Top lane isn't fun anymore and Riot has no plans to fix it.

AirKingNeo··14 votes·5,058 views

https://i.imgur.com/4l7PNj7.png

This is what top lane should look like. A display of the skill of two players fighting it out to the death. Unfortunately, this is not our reality. Reality is where tanks and lane bullies always win. A tank will outtrade a bruiser, have lower item costs than bruisers, and outscale a bruiser. Splitpushing is terrible and almost irrelevant with how easy it is to stop someone from splitpushing and how powerful teamfighting is comparatively.

Despite all of these issues. Riot has no intention to fix them. You all saw Meddler's post today. You know what it basically said? "This is what top lane is supposed to and it's shitty right now, but we'll fix it soon." Notice how he gave no dates and no real plans on how to fix top lane. Similarly, there's been supposed to have been a bruiser update for the past 4 years, but there hasn't been. Instead, bruisers got their 4 years of waiting wasted and replaced with a 'rune update'; an update that did absolutely nothing to benefit the group of champions who lost their update, their spotlight, and their time.

Season 8 was meant to be the year of the bruiser, but instead, the update that replaced bruisers' update completely skipped over their class entirely leaving almost 20% of champions to have no viable rune page. You would think that something so obvious and highly concerning as to one-fifth of the roster being unviable would be a red light and there would be a great concern. There isn't. Its been two months and there has been not a single change to fix the issue that almost 30 champions cannot be played at a decently competitive level because their update failed. This should be the first thing addressed every single day and there should be changes almost every single day to fix this, but there isn't.

Rioters say they are working on making a bruiser keystone, but have still yet to reveal it. What is one, single keystone going to do when they have absolutely no viable rune page? Precision, despite already being the weakest rune tree, was nerfed once again this patch. Many bruisers would like to go Precision to gain attack speed. Most top laners took a mix of AS or AD reds in the previous version of runes. When Runes Reforge launched, bruisers didn't get any compensation for their attack speed and/or AD from their reds because their rune tree bonus would supply that. However, Maokai received 15% bonus attack speed at level 1 to compensate for his loss of AS reds despite the fact he could still get the bonus health from Resolve. Why is Maokai, the top lane behemoth who has been consistently meta for years now and needs a significant nerf of his insanely high base stats, getting compensation buffs while bruisers are being left to dry? Why is Maokai getting infinitely more attention in terms of receiving help? Let's not forget the fact Maokai has access to Aftershock and Grasp of the Undying, some of the strongest keystones. What do bruisers have for keystones? They had Kleptomancy and hoped to rack up gold by hitting tanks like a pinata. Now that Kleptomancy is nerfed, what do bruisers have? Press the Attack was nerfed; Fleet Footwork requires Crit to be viable; Lethal Tempo is a joke that most bruisers can't even use.

Multiple champions who were balanced around Fervor of Battle now have no place because they don't have a suitable placement. Top lane is the lowest queued role in high diamond+ MMR. High elo top laners are quitting over how shitty it is.


This isn't the first time, but Meddler's thoughts have proven to be meaningless. Ask any critical question about the state of the game and your question will be ignored. Someone complained about Meddler's thoughts being downvoted, so now they don't even appear on the front page of the boards anymore. Personally, I don't think Rioters should be immune to the vote system. Pin a message if it's important, but you should be held accountable for everything you say, just like everyone else.

Similarly, I'm starting today by holding myself accountable. There is nothing on these boards that try to promote discussion, give interesting opinions, and promote high-level discussion. I'm changing that. I, first, must apologize. I was caught up in a movement that was unorganized, leaderless, and doomed to fail. I do not apologize on behave of all people against tired of the balance team, nor do all people tired of them need to apologize. I speak for myself that I was apart of an unchanged movement of circlejerking that was almost never put in check. The reason we're failing isn't a mystery. We're unorganized. Some people want mages buffed, some people want ADC nerfed, but can't keep seem to find a good way how to, some people want more champions viable bot lane, but can't seem to find a way for that to not be unhealthy for either side, and some people just want top lane fixed. There's a bunch of people talking and if Riot wanted to meet with us, they would have no sole person to have a conversation with. Today I'm quitting that.

From now on, I shall bring you stories that I think are important to be heard. The stories that promote critical thinking, bring forth a high level of discussion, and explore important topics that would otherwise be ignored. I'm choosing to lead where no one else dares to try.

70 Comments

Boulderox4 votes

One thing I would also like to add, the oddity that is lcs, where the recent event that went on. Top laners were the MOST key role in the game, and in a few games, the top laner was the most fed on the team, licorice Kled for example was astounding to see. But I find it very odd that in high level play, top lane is more powerful then among the average players where it is the worst and most uneventful lane in the game that gets no impact.

Passive gold gain is ruining the game wholey. It sucks, but it is a fact, when the adc is buying fucking item 3302 first item, junglers were buying them, but now mid laners rushitem 3312 so they can abuse the gold gain without a downside. MEANWHILE top lane can't do that in most cases, and needs to abuse klepto to get ON PAR with every other role and their gold boon. That is what I find stupid.

But the keystone argument is the one I have to agree with the players on, riot probably thought press the attack or lethal tempo would fill the bruiser hole, and maybe it could have. But thanks to the abuse of press the attack and how garbage lethal tempo is early game, nothing gets close to what fervor of battle was and was one of their best tools they had, to just throw it away is a huge spit in the face of anyone that plays non tank top laners that isn't Jayce or anyone that can abuse klepto top.

ZephyrDrake4 votes

why would meddler ever give a date to "this is when we will fix top lane" because all that will happen is that if that date comes and top lane isn't fixed people will bitch at him for lying to them even though a million things could have come up that interfered with the changes. Also do you expect them to just say "screw every single other lane and part of the game that needs fixing we should put everything on fixing top lane!"? that doesn't help at all and will just cause even more problems

AirKingNeo4 votes

GIve a date? So he can be held accountable. Mages are getting their item changes in 8.4 or something? Why are mages, which are fine right now, a bigger priority than burning top lane?

Yes, they should drop everything because the issue with 20% of champions having no viable rune page, and therefore being shit, is much greater than everything else.

ModWulf Helhammer2 votes

Things get a potential date when they are close to being finished.

Top lane changes aren't

AirKingNeo3 votes

Just like the bruiser update that never happened got a date?

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

GIve a date? So he can be held accountable. Mages are getting their item changes in 8.4 or something? Why are mages, which are fine right now, a bigger priority than burning top lane?

Yes, they should drop everything because the issue with 20% of champions having no viable rune page, and therefore being shit, is much greater than everything else.

"accountable" for what? a dumb date that they decided to put just to appease people like you who are only looking for people to blame? mages fine? i mean if you mean seeing the same few mages over and over since forever then sure mages are "fine". Top lane is already getting a new keystone rune, there are champions being buffed and nerfed that are in the top lane. Mage itemization is a complete joke atm and mage champions outside of a few select ones are as well.

Top lane is constantly being change, it's constantly being balanced. Hell the entire point of many of the big mid-seasonal changes that had been going on before this mid season were to make top lane more relevant. Sorry but you are nothing more than an entitled douchebag that does not want actual balance or change for the good. All you want is someone to point a finger to and blame for everything like it will mean something

AirKingNeo2 votes

Yes. Riot should be held accountable, instead of saying, "We'll get to it eventually." while never actually doing it just like the Bruiser Rework.

Mages are fine. Can you name a mage who isn't viable right now besides a champion who is obviously bad design like Karthus?

Top lane hasn't been changed in 2 years. It's been Maokai, Jayce, Gnar, and whatever else tanks for 2 years. No one is trying to balance it at fucking all.

Sorry but you are nothing more than an entitled douchebag that does not want actual balance or change for the good. All you want is someone to point a finger to and blame for everything like it will mean something

I actually do want balance because, unlike you, I want people to get off their ass and do their job rather than publically lie. I'm 'entitled' because I want people to not lie to me, because I want fairness, and because I want people to be held responsible for their negligence?

I think you're the "entitled douchebag" here. You're hammering at me despite having no concern for my feelings or position. You gave absolutely no thought to the real issues I face; you ignored my perspective and completely dismissed it without a single reason besides, "I don't like it, so it must be wrong."

ZephyrDrake2 votes

{quoted}

Yes. Riot should be held accountable, instead of saying, "We'll get to it eventually." while never actually doing it just like the Bruiser Rework.

Mages are fine. Can you name a mage who isn't viable right now besides a champion who is obviously bad design like Karthus?

Top lane hasn't been changed in 2 years. It's been Maokai, Jayce, Gnar, and whatever else tanks for 2 years. No one is trying to balance it at fucking all.

I actually do want balance because, unlike you, I want people to get off their ass and do their job rather than publically lie. I'm 'entitled' because I want people to not lie to me, because I want fairness, and because I want people to be held responsible for their negligence?

I think you're the "entitled douchebag" here. You're hammering at me despite having no concern for my feelings or position. You gave absolutely no thought to the real issues I face; you ignored my perspective and completely dismissed it without a single reason besides, "I don't like it, so it must be wrong."

and you just proved to me that you have no idea what you are talking about... Kled Illaoi Nasus Fiora Camille Riven Kennen have all had their fare share of spotlight in the top lane... They are not tanks nor are "Maokai (which is a tank mind you), Jayce or Gnar...

I am sorry that top lane isn't exactly how you want it to be but don't come here crying that it hasn't changed when it has... plenty of times and constantly. Riot should be held accountable if they haven't done anything, yet they are making a new rune for bruisers specifically... they have constantly made changes to make top lane more interactive by adding herald for example. I don't give a damn about your feelings, you are doing nothing but bash Riot and looking who to blame without looking at all at everything around you. Yes i have no idea what "real issues" you face and i do not need nor care to know about them.

You do not want balance at all since it's clearly obvious you don't even know what state top lane has been for the past 2 years yet claim that it hasn't changed... despite so much proof stating otherwise. Tanks haev not dominated top lane for 2 years, Jayce has not dominated top lane for 2 years, Gnar has not dominated top lane for 2 years. They all had their times in which they did dominate top lane but for 2 years straight? no, not even close

AirKingNeo1 votes

Kled hasn't had his time to shine top lane. Illaoi is abusing Klepto and otherwise wouldn't be good. Kennen, Riven, Camille, and Fiora (since rework) have always been in the spotlight and never fucking left.

Top lane is exactly what I said it is. Tanks beat bruisers at all stages. They win early, they teamfight better, and they negate splitpushing.

Gnar, Jayce, and tanks have been dominating top lane for the past 2 years. Literally ask any top lane main and they will you that. Jayce has been pick ban in pro play since the end of season 5 when they buffed him and he's never left being pick ban. The guy was fucking pick ban at worlds and untouched.

The real issues I face? I've got an incompetent company lying to their players and no one is willing to point it out besides a few people. My favorite characters can't be played because this company has neglected their balance team.

I'm not looking to blame anyone. If the game is in a shitty state, the people who put that game in the shitty state and refuse to change it are to blame. Are you saying I shouldn't hold someone responsible for something they are responsible for?

If not, you can shut up and end this conversation because you clearly are clueless about the game like Supermova said you are.

ZephyrDrake2 votes

{quoted}

Kled hasn't had his time to shine top lane. Illaoi is abusing Klepto and otherwise wouldn't be good. Kennen, Riven, Camille, and Fiora (since rework) have always been in the spotlight and never fucking left.

Top lane is exactly what I said it is. Tanks beat bruisers at all stages. They win early, they teamfight better, and they negate splitpushing.

Gnar, Jayce, and tanks have been dominating top lane for the past 2 years. Literally ask any top lane main and they will you that. Jayce has been pick ban in pro play since the end of season 5 when they buffed him and he's never left being pick ban. The guy was fucking pick ban at worlds and untouched.

The real issues I face? I've got an incompetent company lying to their players and no one is willing to point it out besides a few people. My favorite characters can't be played because this company has neglected their balance team.

I'm not looking to blame anyone. If the game is in a shitty state, the people who put that game in the shitty state and refuse to change it are to blame. Are you saying I shouldn't hold someone responsible for something they are responsible for?

If not, you can shut up and end this conversation because you clearly are clueless about the game like Supermova said you are.

Kled hasn't had his time to shine... Illaoi someone who was being strong even before klepto... you are looking for nothing but someone to point fingers to and so delusional in thinking that Jayce, Gnar and Tanks have been the only things dominiting top lane for 2 years... i am so clueless about the game that i actually know champions who have been really strong and dominating top lane more than you apparently. You could have just said recently, recent months and i would have believed you but 2 whole years? sorry but there have been way too many more relevant and dominating top lane champions in the past 2 years than you actually give it credit for. Both in SoloQ and in professional play but sure you can keep living under a rock and being delusional all you want.

Just like you wanted this conversation is now officially over since there is no point in continuing.

AirKingNeo1 votes

You claimed Illaoi was strong before Klepto. Basic research on her winrate, playrate, and high elo opinion of her already proves you wrong.

You can check any winrate and playrate chart over seasons. You can ask high elo top laners about Jayce and Gnar. You will find I am correct. There might be other champions who have been meta along side them, but they've always stood at the top.

Are you saying I shouldn't hold someone responsible for something they are responsible for?

Please answer.

ZephyrDrake2 votes

{quoted}

You claimed Illaoi was strong before Klepto. Basic research on her winrate, playrate, and high elo opinion of her already proves you wrong.

You can check any winrate and playrate chart over seasons. You can ask high elo top laners about Jayce and Gnar. You will find I am correct. There might be other champions who have been meta along side them, but they've always stood at the top.

Please answer.

"Just like you wanted this conversation is now officially over" what part of that don't you understand i have no intention of continuing

Purejoyce2 votes

{quoted}

and you just proved to me that you have no idea what you are talking about... Kled Illaoi Nasus Fiora Camille Riven Kennen have all had their fare share of spotlight in the top lane... They are not tanks nor are "Maokai (which is a tank mind you), Jayce or Gnar...

And that's pretty much it. That guy has no idea what he's talking about, it's hard to believe that he's not trolling, but he most probably isn't. <.<

Rewt1 votes

Riot needs to be very careful with bruisers.

The problem with balancing bruisers is that it is honestly very difficult to make them balanced.

You have to try and create a space where a champ can do solid damage, be semi tanky, but not be broken.

Also lets put it this way. Not every bruiser is useless or doesnt have a keystone for them. Hecarim is built bruiser with Predator or Aftershock, Kayn is also built bruiser with electrocute.

AirKingNeo2 votes

It's not difficult to balance bruisers. Who told you that myth?

Kayn's blue form, an assassin, likes Electrocute. Red Kayn wanted Fervor. Hence why Red Kayn is shit now.

Slendderman1 votes

Look at Skarner

-Solid damage -Big CC -Tanky

Same goes for Shyvana except CC

Rewt2 votes

Yea and you know how long its taken to get skarner to a spot where he is playable? like fucking 5 seasons and 2 reworks

AirKingNeo2 votes

You gave junglers when we're talking about top lane.

Yes, they are weak in diamond.

The two topics are synonymous. Literally, play a tank or Jayce otherwise you're a useless top laner. Tanks and Jayce beat bruisers at every point in the game. This has everything to do with top lane being a shithole.

Rewt3 votes

what......

TIL Kled, Camille, Fiora, Riven, Illaoi, Nasus, and Jax were junglers

AirKingNeo2 votes

Did I say they were all junglers? Did you link Jax as a jungler?

Don't avoid the question, answer it.

NemeBro2 votes

{quoted}

Did I say they were all junglers? Did you link Jax as a jungler?

Don't avoid the question, answer it.

You might want to brush up on your reading comprehension my friend. The person you're responding to isn't the one who linked Jax.

Rewt2 votes

You gave junglers when we're talking about top lane.

Read your own statement lol.

And also i wasnt the person linking, but hey. lets push the question back to you

Don't avoid the question, answer it.

That person linked quite a few bruiser top laners who do quite well. you are trying to say "all bruisers suck" and they dont. And a lot of them have found keystones that work for them.

AirKingNeo1 votes

No, most of them don't have a keystone. Skarner, Kled, Warwick, Jax, Xin Zhao, Udyr, Fiora, and Shyvana all don't have a keystone.

Rewt3 votes

im sorry, what?

While im not an expert on the others but Warwick has 3 keystones that are all used on him quite often.

Press the Attack (each ult tick counts as an auto) Electrocute, and Predator are all standard on him.

Purejoyce2 votes

{quoted}

No, most of them don't have a keystone. Skarner, Kled, Warwick, Jax, Xin Zhao, Udyr, Fiora, and Shyvana all don't have a keystone.

xDD Good one.

AirKingNeo1 votes

If precision sucks ass, what keystone do they have?

Purejoyce2 votes

{quoted}

If precision sucks ass, what keystone do they have?

But it doesn't, so you have nothing to say. And who said that it has to be "one rune for everyone"? <.< Stop embarassing yourself all over the place.

NemeBro2 votes

{quoted}

You gave junglers

I gave some junglers, and some top laners.

when we're talking about top lane.

No you're not, you're talking about the state of bruisers while pretending bruisers only go top lane. You're being delusional my friend.

Yes, they are weak in diamond.

Weird how statistically that doesn't seem to be the case.

The two topics are synonymous.

They aren't, and you've already admitted as much, hence your acknowledgement that there are bruisers who can viably jungle, which does in fact mean that bruisers being shit and top lane being shit aren't synonymous issues. You've defeated your own poorly thought-out argument with barely any prompting from me and nothing you can say will change that my son.

Literally, play a tank or Jayce otherwise you're a useless top laner.

Or Illaoi, or Kled, or Camille, or Gangplank, or Riven, etc.

Your statements don't gel with reality.

Tanks and Jayce beat bruisers at every point in the game.

So by your wording I assume you mean in terms of trading or 1v1s?

No, that isn't the case. Some tanks beat bruisers in lane and mid-game with items like ninja tabi, bramble, and sunfire. Very few tanks beat very few bruisers late game by themselves, and as for team fights it depends on the champions in question.

Oh, and Jayce? Jayce is literally dumpster trash as the game goes on.

https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/diamond/plus/champion/Jayce/Top/

Strong early, nearly useless garbage late game. Less than 46% win rate as the game goes on.

Why are you even talking about Jayce by the way? In the past month Jayce has been picked less than Kled in NA challenger (and far less than, say, Camille) and has a 37.7% win rate. He's not overperforming in diamond+, his stats are similar in Korean challenger, etc. The champion isn't going to get another nerf. You're frankly being delusional in terms of his placement in the meta right now.

This has everything to do with top lane being a shithole.

Afraid not, and repeating that same statement over and over again won't make it true.

AirKingNeo1 votes

No you're not, you're talking about the state of bruisers while pretending bruisers only go top lane. You're being delusional my friend.

The only non-shitty jungle bruiser is Shyvana.

So by your wording I assume you mean in terms of trading or 1v1s?

Both. Including teamfights!

NemeBro2 votes

{quoted}

The only non-shitty jungle bruiser is Shyvana.

Both. Including teamfights!

I accept your concession my son, though it is a shame you didn't have the courage to give it openly.

AirKingNeo1 votes

I didn't concede anything. There is one viable bruisers (for some reason) and it isn't even in lane.

I already said bruisers lost to tanks at literally everything.

NemeBro3 votes

{quoted}

I didn't concede

You did, thank you. =)

AirKingNeo1 votes

By naming 1 not shitty champion, you're somehow correct about all 12?

I also said tanks and Jayce are better at EVERYTHING (maybe besides splitpushing but tanks also negate splitpushing so??)!

How is that conceding?

NemeBro3 votes

{quoted}

By naming 1 not shitty champion, you're somehow correct about all 12?

I also said tanks and Jayce are better at EVERYTHING (maybe besides splitpushing but tanks also negate splitpushing so??)!

How is that conceding?

You continuing to deny reality in the face of evidence is a concession my friend. Please continue to offer more concessions, I'm always looking to add to my collection.

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