@Meddler Season 7 and ADC meta

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To me, this is a good point, in that when comparing supports over the last few years, we've seen them specialize in doing a lot of different things. Granted, they've all lanes with adcs for the most part, the thing they brought to their team's teamfight or strategy wasn't simply one static thing. The same could be said of junglers, where we've seen a variety of different picks with different purposes to their teams.

You could make a similar argument for adcs, in that Ezreal pokes and Graves bursts and Kog does the hyper carry thing, but at the end of the day, I think they are pretty much all just filling a team's needs in 'sustained reliable teamfight damage' and 'turret destroyers'. There could be more or slightly different things, but I think the point still stands.

It's unlikely to me that adcs will be replaced anytime soon unless there are champions or a strategy that can fill in the holes in the team comps they're leaving behind. Unless, of course, I'm falsely assuming that things like 'sustained reliable teamfight damage' are a core component to a successful team.

What do you guys think? What is it that makes ranged adcs seemingly irreplaceable to the game? Or, what would it take for them to become less meta or even non meta?

I would be pleased if you sit here and talk with us about ADC in league of legends. New seasons are all about fixing big "meta issues" i dare say, but i can't see what could be fixed since supports are perfect, and the jungle is perfect now. ADC meta isn't a "meta" since you don't see 5 adc being picked, but the problem is that you need one to win. Now, you also need a support to win, but this is less an issue because in a moba where farm is needed you naturally need a support if not everyone can farm. But they still help their team in a different way (CC,debuffs,or healing/shielding/buffs) , which is what repertoir said

Riot repertoir acknowledged the problem since he said "You could make a similar argument for adcs, in that Ezreal pokes and Graves bursts and Kog does the hyper carry thing, but at the end of the day, I think they are pretty much all just filling a team's needs in ;sustained reliable teamfight damage and ;turret destroyers. There could be more or slightly different things, but I think the point still stands" He is right, because in other moba like Dota2 other classes like skirmishers who deal sustained damage are still picked for their damage instead of ADC to fulfill niches in the game, So he asked us to find the reason ADC are being picked and let's see why:

What everyone belives, they are picked because they can destroy towers. "You can't win if you don't destroy objectives" True, but i believe it isn't because ADC have the best siege power (ziggs has a better siege for example), but because destroying towers isn't as simple for other ranged characters (ranged supports, and mages). You need to buy items like lichbane in order for it to work.

What i believe, ADC combined with supports bot lane makes the lane impossible for other classes Just imagine a melee champ laning against an ADC bot with supports in LCS. I can assure you that the melee will have 10 cs while the adc will have 50 cs at least. And that for this reason: ADC can poke melees while melees can't reply to this. "but reworked Mordekaiser and release Yasuo were able to lane against ADC" Well yes,** because they were designed to destroy adc** . And that's why it ended up broken, Mordekaiser had everything in his kit to make the life of the adc a living hell: -bonus xp to have stats advantage, and better spells -shield against poke -better poke than an adc at lvl 1 -One of the best sustain in the game, also giving sustain to his support -oh you don't have siege? let us give you a dragon ghost everything was planned to cover every weaknesses that a melee would have against an ADC, which ended up as planned overwhelming the botlane.

If you want to balance melee/ranged bot lane you should not specially design champions for that but look at the game itself

How people think the problem would be solved: By adding Turn rate like in dota2, and i don't think it would solve any problem listed above. How i think riot should fixe this problem:

-ADC have way too much base AD at lvl 1 for the range they have. The only ADC under 53 AD is miss fortune(46) to compensate the poke of her passive, followed by jhin (53) to compensate the AD gained by his passive. Is it a small amount? In this game you can get a decent amount of AD via runes (i believe you can get 15 AD) and you can even more increase your AD via masteries, i see usual ADC starting with 70 AD, if they attack you 10 times during laning phase, they deal 700 damage before mitigation, and it's hard to not get attacked by an ADC in 2v2 bot if you want to farm. What do melees have against this? a lame average of +10 AD, the highest AD is mokai with 63, if you want a bruiser Jax has 62, meanwhile graves has 60 base AD and 300 more range than him. -Poking doesn't cost any ressources, but the problem is that there aren't any risks. , They rightclick you, you lose hp, they don't lose anything. Minions aggro is shit, minions are way too slow to catch ranged champions, deals way no damage at all (they have like 7 base AD?), dota 2 minions have more base ms than 70% of the heroes, have a 40 base AD (which is like 5 less AD than most of heroes) making NOT ALL ranged heroes good at poking, it depends on their base ms, base AD ect..** I have never seen an ADC punished by taking damage from minions because he chased a melee while poking him until the melee is out of xp range. ** At best they will take 30 or 40 damage which will be sustained by doran blade easily especially since a melee can't prevent them from sutaining (while the melee can hardly sustain).

Solutions to this (you don't have to do ALL of them): -reduce the base AD of ADC -increase the base ms of minions -increase the base AD of minions -make doran shield better against ranged champions? -maybe bring this support item from black market brawlers which was an active (10 sec cd) shielding a champion and gaining gold if the shield was broken?

Sieging: When it comes to sieging, ADC have the best sieging ability due to attack speed and Attack damage. Should this be nerfed? no, because that's what ranged champions "so, how do you plan to make melees better at sieging?" I don't, you should be punished if you pick 5 melees in league, same thing happens to pros in dota2. But the thing is in Dota2 you can siege with any ranged characters. In League, if you're a mage or a ranged AP support you should build lichbane to do as much damage as ADC. I think if riot increase the on-hit AP ratio on turrets to 0.7 or 0.8 from 0.5, but nerf lichbane on turrets, mages wouldn't be forced to build lichbane and everyone would be fine.

that's it. if those changes make ADC underwhelming, then riot should buff their niche to make everyone equal.