can make any champion sound overloaded by wording them in specific ways. So what?

RaoulOct 4, 201630 votes

Difference: He just said the abilities Lee Sin had, you on the other hand used wording to make every ability sound way more than it is.

If you did it the same way he said it, your list would end like that:

gets a free cast every 5 autohits
Q is like a smite
has a selfheal
gains bonuses based on monters he used his smite like abilits on
has Movement speed boost
Has attack speed boost
has a massive AoE slow
has a massive potential nuke
point and click slow

And sry, that doesnt sound nearly as impressive as Lee Sins list.

AstôlfoOct 4, 201610 votes

free ability every 5 autos, on respawn, on game start, and on recall
q is a smite that gives massive healing that has massive ap scaling and multiple buffs including % max health, size, and out of combat ms that refreshes every time you q again
gains additional bonuses if used on jungle monsters
has a strong, 12 second long attack speed/movement speed buff that can be both cast on allies and themselves, and if cast on themselves, reflects over to allies in a portion
has a point and click ability with low mana cost, low cds, a slow, and massive ap scaling
has super strong increasing slow that leads into super massive potential nuke

Better? And no, I'd say it sounds about the same.

RaoulOct 5, 201610 votes

Still falls appart when you actually compare the two side by side, You can defend Lee Sin all you want, there is a reason we saw him massivly used in EVERY pro championship, be it LCS, world or any other one, pick one, he was there and a major force SINCE RELEASE!

No other champion has been the meta nearly as long as he has been. He is an overloaded jack of all trades who can be played in every role (maybe besides ADC) just because his overloaded kit is such a big win for the team that it doesnt even matter if you play him support, since he doesnt even need items to be a big factor in the game.

I mean, lets take just one random ability, lets say his shield. It should be just a bonus to his kit, but it is stronger than the shields of support Characters who actually have this shield as a main selling point. Lee sin shields 2 people for 280 + .8 AP on a 14s CD. Janna shields one person for 240 +.7 AP on a 10s CD Lulu shields one person for 240 + .6AP on a 10s CD.

And before you say it, yes, both of the support shields give additional bonuses, but so does Lee Sins shield in form of a dash. And yes, that is only one ability, but i could basically do this with every other ability, AND all 7 (!!!!!!) of his abilities have an awesome synergie with each other. Lee Sin is overloaded big time and his abilities are way too strong for how many he has.

LordGeovanniOct 5, 20162 votes

Not to mention lee's exicute no mana were not even mentioned

PoskeOct 5, 20163 votes

there is a chance he would actually be stronger as a mana user...

Muramana dream

TequilaZombieOct 5, 20162 votes

There is not "a chance" he would totally be MUCH stronger with mana.

Forget about item 3110 item 3025 item 3042 . Those are not what would make him strong (even though 40% CDR, crap load of mana and dmg are awesome on him).

He'd be able to use all of his abilities without ever needing to chain AA's between for energy recovery. This would make him able to burst people MUCH faster and would make him extremely easier to play.

Giving energy to a champ gates how fast they can use their abilities. Mana allows for facerolling. You don't want a champ with 7 abilities facerolling.

AstôlfoOct 5, 20162 votes

Except you realize Lee is garbage as pretty much anything besides jungle (he can sorta-ish top) because it wastes the potential mobility in his kit.

He was popular in LCS because of how flashy and versatile he was. His kit in itself is still garbage for anyone outside of incredibly skilled players (read: the ones who actually have massive experience on him at high ELO). And dashing to the person can be a lot worse than just other benefits.

Calling it 7 is misleading. Both Qs are simply a start and end to each other. And you cannot have the second without a specific requirement. The two separate Ws are two. And the two separates Es are two. And the ult is 1.

TFBaamOct 5, 20162 votes

they have different names so they are different spells q1 could just be a skillshot q2 can just be a targetted dash like fizz q or diana r lee sin has 7 moves plus passive

AstôlfoOct 5, 20161 votes

Except his Q2 is a situational dash that relies on him landing his Q1 skillshot and being in range? So no, I consider his Q one ability. His W being two barely matters because the second W only matters in jungle/killing some minions for sustain. His first E is only used for vision against stealth and then so he can use the second E for the cripple CC. The damage is negligible.

TFBaamOct 5, 20163 votes

except if they wanted to split the q, they could easily do it. q1 needs to land to get q2, but they can easily split it. and execute dmg

His W being two

so his w is two. the second w gives not just lifesteal, but hear this, spell vamp! it gives 10/15/20/25/30% of it. hit an ult while under it effects and u heal for atleast 10% of the dmg you do to kick target and 3.33% of the damage you do to others hit by the lee sin ult, which is based off of their bonus hp, making a disruptor like lee still good against tanks. add in q and e dmg

his e does magic dmg. with a 100% ad scaling. not negligible. maybe to the rest of the dmg he does, but you cant say its not. his e could either give true sight and do the dmg, or do dmg/ do slow, or just do slow/ give true vision. they could actually split this into 3 different abilites

TequilaZombieOct 5, 20161 votes

Here's the difference in the shield: Lee Sin doesn't build AP. His shield is stuck at 280. Janna and Lulu benefit a lot from AP, so their shields can go much higher than 240 without hindering their kits.

Old AD champions tend to have ridiculous AP ratios on abilities that are not meant to scale.

CookyPrinceOct 5, 20165 votes

You don't build much ap on lulu or janna cause chances are you're a support

BakedLotionOct 5, 20162 votes

{quoted}

free ability every 5 autos, on respawn, on game start, and on recall

q is a smite that gives massive healing that has massive ap scaling and multiple buffs including % max health, size, and out of combat ms that refreshes every time you q again

gains additional bonuses if used on jungle monsters

has a strong, 12 second long attack speed/movement speed buff that can be both cast on allies and themselves, and if cast on themselves, reflects over to allies in a portion

has a point and click ability with low mana cost, low cds, a slow, and massive ap scaling

has super strong increasing slow that leads into super massive potential nuke

Better? And no, I'd say it sounds about the same.

He didnt use adjectives.

AstôlfoOct 5, 20161 votes

You should learn what adjectives are.

"good" "offensive/defensive" "high" "most definitely overloaded"

And the way he said "that many" in 'that many different' things is used in context like an adjective would to imply it's excessive.

BakedLotionOct 5, 20164 votes

{quoted}

You should learn what adjectives are.

"good" "offensive/defensive" "high" "most definitely overloaded"

And the way he said "that many" in 'that many different' things is used in context like an adjective would to imply it's excessive.

You used an excessive amount of adjectives. He used a couple. Lmfao. Stop tryna act smart. Compare the amount of words you used to him.

AMYS GRAVEOct 5, 20162 votes

Dont forget the true sight in there.

IGotScuttleCrabsOct 5, 20166 votes

That part gets me overtime. A) He's "blind" B) Does he reeeeally need that ability? I feel thats something that could be removed to take some power thats truly un-needed

9kPluzZOct 5, 20161 votes

It's called Echo-location fool. The shockwaves from the hit help him detect what he can't see. Makes lots of sense.

IGotScuttleCrabsOct 5, 20166 votes

Then give him Reksais burrowed vision permanently. Would make lots of sense as well

The Blue RajahOct 5, 20162 votes

The whole reason he has it is because he's blind. It's more flavor than anything (he's using sound to track you, not sight, so being invisible doesn't help).

TheHappyReaperzOct 5, 20162 votes

Hes got a gap closer, which is also a knockup Hes got a built in GA Hes got an attack speed boost in his passive Hes got a range aoe slow Has a massive attack speed and range buff on his ult Has inbuilt lifesteal Has an AA buff that scales with AD

guess what? That's Aatrox

Serika ZeroOct 5, 20162 votes

ekko

3 slows 1 stun 2 blinks, 1 dash healing poke %hp damage that increases the more hp you are missing shield movement speed buff and i might have missed something

iLymerickOct 6, 20164 votes

Most of the things listed are close ranged additions. Those that are ranged are things that can be punishable if the player makes the wrong decision. His ult is OP when he can hit several players with the ulted player, especially if the ulted player is stacking bonus health.

2yordles1cupcakeOct 4, 20169 votes

[{quoted}](name=l SHOT HARAMBE,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BMww7MLj,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-10-04T23:16:05.375+0000)

He really isn't overloaded compared to some of the more recent champions Riot has put out. For an ultimate that game changing, that damage is really absurd. I remember once long ago there was a nerf to it one PBE where its base damage was going to be very small, but with an increased ratio. People cried and it was reverted.

Riot had to overload their new champs in order to bring them on par with lee sin, and lee sin has been out since 1999.

TurquoiseYoshiOct 4, 201637 votes

I got more and more confused as I read this

Praetor NotoriasOct 5, 20168 votes

You had to be old enough to party in 1999 to get it.

iLymerickOct 6, 20164 votes

His cooldowns are the only things that stop him from 2-shotting you. He is easily punished if he misses a Q, makes a bad engage, or completely whiffs his ult and hits no other player with the ulted target, but he is by no means overloaded.

AstôlfoOct 4, 20166 votes

calls a champion that's been gutter trash for a long time overloaded lists a part that isn't even close to being arguable as overloaded

???

PennsOct 4, 201613 votes

not even close to being arguable as overloaded

AstôlfoOct 4, 20163 votes

PennsOct 4, 201619 votes

Lee ult isnt close to being overloaded?

AstôlfoOct 4, 20166 votes

The damage portion of it isn't.

PennsOct 4, 201618 votes

Pretty sure damage cant even be "overloaded".. His ult is overloaded tho, so the high damage is probably unnecessary.

AstôlfoOct 5, 20161 votes

Also, then why reply? My original comment was saying the damage portion which is what OP highlighted in the first place wasn't overloaded.

PennsOct 5, 20162 votes

Because I thought you meant Lee ult in general since, like I said, damage cant really be overloaded itself... misunderstanding I guess.

Ulquiorra995Oct 5, 20163 votes

The part where he nukes you by kicking a tank is.

SkiasOct 5, 20163 votes

{quoted}

?

You need to practice more before you can say anything about Lee's power level.

AstôlfoOct 5, 20161 votes

And you need to learn more before you cry about anything bud. :)

SkiasOct 5, 20163 votes

{quoted}

And you need to learn more before you cry about anything bud. :)

I'm in the top 30%, you're in the bottom 8%.

AstôlfoOct 5, 20161 votes

So what? You complain with the intelligence of a stereotypicalized Bronze.

SkiasOct 5, 20163 votes

{quoted}

So what? You complain with the intelligence of a stereotypicalized Bronze.

If that were true, we'd agree on your bad observations.

AstôlfoOct 5, 20161 votes

Considering I actually know enough from what I've looked up and learned from higher ELO players actually good at the game, I don't cry like you. So no, we wouldn't. :)

GetcuxcdOct 6, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Considering I actually know enough from what I've looked up and learned from higher ELO players actually good at the game, I don't cry like you. So no, we wouldn't. :)

YOU HAVENT LOOKED UP SHIT LOL all you do is lie share your bronze biased opinions on ur favorite champ and say that pros say the same thing LMAO pros actually agree that lee is alittle bit overloaded still he seems shit to bronze kids he has never been in a bad state thats just delusional stupidity from ppl who suck at lee

AstôlfoOct 6, 20162 votes

Okay darling, whatever you say. :) Must be hard not being able to look stuff up. I pity you.

GetcuxcdOct 6, 20161 votes

[deleted]

AstôlfoOct 6, 20162 votes

The feeling when such a basic creature is still yapping away.