Why is Zed Ult no longer stopped by QSS?

Çhåryzård·May 9, 2016·5 votes·2,093 views

I'm mentioning this more for adcs than midlaners, since midlaners at least have zhonyas. QSS was really the go to item to help protect adc's against Zed's ult and now it doesn't work anymore. Was a reason ever given for that? Like....why though? I never saw one so I'm interested.

Why take one of the squishiest members on the team who will frequently get ulted by a Zed later in game and take away their one reliable means of surviving? QSS is guaranteed to work. I've at least found that every single game with a Zed, his ult always does too much damage. He's really good at coming into teamfights and picking off one of the weaker members of your team. He just runs in, ults, and then is out of there before you can do anything.

I saw someone mention taking Cleanse, but Zed can ult you around 3 times before the cooldown is up, so why mess with QSS?

19 Comments

SlythionMay 10, 20163 votes

By removing qss for debuffs, it allows aspects of the game like Zed's ult to be changed without being dumpstered by a single item

It's better for the long run

ÇhåryzårdMay 10, 20161 votes

{quoted}

By removing qss for debuffs, it allows aspects of the game like Zed's ult to be changed without being dumpstered by a single item

It's better for the long run

Except that there were only 2 items in the game that could actually protect you from ults like his, one for ad champs and one for ap.

Now only ap champs can save themselves, unless you build zhonyas as the adc.

Zed is pretty oppressive and later in the game when the adc becomes more of a target you need something to protect yourself, his ult does so much damage and then he's out of there in a heartbeat with only a few scratches...

SlythionMay 10, 20163 votes

Well...ya. That's what Zed does now in his current state. As I said before, the removal of qss against debuffs allows riot to change how Zed's ult interacts with champions without being cleaned up by a single item.

Any item that has the ability to completely negate an assassin's main source of damage isn't healthy for the game. The difference between qss and zhonyas is that zhonyas puts you in a stasis, allowing for the enemy to re-position and have their cd's reset. Qss just gives players a clean slate and allows adc's to continue outputting consistent damage without fear.

You may also take into account that the zhonyas active has an increased cd, so it's not like that wasn't touched either.

ÇhåryzårdMay 10, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Well...ya. That's what Zed does now in his current state. As I said before, the removal of qss against debuffs allows riot to change how Zed's ult interacts with champions without being cleaned up by a single item.

Any item that has the ability to completely negate an assassin's main source of damage isn't healthy for the game. The difference between qss and zhonyas is that zhonyas puts you in a stasis, allowing for the enemy to re-position and have their cd's reset. Qss just gives players a clean slate and allows adc's to continue outputting consistent damage without fear.

You may also take into account that the zhonyas active has an increased cd, so it's not like that wasn't touched either.

Yet without QSS, Zed can waltz into teamfights and completely destroy a squishy and walk out of there no problem. It's extremely difficult to stop him. He can just go in and completely destroy a team member in 2 seconds and there's a very low chance you'll stop him. How is that healthy for the game? There's a reason Zed is banned in a large amount of games

Mandang0May 10, 20162 votes

You do realize the item wasn't only changed for Zed, right?

And, like you've been told a couple of times now, Zed's going to get nerfed following this change, and his eventual balance will be MUCH better for this change, as now he'll be balanced for a game state in which you're not forced to build an MR item against an AD champ.

ÇhåryzårdMay 10, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You do realize the item wasn't only changed for Zed, right?

And, like you've been told a couple of times now, Zed's going to get nerfed following this change, and his eventual balance will be MUCH better for this change, as now he'll be balanced for a game state in which you're not forced to build an MR item against an AD champ.

Uh, this is the first time I've heard of an actual Zed nerf coming, and just to make sure, I went through all my recent comment history. If you're talking about something Riot posted then I haven't seen it, but nobody who has replied to me in my commet history has spoken to me of a nerf

Mandang0May 10, 20161 votes

Yea, it's not out yet, but it'll be coming.

If your concern was over the lack of Zed nerf, you should have titled your thread appropriately. The QSS nerf is good for the game (again, much larger than just Zed), so when your thread title focuses on the QSS change, you're going to get posts like mine and Slythion's defending the change, even though we probably still think it makes Zed broken for the time being.

ErrastasMay 10, 20164 votes

If Zed killed your carry in 2 seconds, qss wouldn't have even mattered because you're dead way before deathmark procs.

He'll get a nerf now and nothing is going to change for you, because after this nerf.. You're still not gonna bother to learn how to counter pick, to position properly, or to build properly against a Zed.

He's an easy enough champ to beat or not die to, too many are just afraid to even try or learn how to beat him.

SlythionMay 10, 20161 votes

these are the boards, logic against zed haters don't apply :3

ÇhåryzårdMay 11, 20161 votes

{quoted}

If Zed killed your carry in 2 seconds, qss wouldn't have even mattered because you're dead way before deathmark procs.

He'll get a nerf now and nothing is going to change for you, because after this nerf.. You're still not gonna bother to learn how to counter pick, to position properly, or to build properly against a Zed.

He's an easy enough champ to beat or not die to, too many are just afraid to even try or learn how to beat him.

Or maybe he's an actual problem? I doubt his high ban rate and the amount of people that have been complaining about him for a very very long time are all "people who don't know how to counter pick". He's an actual problem.

Luckily, I've heard he has incoming nerfs.

SlythionMay 10, 20162 votes

It's almost like you have ignored the part in both of my comments stating how qss sets up changes for the future...

ModWulf HelhammerMay 9, 20161 votes

Cleanse doesn't remove champion debuffs, only summoner spell ones and CC

AmarajahMay 9, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Cleanse doesn't remove champion debuffs, only summoner spell ones and CC

This, although I agree this was a terrible change out of nowhere

ÇhåryzårdMay 10, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Cleanse doesn't remove champion debuffs, only summoner spell ones and CC

Ah ok didn't know that (I never really use it)

Ap Mid BurstMay 9, 20161 votes

He can 100-0 without ult if he can auto attack a few times (which is rare)

BeersteinMay 9, 20161 votes

Because champions that might buy mercurial scimitar to better deal with him like Ashe and Miss Fortune were too powerful against him with his lack of mobility and weak kit.

Also I'm not sure what I'm posting anymore, my sanity went out the window some time ago.

SwiftKitten88May 10, 20161 votes

i agree its stupid that it no longer removes it.

but i don't feel that bad as i never really got to build qss anyways as it stupid to build as an AP champ

tidegateMay 10, 20161 votes

Riot said that qss is too powerful at basically taking one champion (zed) out of a fight. This is just stupid if you ask me. Whether you qss zed ult or not with 3 shadows in that fight he's going to spit out tons of damage to everyone with his q and e. In fact, if the adc is cced they'll probably still die solely to zed.