Mages itemization needs to be nerfed before they take over the whole map

Rexxiee·Dec 1, 2018·5 votes·1,695 views

Already took over mid, supp and adc, only a matter of time before they take over top as shows.

Why did they made it so almost every mage item has a random "300 hp" attached on them? Like i keep seeing shit like full build mages like with 2800~~3000 health while having over 700 ap, meanwhile we have adcs with 1800~~2000 at most since they dont get free defenses for building damage, like almost every other class does in this game right now, all that while having worse base stats than mages, while having lower base damage than mages, while having less cc and range than mages, why play an adc when mages exist again?

Nerf mages 2018, im ready for the downvotes since atleast 50% of this place are mage mains.

35 Comments

Noor SakataDec 1, 20186 votes

What ? Mages itemization needs to be buffed tbh the only HP item that is worth buying for most of mages is item 3165 Unless you mean champions like who buy item 3151 item 3116 and idk if more then that time , mention the champions names , don't say mages.

boricCentaur1Dec 2, 20183 votes

[{quoted}](name=Noor Sakata,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AGhJAeG5,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-01T23:43:52.805+0000)

What ? Mages itemization needs to be buffed tbh the only HP item that is worth buying for most of mages is Unless you mean champions like who buy and idk if more then that time , mention the champions names , don't say mages.

Ok your trolling right like this seems like your trolling like it seems like you do not play any mages since most mages can fit two of those health items in there builds and even if item 3165 was the only one built its fucking overloaded it gives 300 hp which is a lot for a range champion to have it also gives 15 pen and 80 ap like there is no ad item that comes close to having that good of stats like mages have the most overloaded items in the game by far.

Noor SakataDec 2, 20182 votes

item 3071 item 3053 item 3748 item 3814 item 3078 and others

While not all ad carries can use them But other ad champions can

ad carries got sustained damage , they got life steal they can buy item 3139 and with it they can dodge a whole mage rotation even so , ad carries are usually the Glass Canon hyper carry class , they have their supports with them

but generally ad champions can use a lot of build paths , they can use a lot of boots

while what mages can use other than item 3020 ? ad champions got more items generally and for a lot of different cases with item 3163 item 3111 , you can ruin the day of most of mages

While how many ap items give armor ? item 3157 only most of mages build path be like item 3285 item 3020 item 3089 item 3135 , that it's boring to play the role

" copy pasted "

boricCentaur1Dec 2, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Noor Sakata,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AGhJAeG5,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2018-12-02T01:33:25.994+0000)

and others

While not all ad carries can use them But other ad champions can

ad carries got sustained damage , they got life steal they can buy and with it they can dodge a whole mage rotation even so , ad carries are usually the Glass Canon hyper carry class , they have their supports with them

but generally ad champions can use a lot of build paths , they can use a lot of boots

while what mages can use other than ? ad champions got more items generally and for a lot of different cases with , you can ruin the day of most of mages

While how many ap items give armor ? only most of mages build path be like , that it's boring to play the role

" copy pasted "

Ummmm no none of those items are overloaded they all fix a playstyle where as most ap items do everything. They can go into all boots saying they can only go into item 3020 is like saying adc can only build item 3006 . Also item 3156 it sucks like if you build it your dumb it does nothing like it does not give enough ad or mr to be good and the passive is also not good enough to make up for it. Ok there does not need to be anymore armor items for mages since item 3157 can be used on all of them and it gives a good amount of amount and a good amount of ap like item 3026 is just a worse version of it in almost every way and it is better then every fucking mr item for ads since most of the ad mr items you lose damage for building it where as you do not. Yes it is boring it is very fucking boring but it is still better then ad.

Noor SakataDec 2, 20181 votes

See how you actually turned it into adc are weak ? we are talking about ad in general if adc isn't in a good state , doesn't mean you should make mages in a bad state as well , fix the marksmen problem and that's all , ad items for assassins/bruisers are over loaded.

boricCentaur1Dec 2, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Noor Sakata,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AGhJAeG5,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-02T13:12:49.744+0000)

See how you actually turned it into adc are weak ? we are talking about ad in general if adc isn't in a good state , doesn't mean you should make mages in a bad state as well , fix the marksmen problem and that's all , ad items for assassins/bruisers are over loaded.

Umm I did not turn it into adcs only in fact the only time I used them was to say the boots thing is dumb. The most you can say is I made it about bruisers since the items I talked about are usually built on bruisers but my arguments can be used on all the classes.

DuskDaUmbreonDec 2, 20183 votes

Just because they only have one reliable HP item doesn't mean their itemization doesn't need nerfs.

ADCs have no HP items. Do they then need larger item buffs than mages?

Noor SakataDec 2, 20184 votes

item 3071 item 3053 item 3748 item 3814 item 3078 and others

While not all ad carries can use them But other ad champions can

but generally ad champions can use a lot of build paths , they can use a lot of boots

while what mages can use other than item 3020 ? ad champions got more items generally and for a lot of different cases with item 3163 item 3111 , you can ruin the day of most of mages

While how many ap items give armor ? item 3157 only most of mages build path be like item 3285 item 3020 item 3089 item 3135 , that it's boring to play the role

DuskDaUmbreonDec 2, 20183 votes

ADCs, as a general rule, do not get any of the first 5 items you listed. I said "ADCs", not "AD champions".

If you're trying to count juggernauts and assassins, then I could point to Kassadin building item 3027 , or to enchanters, or to any other odd mages.

Mages always get sorc shoes because that's always what they've wanted since the dawn of time. Why would you get armor or MR when you could get Mpen to explode squishies faster

And no lmao a single item 3156 isn't ruining the day of a mage. It gives you a lot of durability in lane, but doesn't do shit in late-game.

ParoeDec 2, 20182 votes

{quoted}

ADCs, as a general rule, do not get any of the first 5 items you listed. I said "ADCs", not "AD champions".

If you're trying to count juggernauts and assassins, then I could point to building , or to enchanters, or to any other odd mages.

Mages always get sorc shoes because that's always what they've wanted since the dawn of time. Why would you get armor or MR when you could get Mpen to explode squishies faster

And no lmao a single isn't ruining the day of a mage. It gives you a lot of durability in lane, but doesn't do shit in late-game.

Against traditional mages - the ones with cooldowns and not assassins or battlemages - maw does ruin their day.

Noor SakataDec 2, 20181 votes

I did mention that they don't , but they have access to life steal and they have their supports anyway , they are glass canon hyper carries with high damage and dps after all , I find it pretty weird that your main language is English yet you can't understand that part .

DuskDaUmbreonDec 2, 20181 votes

And mages, generally, are meant to be squishy burst champions

The fact that they don't have much HP to buy means literally nothing in this case.

ParoeDec 2, 20182 votes

{quoted}

And mages, generally, are meant to be squishy burst champions

The fact that they don't have much HP to buy means literally nothing in this case.

Actually, because of the -AP+HP changes riot has made over the years we can assume riot intends for most mages to be a little on the bruiser-ee side, with only the very well scaling ultra safe mages like Lux and Ahri actually only buying AP+whatever else that isnt HP items.

When you see a mage function with 400AP and 2500 max health, youre seeing what riot fully intended. They want mages to be a little tankier with as much AP as an AD champion can get with their similar subset of AD+HP items.

RexxieeDec 2, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Noor Sakata,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AGhJAeG5,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2018-12-02T01:33:04.472+0000)

and others

While not all ad carries can use them But other ad champions can

ad carries got sustained damage , they got life steal they can buy and with it they can dodge a whole mage rotation even so , ad carries are usually the Glass Canon hyper carry class , they have their supports with them

but generally ad champions can use a lot of build paths , they can use a lot of boots

while what mages can use other than ? ad champions got more items generally and for a lot of different cases with , you can ruin the day of most of mages

While how many ap items give armor ? only most of mages build path be like , that it's boring to play the role

Congrats, you listed 4 bruiser items and 1 assassin item.

Adcs cannot viably build those items (and its actually impossible for them to buy steraks)

Noor SakataDec 2, 20181 votes

Some of them got some access to some of the items

and I already mentioned , not ad carries who can build them , I said " ad champions " yet ad carries got access to life steal , and they have high dps and they are hyper carries who depend on their support anyway , I'm pretty sure I said that in English

ArtumisPrimeDec 2, 20182 votes

ADCs literally can't build Sterak's or Hydra. These items are melee only.

Noor SakataDec 2, 20181 votes

this isn't an adc items are strong or something

I was talking about AD items generally , including Fighters/Bruisers/Junglers ffs , if marksmen items are weak , then that doesn't mean gut mage items.

ArtumisPrimeDec 2, 20182 votes

The person you replied to said "ADCs have no HP items" you listed HP items they can't even buy. Where's the logic?

Noor SakataDec 2, 20181 votes

Logic ? this discussion wasn't with you in the first place , if you gonna reply , read all comments and try to understand them well.

CppLDec 2, 20181 votes

Cause they have lifesteal...

HP CrookshanksDec 1, 20185 votes

item 3147 item 3155 item 3139 item 3111 item 3142 item 3095 "MagES aRE oP!"

saltranDec 2, 20182 votes

Yes, mages are strong.

ParoeDec 2, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Yes, mages are strong.

No. Not as a whole - Battle mages are strong due to high base damage and low cooldowns. "Karthus bot" is a meme - it only works because bot laners arent used to fighting non-marksmen, and in many cases dont counter pick properly.

Anyone peddling that 'mages are better than marksmen' are ignoring the fact that aside from ultra burst mages and CC heavy burst mages, the class is more or less "balanced". Further, anyone who complains about HP+AP items doesnt understand that the reason people choose ~400AP+600HP over 800+AP is because otherwise most mages simply cannot survive. Theres also the fact that mages are not flush with good CDR options. Just about every AP "CDR" item has 10% plus the haste unique passive, requiring you to spread out your CDR over many items OR take runes that give you CDR.

RexxieeDec 2, 20182 votes

{quoted}

No. Not as a whole - Battle mages are strong due to high base damage and low cooldowns. "Karthus bot" is a meme - it only works because bot laners arent used to fighting non-marksmen, and in many cases dont counter pick properly.

Anyone peddling that 'mages are better than marksmen' are ignoring the fact that aside from ultra burst mages and CC heavy burst mages, the class is more or less "balanced". Further, anyone who complains about HP+AP items doesnt understand that the reason people choose ~400AP+600HP over 800+AP is because otherwise most mages simply cannot survive. Theres also the fact that mages are not flush with good CDR options. Just about every AP "CDR" item has 10% plus the haste unique passive, requiring you to spread out your CDR over many items OR take runes that give you CDR.

Imagine calling a 10% pick rate 54% wr champion "MEME"

What a meme is karthus having >50% wr against EVERY SINGLE ADC IN THE GAME.

Moody PDec 2, 20185 votes

mages should have their CDR slashed from their items. they've really got no right to be slinging spells even half as often as they are capable of right now

RexxieeDec 2, 20183 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AGhJAeG5,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-12-02T00:15:44.087+0000)

mages should have their CDR slashed from their items. they've really got no right to be slinging spells even half as often as they are capable of right now

Yeah the cdr creep also making mages into basically dps champs now (or should i say burst per second?), basically another reason why mages are completely outclassing adcs now.

vgamedudeDec 1, 20184 votes

"took over adc"

meanwhile marksmen with their 90+ percent pick rate bot, actually think its even more like 95.

RexxieeDec 1, 20183 votes

{quoted}

"took over adc"

meanwhile marksmen with their 90+ percent pick rate bot, actually think its even more like 95.

Meanwhile karthus bot with a positive winrate AGAINST EVERY SINGLE ADC IN THE GAME.

https://u.gg/lol/champions/karthus/build/?role=adc

I wish i was kidding, but its the truth, then you look at brand/zyra bot lane stats aswell and you'll see, its complete domination.

vgamedudeDec 2, 20184 votes

{quoted}

Meanwhile karthus bot with a positive winrate AGAINST EVERY SINGLE ADC IN THE GAME.

https://u.gg/lol/champions/karthus/build/?role=adc

I wish i was kidding, its complete domination.

Yes on that site i've never heard of where he still doesn't even have a 3 percent pick rate, on champ gg it isnt even 2 percent, and that's karthus who is arguably one of the best most versatile champ right now.

macspamDec 2, 20183 votes

Mages have 4 HP / AP items (ROA, Morello, liandrys, and rylais). Meanwhile AD champs can build 3 (black cleaver, frozen mallet, triforce) in addition to lifesteal items (deaths dance, bloodthirster). So while I agree that it would be nice if health was more baked into marksman items, especially crit marksman,its not like there are no options.

vgamedudeDec 2, 20181 votes

Here https://champion.gg/statistics/#/roleSort=ADC&sortBy=general.winPercent&order=descend?roleSort=ADC&sortBy=general.playPercent&order=descend

sorted by play percent, there is not some giant exodus of marksmen in bot lane, there never has been save for one patch and then riot turned their back on promises of diversity right after.

vgamedudeDec 2, 20181 votes

I love how I got disliked for posting objective play rates bot lane. This board is insane.

aezensDec 2, 20181 votes

lul weakest class is ranting about the second weakest XD

FéliXXXDec 2, 20181 votes

yeah ap items are way better than ad, on top of that every champion has an armor scalling meanwhile they dont have mr scalling always.

their items are more gold efficient, magic pen is way better than armor pen and is not a scalling stat this item 3135 is better than this item 3036 and they have a lot of ways to survives assassins btw they have better scalling/they are more usefull.