:thinking:
If locket and redemption both get nerfed without any other major buffs to other support items then botlane is actually going to be 2 mages against 2 other mages
WoonStruck2 votesHow are supports weak?
Also, there's no other mage with the sieging capacity of Ziggs, so no...it won't ever end up 2 mages against 2 other mages. You're daft if you think ADCs are being replaced by mages. You're daft if you think support relies on Locket/Redemption.
Clementine1 votesIf you don't understand why support and are weak, there's no hope in explaining
also adcs ARE being replaced by mages. Ziggs has one of the highest winrates in botlane, and Ahri/Cass/Jayce (not a Mage but yeah) are being played in the adc role more and more the higher elo you go. The higher winrate supports (besides Janna) are Zyra (a Mage), Brand (a Mage), and Malzahar (another Mage).
RcGjWO640w2 votesSupports simply lack the ability to compensate for the damage creep in the game's meta currently. They're not tanky enough early on and they don't do shit for damage on their own, so it makes it much harder for them to survive and feed their ADC's who are equally as weak. CC only works if the laner has the damage to do something with the window of opportunity it provides, which mages are more and more providing that pseudo burst carry role that wins lanes right now.
Ziggs bot is such a threat because Ziggs deals massive damage early on and ADC's have no way of matching that output. Yes, Ziggs is mostly burst, but ADC's can't handle burst, which puts them at a disadvantage since the supports have no method of dealing with it either.
Penns2 votesSupports arent weak at all. But Brand, Zyra, Malz,... support and dps mages like Ziggs, Cassio, even Viktor or Azir,... can work bot.
Dianna Leveret2 votesSupports are very weak - esp in gold elo and i guess below. And no - I don't consider Zyra, Brand and friends as supports. They are damage dealing mages - period. I can almost certainly say the same about Morgana. Her Q alone does 50% of adc HP starting mid game. No. I am talking about real supports, who are there to protect and bring utility to their team. Some may argue that damage supports also bring utility - by damaging enemies and giving free kills - well by those criteria , the mid laner is ALSO a support then, he is supporting the team with his damage right ??... People here just pick some random poke champ, place him bot and they don't even pretend to support. They play like another mage, with full AP items, no sightsone , no nothing, yet they still win their game.. I guess Vision is useless this meta, because we all know where enemies are - at bot.. Bot lane has turned into a 1 lane aram like place, where past the 10th minute, the whole enemy team and their relatives go there to get easy towers and easier kills of squishy support and adc's. Also considering almost all of those fake supports have some sort of CC, ashe is picked way too much for her arrow. I mainly play lulu/ Janna/Nami... and i feel completely useless. Combined with my crappy luck that i often get weak,complaining, bad farmed top laners and i lose most of my games nowadays - I basically have no one to support and also my heals / shields can't keep up with their full damage comps. I go place wards at key places ---> What for ? My jungler is trying to help my crying toxic toplaner who is about to lose 2nd tower, so we give them free drake. I go ward --> What for ? Their entire team is already at my bot lane at 10th minute mark, we can all see them... To be fair the games that i DO win i have the feeling I am better following my toplaner - if he is capable, who proceeds to carry me... Sure i CAN pick those cancer mages bot but i refuse to follow this meta. In my eyes it is destroying the game. Nowadays the games are decided by the jungler, the more he ganks bot, the more faster they get tower, then they proceed to mid from bot, then top etc... Every game it's the same.. People have learned how important taking towers is and this is why this 'meta' was created.. The team with fastest tower destroying and better camper jungler usually wins. Laning phase at bot lane does not exist any longer. From 10 of my games i have max 2, where we have a decent 2v2 laning phase at least for 15 minutes. Other times we/they get camped give up 1st tower and tilt.
TL:DR - I am not saying supports are weak, because of their kits or numbers, but because we aren't designed to survive 4 man ganks non-stop, better getting a mage, so that you at least get a kill while being ganked.
Craft Zeppelin1 votesBut ya know....those two items are stronger than a entire champion kit of a adc in this meta now.
Clementine1 votesThat's not a problem with the items, that's a problem of adcs