Because lets face it, thats blatantly what he is. I know im not the one to be catered to, and that hes not even fully released yet, but damn i was hoping for some awesome support mechanic, not triple kills.
SithesisLord19 votesCommunity: Support is overpowered.
Also community: Autofill sucks.
Riot, the intellectuals: An overpowered assassin support for the autofilled.
Two birds, one stone.
Votable Jester2 votesThat stone has only one bird.
FilDaFunk2 votesYes, and gives gives the other bird superpowers.
Late For Tea12 votesAs a support main I welcome this ground-breaking design. Another traditional support would have been dull, because while yes they may have unique mechanics, the overall gameplay stays the same. Pyke is an entirely new take on the support role, and if I ever want to go ham and go for kills, I don't have to play a different role.
Professor Ward9 votes[{quoted}](name=Captain Tea,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AOpNjiYp,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-05-14T21:16:33.650+0000)
As a support main I welcome this ground-breaking design. Another traditional support would have been dull, because while yes they may have unique mechanics, the overall gameplay stays the same. Pyke is an entirely new take on the support role, and if I ever want to go ham and go for kills, I don't have to play a different role.
Making him have the abilities of another lane, and giving him shared gold on kill, isnt really groundbreaking, its making an assassin and giving him shared gold on kill. Take away that passive on ult and he passes as a jungler all day.
One354 votesHis tool-kit and stats are still pretty support-y, and it's quite clear he favors duo lanes.
Acheron161 votesThat doesn't mean he's a support, it just means he likes duo lanes.
ChaddyFantome2 votesit just means he likes duo lanes.
So the Support role then? Unless you can name another duo lane?
Kitten of Evil2 votesAnother traditional support would have been dull
Yup. Mix and match some combination of these:
Q: some form of poke with some attached CC W or E: heal or shield E or W: slow or ally buff R: ult that deals minimal damage but packs serious CC
I welcome a support who does something different.
Umbral Regent7 votesI'm willing to bet Riot only considers any new interest in playing Support due to Pyke to be just a decent side-effect of their main intentions.
As they did with Rakan, Riot wanted to try and design something for the Support space that hadn't been done before - in Rakan's case, an agile, in-and-out Diver-Enchanter who really shook up the balance of immobile Enchanters and somewhat-mobile Tanks.
In Pyke's case, it's pretty clear what Riot saw was missing from the Support roster. We've got heavy Tanks that soak damage, Enchanters who provide buffs and healing, and Mages who provide damage and lockdown...But no Champions to play for those who want to be vicious and murder the fuck out of people. No genuine "kill Supports".
Every other Kill Support has just been adapted from other lanes - Zoe, Veigar, Pantheon, etc. - so a genuine, built-for-Support Kill Support was something they very clearly wanted to bring. So, they brought it.
5050BS1 votesRakan was well designed. He is Strong but not OP
Pyke looks to have all the strong parts of other champs in his whole kit....
P: 
P
Q: 
Q and E
W: 
P
E: 
E
R: 
R
Umbral Regent8 votesThat sort of over-simplification only hurts the ability to actually look at and understand the Champion. It's like when Galio was reworked, and people only looked at Hero's Entrance and spent the entirety of the PBE cycle going "It's just a better/shittier version of Shen".
Besides, you're ignoring the larger mechanical differences between each of the abilities you listed (some of which, by the way, aren't even remotely accurate)
Tahm Kench's passive isn't his Gray Health. That would be his E, Thick Skin. His Passive is An Acquired Taste, which allows him to stack up Acquired Taste on a Champion to augment/allow his abilities.
Beyond that, though, while Gift of the Drowned Ones is ostensibly just the passive half of Thick Skin (Gray Health conversion), it requires that Pyke not be seen by enemies to allow the healing conversion to happen.
Bone Skewer (Harpoon) is less akin to Blitzcrank's Rocket Grab and more like a mix of Varus' Piercing Arrow and Taliyah's Seismic Shove. It requires charging, and it will only throw a target a set distance in Pyke's direction - at max range, it would draw them into, say, basic attack range, but at point-blank, it will work more like Singed's Fling, tossing an enemy behind him.
(which, is why I used Seismic Shove as the primary reference for it, as it's a skillshot and the distance thrown is based on positioning.)
Bone Skewer (Dagger)...I don't see how you relate it to Swain's Nevermove. Nevermove doesn't slow, and it roots on the way back. Bone Skewer is more akin to a mix of Yasuo's Steel Tempest (non-empowered) and Darius' Cripple. It's a line skillshot thrust that deals damage and applies a heavy slow.
Ghostwater Dive is less like Evelynn's Demon Shade and more like Twitch's Ambush, sans attack speed steroid and reset, and with diminishing movespeed.
Phantom Undertow is more like Shen's Shadow Dash + Twilight Assault combo, except the image moving triggers the stun and does so on its own. Even still, that's a pretty bad attempt at describing it, but it's certainly more accurate than using Irelia's Flawless Duet.
Death From Below is about the closest to accurate - it is somewhat like Darius' Noxian Guillotine, but also not like it at the same time. It's an AoE Skillshot that you can actually dodge, and the execute is less based on stacks (like Darius' Hemorrhage) and more reliant on an execute threshold (like Evelynn's Last Caress).
Even still, likening his abilities to other Champion abilities only detracts from the ability to understand Pyke's kit, especially when those example Champions are all over the place in role (Varus as a bottom laner, Taliyah and Swain as mid laners, Shen and Darius as Top laners, Tahm Kench and Blitzcrank as Supports...Etc.)
When we look at new Champions (or VGU's), we should only look at Champions abilities as being similar to others as a point of reference for understanding how to use them, not as a point of reference to infer their role.
Pyke is a Support-Assassin. He has some of the advantages and disadvantages of Assassins (high mobility, stealth, burst damage, but very lightweight and easy to kill) with those of Supports (Crowd control, ability to complement or uplift a given teammate, utility, but lack of extra ability without a teammate).
Professor Ward2 votes[{quoted}](name=Umbral Regent,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AOpNjiYp,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2018-05-14T19:20:19.393+0000)
That sort of over-simplification only hurts the ability to actually look at and understand the Champion. It's like when Galio was reworked, and people only looked at Hero's Entrance and spent the entirety of the PBE cycle going "It's just a better/shittier version of Shen".
Besides, you're ignoring the larger mechanical differences between each of the abilities you listed (some of which, by the way, aren't even remotely accurate)
Tahm Kench's passive isn't his Gray Health. That would be his W, Thick Skin. His Passive is An Acquired Taste, which allows him to stack up Acquired Taste on a Champion to augment/allow his abilities.
Beyond that, though, while Gift of the Drowned Ones is ostensibly just the passive half of Thick Skin (Gray Health conversion), it requires that Pyke not be seen by enemies to allow the healing conversion to happen.
Bone Skewer (Harpoon) is less akin to Blitzcrank's Rocket Grab and more like a mix of Varus' Piercing Arrow and Taliyah's Seismic Shove. It requires charging, and it will only throw a target a set distance in Pyke's direction - at max range, it would draw them into, say, basic attack range, but at point-blank, it will work more like Singed's Fling, tossing an enemy behind him.
(which, is why I used Seismic Shove as the primary reference for it, as it's a skillshot and the distance thrown is based on positioning.)
Bone Skewer (Dagger)...I don't see how you relate it to Swain's Nevermove. Nevermove doesn't slow, and it roots on the way back. Bone Skewer is more akin to a mix of Yasuo's Steel Tempest (non-empowered) and Darius' Cripple. It's a line skillshot thrust that deals damage and applies a heavy slow.
Ghostwater Dive is less like Evelynn's Demon Shade and more like Twitch's Ambush, sans attack speed steroid and reset, and with diminishing movespeed.
Phantom Undertow is more like Shen's Shadow Dash + Twilight Assault combo, except the image moving triggers the stun and does so on its own. Even still, that's a pretty bad attempt at describing it, but it's certainly more accurate than using Irelia's Flawless Duet.
Death From Below is about the closest to accurate - it is somewhat like Darius' Noxian Guillotine, but also not like it at the same time. It's an AoE Skillshot that you can actually dodge, and the execute is less based on stacks (like Darius' Hemorrhage) and more reliant on an execute threshold (like Evelynn's Last Caress).
Even still, likening his abilities to other Champion abilities only detracts from the ability to understand Pyke's kit, especially when those example Champions are all over the place in role (Varus as a bottom laner, Taliyah and Swain as mid laners, Shen and Darius as Top laners, Tahm Kench and Blitzcrank as Supports...Etc.)
When we look at new Champions (or VGU's), we should only look at Champions abilities as being similar to others as a point of reference for understanding how to use them, not as a point of reference to infer their role.
Pyke is a Support-Assassin. He has some of the advantages and disadvantages of Assassins (high mobility, stealth, burst damage, but very lightweight and easy to kill) with those of Supports (Crowd control, ability to complement or uplift a given teammate, utility, but lack of extra ability without a teammate).
When i posted this, i instantly regretted it because i knew people would come in with the usual "PYKE IS FUKIN OP" and thats not what this post was meant to be, im just a distraught support main who felt like the support role got "zed'd" with this champ release. A sort of, if you dont want to play support unless youre getting kills, dont play support at all, type of thing. Kind of undermines the whole role.
Even though i have to admit its probably going to be a good release, decently balanced in a month or two, and triple kills wont come as frequently as imagined.
Umbral Regent2 votesThat's fair. I don't expect Pyke will shake up the Support roster too awful much, but, I think some of the main issues regarding Pyke is that people have some strict views about what Supports do. From the way I understand it, the largest point of conflict comes from the fact that people expect Supports to allow their Carries/Bot lanes/whomever to get the majority of the kills and live vicariously through their carries.
And, as it stands, an Assassin playstyle undermines that expectation by a large margin. I think the "Supports allowing kills" mindset may wind up reinforced due to the Shutdown Gold changes soon, but, I personally think (especially in some cases) that Supports getting their fair share of kill gold and XP can be beneficial. (it sucks to always be one or two items behind your team, after all).
All that community supposition aside, though, I think it'd also help to do some supposition of Riot's possible motives for this. I mentioned in my initial response to your post that I felt Riot wanted to diversify Support playstyles by adding an Assassin, much like how they added Rakan as a Diver - but, there's another potential reason for it.
Opening everyone up to new playstyles. Whether it's helping introduce Supports to Assassins/Divers whatever other role, or giving people from various other parts of the map (like top lane, jungle, mid) an opportunity to squeeze their way into a role they otherwise wouldn't want to play.
I can understand frustration when your favorite role gets shaken up by new releases or new content, but, hopefully things will unfold in a good way, if not in the way Riot (may) expect it to.
Bottom Laner3 votesSorry, don't mean to be petty, but Tahm's E is the thick skin
Umbral Regent1 votesCorrecting me is anything but petty. Thanks for it, by the way - I've edited my response accordingly.
I swear I spent like, a half-hour looking through the Champions roster on the website to keep ability names correct and never once bothered to look at old Two-Coats. Bad practice on my part.
FridgesArePpl24 votesThey've released a bunch of awesome support mechanics in the last few years (see Bard, Rakan)
PB4UAME2 votesLook at the supports released in the last say, 5 years, compared to the champions released for any other position for the same time frame, then try to make that argument.
They get what, 2 a year? 3? And now they get one less this year because RIOT made an assassin with Morde syndrome, only, instead of single lane exp in a duo lane, its solo kill gold to everyone involved when he kills someone bot.
FridgesArePpl23 votesLook at the supports released in the last say, 5 years, compared to the champions released for any other position for the same time frame, then try to make that argument.
They get what, 2 a year? 3? And now they get one less this year because RIOT made an assassin with Morde syndrome, only, instead of single lane exp in a duo lane, its solo kill gold to everyone involved when he kills someone bot.
The last 5 support champs:
Pyke
Rakan
Bard
Braum
Thresh
All totally unique and really fun to play in their own way (obviously we don't know how good Pyke will be yet). Basically, every support they've released in the last 5 years has been a home run in terms of uniqueness of playstyle, balance, and enjoyableness to play. They also reworked Taric and made him way better and more fun to play.
PB4UAME2 votesYeah, guess what, Thresh was released in mother fucking January of 2013 That's mother fucking five goddamn years ago
They have released an average of LESS THAN 1 support per year, and this year we don't get a support, but a fucking assassin right as RIOT is overbuffing the everloving fuck out of assassins and they currently are one of the most dominant and represented classes in the game.
Is it really too much to ask for 1 fucking actual support champion a year? Is it fucking really?
We got Thresh 1/23/2013 Braum was 5/12/2014 Bard was 3/12/12015 No support for 2016 at all We got Rakan 4/19/2017
It's been over a year, and instead we're getting a fucking assassin. GJ RITO. [zombie-brand-clap]
Not to mention, they already tried the whole "Rakan is a support to cater to assassin players/mains" "Rakan is the assassin of supports" bullshit. Do we really fucking need two assassin supports, and no actual support since fucking March over three years ago?
I've been waiting over 4 years for a god damn support, since Braum's release, and all we've gotten is a champion who needs to be paired with a specific ADC to be a useful support, who is now a burst assassin midlane more commonly than support, and Bard, who while interesting and 'unique' is not exactly a standard support, and only works well with a heavy roaming playstyle.
Yets42401 votes22 champs released since Braum, one is an actual support, two are self described "support picks for assassin players" and or in this later case literally an assassin and nothing supporty with a Morde-esque tack on to shoehorn him into the lane instead of an actual support.
Yets42401 votesIn four years, two supports, and now Rakan is more of a solo laner from what I've heard.
Naalith4 votesAs someone who has hit level 7 on every support in the game outside of Lulu and Braum, I welcome this new champ with open arms. I like to do full AP Bard and when I jungle I tend to play assassins. I personally don't see this as an attempt to make people come play support, but as an attempt to make a unique champion unlike any other for the role. Let's face it, lots of supports have kits that fulfill very similar goals and the ones who are super unique (Bard, Rakan, Thresh to a lesser extent) are all super utility based.
I've been wanting an AD support since season 1 and this is a dream come true for me. The reason Riot has made all the supports either supertanks or AP damage is because an AD support would make the enemy bot just build armor to counter both players, so it makes sense the damage types were split. Pyke on the other hand builds full damage instead of stopping for support item purchases, allowing him to snowball him and his AD way ahead to stay ahead of the armor. I think the design is great and any AD support would have to be a full damage assassin for the reasons I just explained, plus it just puts a unique spin on the game. He's gonna be insane if he gets ahead and I'm excited to play him.
5050BS3 votesYep I can see him play every role
no to toxic2 votesnow there are 2 supports where you are forced to int if your sup picks it.
One352 votesw0t
Soraka Rules2 votesI actually like support [sg-miss-fortune]
Snowman Arc1 votesI mean, quite a lot of people have turned to supporting, especially this season. I, for one, did that and got a lot of free elo. Quite a lot of other people also play support as well.
The Bearded Bard1 votesEverything about his kit screams jungler. Stealth, mobility, cc, innate healing, execute? What about that says support?
Acheron162 votesThe shared gold and EXP on ult kills of course.
The Bearded Bard1 votesEven that could be better use for a jungler. Instead of giving kills to one person, they could spread them around
Acheron161 votesGreat! He's a support jungler now!
/s
ChaddyFantome1 votes[{quoted}](name=The Bearded Bard,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AOpNjiYp,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2018-05-15T08:27:29.977+0000)
Everything about his kit screams jungler. Stealth, mobility, cc, innate healing, execute? What about that says support?
You forgot waveclear.... oh wait he doesn't have that.