Well, at least I like the concept behind it.
But I've got an idea about how to implement it a bit more efficiently.
Lee Sin: Q range and projectile speed reduced. Jarvan IV: EQ combo pull-through speed reduced.
Smite: Unchanged.
There. Problem solved, without backhanding every other jungler in the face.
Solaxo58 votesOr just stop nerfing the jungle because it's already frustrating to play
Ariel the Cruel68 votesThey can't do that. Currently, Junglers have too much power. So they have to gate them better.
Of course. By "junglers", I mean the 2 or 3 LCS junglers. And by "Gate", I mean make sure no one else is capable of having that much influence.
Lord Graves III5 votesIs it weird that I really like the new jungle? A lot.
aaronconlin13 votesI like it, too. It's a little harder, but you don't have to necessarily follow the same exact clear path every time, and it feels more rewarding to play a good jungle game than it did before. I honestly don't understand how people die to the jungle monsters constantly
Lord Graves III3 votesI actually sorta just assumed they were parroting what they heard elsewhere online. I've only died once really to the new jungle, though I'll admit there were times I was VERY vulnerable to an invade. The thing is....so was the other guy. We were both beaten senseless by our jungles, so everything ended up ok.
The jungle is dangerous again. I love it.
Auz the Ripper5 votesWhat I don't like about the new jungle is the lack of XP if I'm power farming and doing nothing else, I should at least be even in levels with a laner.
Lord Graves III1 votesI'd need to crunch the numbers to know for sure, but I'm pretty sure you can level faster than bottom lane and only a little slower than mid or top. Considering the Jungler has far more strategic options than mid or top, I would argue that its fair they level a little slower than a solo lane when powerfarming. Mid laners stay mid, top stays top, Jungle can appear bot, or top, or mid, or the enemy jungle, or the river, or he can keep farming his own space. It makes sense that given these choices they pay the cost of not having quite the income of a solo farm lane. Otherwise the ganks would just be gravy, and junglers would be even stronger than they are now.
Nameless Voice4 votesI kind of like it too, but I think the monsters and lack of healing potions are just a little bit too hard.
I was playing a game recently where I was Shaco. The enemy top-laner came into my jungle and pestered me so much that I had to waste my potions couldn't get level 2 from my first camp since she stole one of the monsters; I was then completely unable to clear a second and had to recall.
The current jungle is balanced on a knife-edge. You have to do things perfectly to manage a full clear on most junglers (if they can even manage it at all), and it leaves you really close to death. If anything interferes with your first clear, you are put really far behind, and with the now more-expensive upgraded jungle item, being behind is really harsh.
That's the thing - they increased the cost to stop junglers from snowballing (???) if they got first blood, but instead it makes it much, much harder for a jungler who gets invaded early to recover.
Basically put: I like the concept of the new jungle, but I feel it's too unforgiving.
The fact that they outright refuse to dethrone 
only makes it worse.
Lord Graves III1 votesI agree. I wish they would just re-make Lee Sin already.
I understand why they don't. Taric, Poppy, Hell even Shen, or perhaps Shaco could use the resources more, but Lee will never stop being top tier unless they remake him.
We also never will get a better martial artist as long as lee sin exists. Hes are kung fu champ. We deserve a better one.
Nameless Voice1 votesI'd argue that a champion who is in nearly every game needs a rework more than one that's hardly ever played (even if they reason they are hardly ever played is because they need a rework.)
Rinky Dinky4 votesThe only thing I do not like is Jarvin and Lee Sin.
Vi has always been ridiculous, just outclassed by Lee Sin.
If all 3 were to be nerfed, we would be golden, as long as they dont get gutted.
Are they overpowered? Yes. Should they be olaf'd? No
Narasimha6 votesIf J4 was nerfed, someone else would just take his place. He was literally nothing special before this season.
Kobila20002 votesRidiculous damage, mobility, tankyness and utility? There are far fewer junglers like that than you might think. He's like Cait, just because he isn't always as abused as the newest OP pick doesn't mean he isn't permafotm.
Narasimha1 votesThen why did no one complain about him before this season? And Cait isn't really 'permafotm'. She's just a 'staple'. She's easy to use, and givs decent results. She's pretty much a back up adc for everyone.
Kobila20001 votesBecause there are more broken picks to complain about. Kind of why people are only now complaining about Lee Sin.
Lord Graves III2 votesI've been a part of this community for a long time. There are always people who are down to complain about Lee Sin. Always.
Kobila20001 votesI'm pretty sure there's a difference between "some people" and a whole community finally getting sick of his broken design.
Lord Graves III1 votesIt also doesn't mean he is a problem. Someone is gonna be top tier, and Jarvan is a healthier top tier champ than say....poppy. Or urgot. Or Warwick for that matter.
Lord Graves III1 votesSomeone will always be the strongest jungler. Who is it gonna be if you nerf those 3?
Its like the Renekton Bar problem. Lee Sin is the best champ when played well, but lots of players can't do that.
Conversely, when Warwick was the best jungler in the game (for 12 minutes) there was just nothing anybody could do. (I love warwick though.)
Kobila20001 votesOr, get this, there are more than three champions that can be viable at the time? There's a difference between some champions being slightly stronger than others and some champions completely dominating due to their kits.
Malix Farwin1 votes[{quoted}](name=Lord Graves III,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BAX0EyGa,comment-id=00000002,timestamp=2015-02-14T22:41:29.638+0000)
Is it weird that I really like the new jungle? A lot.
the difficulty of the new jungle would not be a problem if everyone experienced it but everyone does not and that is the problem. Basically if you pick any jungler that is not one of the top three (j4, lee sin, and Vi) you will get outjungled. If it is anyone else then you will likely not see the issue. However, at least one of those three are in the majority of the games atm.
ForgiveColour3 voteshow is the new jungle even hard? You clear gromp/blue/scut then back then you have infinite sustain with an op smite
ChaoticPinecone1 votesbecause some junglers with the right path can actually clear the entire jungle before backing. if both junglers decide to do a full clear - back - gank, who will gank first?
SlowChemical2 votesI feel like most junglers are actually capable of full clears. It's just the knowledge needed to do it. Gotta have the right masteries, runes, etc. Not to mention squishier junglers should start krugs (golems), and higher sustain junglers should start gromp (frog). And one trick that gets missed is on the raptors (birds) kill the SMALL ones first! They do a ton of damage and it's much easier to finish them off with a higher amount of health if you kill the little guys first.
Treyen4 voteshow you "feel" doesn't really matter. the fact is a lot of junglers can't do a full clear without backing.
Lord Graves III1 votesso what? it only takes 4 camps to afford the upgrade and you got a leash on the first one.
EDIT: I haven't played all the junglers, but I do play Evelyn. She can clear Gromp, then blue, then wolves, then red. It is tight, and I need to use my early vision to guard red, but I can clear those 4, recall, buy upgrade then go gank.
This is an acceptable situation in my opinion. Not every jungler should be able to do camp after camp early game. Let guys like Warwick or Amumu do that. Let it be a niche for a few instead of just something all junglers get.
Ennyn Messor4 votesYeah I dont get it either, I think they want to clear jungle at level 1 and be 80% hp so people cant gank them.
I mean youre already hiding in the jungle, not even on enemies sight and you dont even want to get low on HP ? What game are these people playing ?
Lord Graves III1 votesYou took the words right out of my mouth.
SmokingPuffin13 votesLee and J4 nerfs are probably a good idea.
Chilling smite nerfs are still desirable. We want to get to a state where all of the smite flavors are seeing play, and only the grey smite really has room for buffs. Blue smite is too good for early ganks, not just on Lee, but on most early game junglers.
Bears Dont Care1 votesLee and J4 nerfs are probably a good idea.
Chilling smite nerfs are still desirable. We want to get to a state where all of the smite flavors are seeing play, and only the grey smite really has room for buffs. Blue smite is too good for early ganks, not just on Lee, but on most early game junglers.
Most early game junglers NEED chilling smite to be viable. Evelyn, Nautilus, Hecarim, Warwick, they don't have much CC until level 6, and this enables them to be on a more even playing field with other junglers.
SmokingPuffin3 votesEve and Nautilus need purple smite to have any chance of decent clears. Eve needs the sustain, Naut needs the clear time.
Warwick and Hecarim both really want to farm the jungle. Hecarim can sometimes gank early against bad opponents, but he's a farmer at heart in a properly played game.
I wouldn't recommend taking blue smite on any of these champions.
ThePlasticSpork3 votesNautilus, Eve, and Hecarim were all strong at some point long before you could smite champions, so no, they don't need it to gank. The problem mostly lies in having low HP all the time - Eve and Hecarim lose quite a bit of health clearing, while Naut's clear takes ages, resulting in him losing a lot of HP unless he gets a super strong leash. Naut's ganks are still strong as fuck - you can't go wrong with 4 CCs in one kit - but he just doesn't have the HP to gank very often.
I also find it rather amusing that you claim Naut doesn't have much pre-6 CC when he has more than 90% of other champions in the game. The dude brings a root, a hook, and a slow pre 6, 2 slows if you rush chilling smite for some reason.
Notably, all the junglers that are strong now (with the exception of Rek'Sai, who was not a champion at the time) were also strong at some point before chilling smite was introduced - it's just icing on the cake. Chilling smite mostly makes it so that when you actually do have the HP to gank as a jungler it's more likely to net you a kill or assist. Basically, in the current season compared to previous seasons, most junglers have traded frequency of ganks for more reliable ganks due to chilling smite. Because most junglers will fall horribly behind if their ganks fail, chilling smite is pretty much always gonna be the best choice because it makes for the least likely to fail ganks.
I'd even go so far as to wager that if chilling smite did no damage it would still be the best choice on 90% of junglers because it gives you the most reliable ganks.
Lord Graves III1 votes5 star post amigo. You make a great point about the new smites.
That said I prefer Trailblazer on most of those champs to stalkers. I feel the bonus health from the smite lets you gank more frequently, and it keeps your jungle on respawn so the enemy can't snag it.
Silents4291 votesAre you shitting me. Nautilus has a root, pull, and a slow in his kit. What the hell are you talking about?
Warwick is needing a passive rework.
Hecarim literally speeds into lane and shoves someone back, smites range has no effect on him.
Bears Dont Care1 votesAre you shitting me. Nautilus has a root, pull, and a slow in his kit. What the hell are you talking about?
In order for Nautilus to apply his root and slow, he needs to land his pull. Pre-6, nautilus has trouble doing this due to lacking a gap closer early on, particularly because his pull can be body blocked by minions. Lee Sin has the same issue except, he can use his W to gap clsoe, then Q nd E.
Warwick is needing a passive rework.
He needs a reowkr period
Hecarim literally speeds into lane and shoves someone back, smites range has no effect on him.
Actually the chilling smite helps him pre-6. Same for evelynn.
Silents4291 votesIn order for Nautilus to apply his root and slow, he needs to land his pull. Pre-6, nautilus has trouble doing this due to lacking a gap closer early on, particularly because his pull can be body blocked by minions.
No no if you can't gank as Nautilus pre 6 you just suck. Like period. You suck.
If you are trying to argue he NEEDS the chilling smite then you have an issue, because he didn't need it the last 3 seasons he doesn't need it now. It isn't hard to walk in lane slow with E and land a root, and when they blow their escape you pull them. It is so god damn easy to gank as Nautilus.
Lee Sin has the same issue except, he can use his W to gap clsoe, then Q nd E.
Except Lee Sin can't pull people or do anything early on except damage. His ganks aren't all that great, His CC is either ulting back, if he manages, or a somewhat weak ass slow.
He needs a reowkr period
I don't know why I typed passive. But him needing a rework invalidates him.
Actually the chilling smite helps him pre-6. Same for evelynn.
No shit it helps people, but they don't need it, Evelynn is just in a terrible spot in general, and the chilling smite is far from what she need. Hecarim literally GETS IN RANGE with so much ease that it doesn't matter if the range is nerfed or not.
150 less range means we aren't getting slowed down from such a stupid range late game, early game Junglers can still get in lane like they did seasons 1-4 people are just finding shit to get pissy about because its related to the jungle.
Bears Dont Care1 votesNo no if you can't gank as Nautilus pre 6 you just suck. Like period. You suck.
If you are trying to argue he NEEDS the chilling smite then you have an issue, because he didn't need it the last 3 seasons he doesn't need it now. It isn't hard to walk in lane slow with E and land a root, and when they blow their escape you pull them. It is so god damn easy to gank as Nautilus.
Erm... mabe against bronzies who cant play safely. Nautilus anchor has a travel time and in a meta where.mobility is king, dodging his pull is easy. Chiling smite allows him to do his pull.more easily against champions such as ahri, zed, and leblanc. Slower chps have tools that.prevent anchor usage.
If naut.ganks were super easy, he would be comparable to lee sin.
Except Lee Sin can't pull people or do anything early on except damage. His ganks aren't all that great, His CC is either ulting back, if he manages, or a somewhat weak ass slow.
I cannot take you seriously when you say lee sin ganks are not good. The champ heralded for early game pressure has bad ganks? He has 2 forms of cc. 2 gap closers that go through walls (naut cannot do it) And high base damage that beats assassins such as talon. Yeah...his ganks are not great which is why he dominates for several seasons.
I don't know why I typed passive. But him needing a rework invalidates him.
How so?
No shit it helps people, but they don't need it, Evelynn is just in a terrible spot in general, and the chilling smite is far from what she need. Hecarim literally GETS IN RANGE with so much ease that it doesn't matter if the range is nerfed or not.
Actually it does. You are ignoring the tools.of.other champions as well as stacking slows or connecting cc. Less range means a champ can escape.more easily period. It lets him.keep up with gank heavy cha.ps who can displace from turrets
150 less range means we aren't getting slowed down from such a stupid range late game, early game Junglers can still get in lane like they did seasons 1-4 people are just finding shit to get pissy about because its related to the jungle.
Silents4291 votesErm... mabe against bronzies who cant play safely. Nautilus anchor has a travel time and in a meta where.mobility is king, dodging his pull is easy. Chiling smite allows him to do his pull.more easily against champions such as ahri, zed, and leblanc. Slower chps have tools that.prevent anchor usage.
If naut.ganks were super easy, he would be comparable to lee sin.
I cannot take you seriously when you say lee sin ganks are not good. The champ heralded for early game pressure has bad ganks? He has 2 forms of cc. 2 gap closers that go through walls (naut cannot do it) And high base damage that beats assassins such as talon. Yeah...his ganks are not great which is why he dominates for several seasons.
How so?
Actually it does. You are ignoring the tools.of.other champions as well as stacking slows or connecting cc. Less range means a champ can escape.more easily period. It lets him.keep up with gank heavy cha.ps who can displace from turrets
No Nautilus is used throughout the elos, and "playing safely" applies to every single jungler. Slowing them briefly won't stop them from dashing or blinking, making almost 0 difference on whether he lands his anchor. And again. He was a great ganker the last few seasons, nothing has changed for him other then getting a mini slow.
No. No he friggin would not be comparable to Lee Sin, Lee Sin ganks aren't that good. He has early game pressure but he can't do much other then damage during a gank, He doesn't have Pre 6 CC outside of a slow, his ganks are shitty in comparison.
He has 1 CC pre 6, and that is a slow, that requires him to use E twice, and his E has to hit the target or it won't slow him, this is utterly terrible even with 2 gap closers. He is dominate for several seasons because he has no real weakness, making him reliable. That doesn't mean he excels at every aspect of jungling.
Warwick is invalid because he is getting a rework, he is old and outdated and whether he works with current changes does not matter because he is going to be reworked to actually fit the new changes. This is like complaining about something and saying since Urgot doesn't work with it then it must be wrong.
You keep forgetting the chilling smite is only a new thing, these champions your trying to use as reasons to unjustify its nerf had no problems without it in the first place. A normal Hecarim gank is going in with E and knocking them back, Putting you easily in range for a chilling smite. It does not matter if it makes the ganks a little harder they are still capable of ganking a lane.
To repeat what I said before.
150 less range means we aren't getting slowed down from such a stupid range late game, early game Junglers can still get in lane like they did seasons 1-4 people are just finding shit to get pissy about because its related to the jungle.
Bears Dont Care1 votesNo Nautilus is used throughout the elos, and "playing safely" applies to every single jungler. Slowing them briefly won't stop them from dashing or blinking, making almost 0 difference on whether he lands his anchor. And again. He was a great ganker the last few seasons, nothing has changed for him other then getting a mini slow.
Every jungler is used throughout the elos, including some of the unconventional ones such as Malzahar or Talon. This does not mean they are good. Let alone that no, "playing safely" does not apply for all junglers. If you are facing against Vi, you realize she can slam into you very close to your turret. Or Lee Sin can actually dive you under your turret with little to no health loss due to his mobility and ult. You also know some champions such as Jarvan can gank you from behind the jungle camp more easily, same for Rek'sai and a few others. Facing a naut is different from other junglers, you cannot suggest they are the same when the tools are different.
No. No he friggin would not be comparable to Lee Sin, Lee Sin ganks aren't that good. He has early game pressure but he can't do much other then damage during a gank, He doesn't have Pre 6 CC outside of a slow, his ganks are shitty in comparison.
He has two gap closers, and one of the best damage rotations in the game, and while he has 1 form of CC pre-6, there aren't many junglers with more than 1 form of CC before it. Look at Vi, one of the most prominent junglers this season, but only 1 form of CC until level 6.
He has 1 CC pre 6, and that is a slow, that requires him to use E twice, and his E has to hit the target or it won't slow him, this is utterly terrible even with 2 gap closers. He is dominate for several seasons because he has no real weakness, making him reliable. That doesn't mean he excels at every aspect of jungling.
Oh my god...hitting E twice...so hard. You do realize once he lands his E, you can just press E for the slw immediately right? Let alone that his safeguard lets him gap close immediately without using his Q. Or the fact he can usehis Q to gap close anyway.
Lee Sin dominates for several seasons because he excels at nearly every aspect of jungling.
He has
Lee Sin doesn't dominate the meta because he is a generalist with no weakness. You could argue it for say...Jarvan, or even Vi if you so cared. It is because he has every single tool a jungler can desire with no drawback.
Warwick is invalid because he is getting a rework, he is old and outdated and whether he works with current changes does not matter because he is going to be reworked to actually fit the new changes. This is like complaining about something and saying since Urgot doesn't work with it then it must be wrong.
Um... no he isn't. Warwick was tated to be getting a rework a year ago, but if you look at the champ update list, Warwick isn't anywhere there right now. Warwick originally did excellent in the new jungle. Sure he needed to farm til 6, but he was able to make use of the new devourer. Then they gutted him entirely. Lowered his AS steroid duration. Lowered the bas damage of his ult and increased its CD. Warwick could compete for a bit, now he cannot. Let alone a champion getting a rework should not mean they should remain invalid. Lee Sin is supposed to be getting a rework.
You keep forgetting the chilling smite is only a new thing, these champions your trying to use as reasons to unjustify its nerf had no problems without it in the first place. A normal Hecarim gank is going in with E and knocking them back, Putting you easily in range for a chilling smite. It does not matter if it makes the ganks a little harder they are still capable of ganking a lane.
To repeat what I said before.
Not necessarily, because Chilling smite's range allowed you to smite them, and allow you to catch up in the event it was a champion such as Leblanc, Ahri, Zed, character's who are capable of blinking through walls. Yes, Hecarim can do an over the wall gank, but he requires his ult to pull it off and this does not work very well against high mobility champs. Particularly in bottom lane where you must deal with champions with mobility such as Kallista, or high CC supports such as Leona.
Chilling smite gave him another tool to keep up with the likes of Lee SIn, and whether you wish to admit or not, its still a nerf
Silents4291 votesEvery jungler is used throughout the elos, including some of the unconventional ones such as Malzahar or Talon. This does not mean they are good. Let alone that no, "playing safely" does not apply for all junglers. If you are facing against Vi, you realize she can slam into you very close to your turret. Or Lee Sin can actually dive you under your turret with little to no health loss due to his mobility and ult. You also know some champions such as Jarvan can gank you from behind the jungle camp more easily, same for Rek'sai and a few others. Facing a naut is different from other junglers, you cannot suggest they are the same when the tools are different.
You are a person attempting to argue Nautilus doesn't have great ganks, are just jerking off the popular junglers right now, that is all you are doing. 3 CC's is more then 1 slow that requires him to be right next to them, a brief and weak slow. Hitting him twice with E is a problem because their is a brief delay between when you can hit, and only a short distance a laner has to go for safety.
Vi's knockback works as a gap closer as well and is much better then Lee Sin's gank. And if J4 were for some stupid reason try jumping over the wall he just lost his E + Q to gank at all.
He has two gap closers, and one of the best damage rotations in the game, and while he has 1 form of CC pre-6, there aren't many junglers with more than 1 form of CC before it. Look at Vi, one of the most prominent junglers this season, but only 1 form of CC until level 6.
Nautilus has 3 Pre 6, Trundle has 2, J4 has 2, Fiddlesticks has 2, Maokai has 3, Rammus has 2, Volibear has 2, Xin Zhao has 2, Zac has 2.
Vi's gap closing knockback is far better then a slow he has to apply a second time to get, and as I said about their is a delay between presses and a short time it takes to get back to the turret.
Oh my god...hitting E twice...so hard. You do realize once he lands his E, you can just press E for the slw immediately right? Let alone that his safeguard lets him gap close immediately without using his Q. Or the fact he can usehis Q to gap close anyway.
Lee Sin dominates for several seasons because he excels at nearly every aspect of jungling.
He has
Early game damage. It is higher than Rek'sai, Vi, and Jarvan. Mobility. Only one's that can beat him at it use global abilities such as Pantheon or Rek'sai, but the CD on his abilities are extremely short. Utility. He has a lot of it. Jarvan may have a trap through his ult, but you can escape it rather easily in this mta. Lee Sin can absolutely displace a champ from their team. Sustain. He can easily gank at level 3.
Lee Sin doesn't dominate the meta because he is a generalist with no weakness. You could argue it for say...Jarvan, or even Vi if you so cared. It is because he has every single tool a jungler can desire with no drawback.
I don't give a shit about what he can do? This entire forum is convinced he can do every single thing possible in this game better then everyone else and that is just fucking retarded.
Um... no he isn't. Warwick was tated to be getting a rework a year ago, but if you look at the champ update list, Warwick isn't anywhere there right now. Warwick originally did excellent in the new jungle. Sure he needed to farm til 6, but he was able to make use of the new devourer. Then they gutted him entirely. Lowered his AS steroid duration. Lowered the bas damage of his ult and increased its CD. Warwick could compete for a bit, now he cannot. Let alone a champion getting a rework should not mean they should remain invalid. Lee Sin is supposed to be getting a rework.
*Was on the list, and now I have something to get pissed off about. Excellent and sustain are not the same thing, yes he can clear the jungler slowly but healthy, but so can most junglers that upgrade the machete, WW deals single target damage, and weak early damage, he clears slowly. I know this, He was my number 1 pick in Season 4, he doesn't clear fast, he can't counter jungle, he can't gank pre 6, and thanks to his gutting, his Ult is on a 2 minute cooldown with less base damage, making him incredibly shitty at ganking now. He remains invalid because he IS still an old champion that never really fits the meta properly.
Not necessarily, because Chilling smite's range allowed you to smite them, and allow you to catch up in the event it was a champion such as Leblanc, Ahri, Zed, character's who are capable of blinking through walls. Yes, Hecarim can do an over the wall gank, but he requires his ult to pull it off and this does not work very well against high mobility champs. Particularly in bottom lane where you must deal with champions with mobility such as Kallista, or high CC supports such as Leona.
Chilling smite gave him another tool to keep up with the likes of Lee SIn, and whether you wish to admit or not, its still a nerf
I never said it wasn't a nerf, I am basically saying people are morons who think junglers weren't doing fine with ganks before the item even existed, I also said in order to gank as hecarim you get up close to them anyway putting you in range of it. Ahri can't blink through walls. Just wait for Zed to waste his W, Le Blanc is Le Blanc. Kalista is bullshit.
Your not really stating large compelling reasons you nitpicking little bits to help justify it, 150 range is miniscule, and no one would have noticed if they didn't put it in the patch notes.
Lord Graves III1 votesEvelyn can damage gank. Her stealth and damage combine to make it work. Hecarim can gank with his speed and knockback. Warwick has always just wanted to powerfarm until 6. If you wanted to gank early game I would advise against picking Warwick. Nautalus needs help. I will give you that, but I feel the problem is with him, not the jungle. God I wish they would buff or fix him or something.
Chilling smite is a choice, but I actually prefer trailblazer on all the champs you just mentioned. It makes Eve and Hec have enough health to gank after clearing, and it helps warwick rush level 6 (Though I sell it for Saber on warwick mid game).
1st HanarSpectre11 votesThe smire range nerf is good, that's not the problem. The problem is that it hurts other jungler more than the problematic 3.
lDontLiftIcarry6 votesnope fuck your nerfs.
OyddAWqJ5r17 votesSpoken like a true Rioter
AetherKingdom4 votesOr we could remove J4 snare immunity. Because that shouldnt be a fucking thing
Spacesuit Spiff3 votesBetter yet, have the mvspd drain increased based on how close you are to the target. That's incentive for Lee/J4/Vi to use their gapclosers first instead of smiting and then easily landing a skillshot, and if you dodge their skillshot the gank fails (assuming you aren't so pushed that they can just walk up to you, nothing's gonna save you in that case).
Honestly, the last nerf to chilling smite already made it inefficient to chain the smite and the gapcloser (waste of 2 seconds of speed boost), so right now it's mostly a crutch for people who can't land skillshots if it's being used for that.
eyes wide shut2 votesit's funny because the speed at which jarvan can E+q has nothing to do with why he's "op", it's because his full combo hits like a fucking truck with no dmg items (mainly because of his passive)
Alderon WolfBane3 votesand his passive was buffed ages ago so he did exact damage he doe's today and yet no one bitched about it the problem isn't that J4 is "OP" the problem is that almost every other jungler is WEAK AS FUCK they need buff the WEAK jungler not nerf champ's who can actually do good in the jungle.
