I figured I would just say that Cleanse is a Summoner spell, it shouldn't be inferior to an Item. Cleanse should be able to remove most, if not all debuffs. Tahm stacks, Zed ult, Vayne W stacks, maybe even things like Nautilus R. It simply cannot compare to the likes of Heal, or even barrier or ghost for that matter. It's just underwhelming. At the very least make it a summoner spell equivalent of QSS, it takes up a Whole summoner slot, make it worth that much.
shadowpriest13118 votesI think riot said it somewhere that they don't want a summoner spell completely invalidate a champion's kit, mostly at supression champs. At least an item requires an item slot and gold.
OperationDEEZ19 votesYes, but cleanse takes up an ENTIRE SUMMONER SLOT. THAT IS HUGE.
Let's see what one gives up for cleanse, provided they're taking 
: Kill pressure in lane, can hose sustain based champions such as 
and 
: Better map presence
: Heals and gives a movespeed boost, can easily turn around a fight and you can bait enemies with it
:Currently it's a worse heal unless you're under Grievous wounds, which imo makes it better for middle lane
:Dramatically slows an enemy, reduces their resistances, and almost completely shuts down their damage output.
bbyOni2 votesYes, but cleanse takes up an ENTIRE SUMMONER SLOT. THAT IS HUGE. Let's see what one gives up for cleanse, provided they're taking
forgot 
: makes you vroom vroom on a really short cd.
Narasimha12 votesThe issue is still that none of those spells would shut down a champion like Cleanse would. It would literally make Malz, WW, and Skarner unpickable. Atleast with QSS, you're making an investment that's usually outside of your build path to do so. No other spell would cripple a champion such, except maybe Ignite against sustain based champions. And even then, that's not a hard counter, merely an assistance.
Remlap12234 votesIt wouldn't make them unpickable. Malzahar's, Warwick's, and Skarner's ultimate does not have a 210 second cooldown at any rank.
Just like purification beads doesn't make Ares shit tier in smite. Yeah, he's not good, but purification beads don't completely invalidate him as a god in Smite just because CC immunity and removal hard counters him.
Narasimha2 votesJust like purification beads doesn't make Ares shit tier in smite. Yeah, he's not good, but purification beads don't completely invalidate him as a god in Smite just because CC immunity and removal hard counters him.
Try him in Arena sometime. You're basically solid for 7-9 minutes. After that, unless your teammates blow all the enemies beads first, he will NEVER get an ult off. Which does make him pretty useless.
Remlap12232 votesTry him in Arena sometime. You're basically solid for 7-9 minutes. After that, unless your teammates blow all the enemies beads first, he will NEVER get an ult off. Which does make him pretty useless.
Lol, Arena is where I spam him. I'm actually a pretty big Ares player since I got the Guan Yu bundle that came with a skin and emote on both gods. I'm pretty damn good with him, and I don't use him as a chain bot. I get right up in everyone's faces with my Searing Flesh and literally auto attack them. If they start focusing me that's when i start whipping out the chains and ultimate.
Narasimha3 votesIf they start focusing you, they deserve whatever happens to him XD But take my words with a grain of salt, I've always been a big Tyr player myself. Pulling me into the enemy team is my dream come true :P
revliledpembroke2 votesDiamond Ymir is here, and Yes, please Sobek, throw me into your team! YOU ARE MINE NOW! YMIR WILL LOVE YOU AND SQUEEZE YOU AND CALL YOU GEORGE!
Llanite1 votesYes, but cleanse takes up an ENTIRE SUMMONER SLOT. THAT IS HUGE. Let's see what one gives up for cleanse, provided they're taking
Cleanse is better than heal/barrier if the follow-up is strong.
Getting hit by Swain W, for instance, is 100% death when he catches you, even if Heal/barrier/exhaust was used. Cleanse would let you get out of the root, and run away.
TheRainInSpain1 votesBarrier gives you a shield, which is affected by your resistances. Got lots of Armor/MR? Barrier makes you tankier for the short time it's up. It's not really a good idea to run Barrier on ultra squishy champions (cough Mages and Marksmen) unless you're going to use it to stand and fight (totally the opposite tactic of almost all Mages and Marksmen).
Thairn20 votesYet the game is literally balanced around Flash?
FistOfSharkiesha4 votes Counters Mundo, Vlad, Nasus, Swain, Warwick.
Counter all auto attack based champions and champs that rely on 100-0 such as Zed
I get that you're just repeating what riot said but I don't buy that bullshit. Flash and Ignite have been top dogs for too long to warrant cleanse being shit because you can stop a supress.
O Fallen Scholar2 votesI think riot said it somewhere that they don't want a summoner spell completely invalidate a champion's kit, mostly at supression champs. At least an item requires an item slot and gold.
Which is pretty dumb reason to keep Cleanse still in the game. Just rework Cleanse into something else useful. Nobody picks it for soft CC removal anymore. It sucks!
Remlap12238 votesYep, it's pretty sad that a basic ability on a champion is stronger than the actual summoner spell.
: Can't cure out of 
/
ultimate.
: Can cure out of / ultimate on a tenth of the cooldown.
DropFill2 votesYep, it's pretty sad that a basic ability on a champion is stronger than the actual summoner spell.
Yeah, this is.... Complety normal.
Remlap12232 votesYeah, this is.... Complety normal.
No, it's not. Prime example, in Smite, their version of cleanse is purification beads. Now, the way Smite's "actives" work is a little different because you don't choose them before game, you buy them in game, and it's factored into your starting gold budget, which is 1500 instead of 475. Actives cost 300 apiece, and can be upgraded for 300 gold up to two times.
When you buy beads (because fuck Ares), the initial benefit is CC removal and immunity for one second. The cooldown? 180 seconds. Let's compare that to League, whose cleanse is CC removal, 65% crowd control _reduction _ for three seconds, with a cooldown of 210 seconds. Night and day, purification beads are a superior spell to cleanse.
I'm not even going into the fact that when you upgrade it for the first time, the duration of the immunity doubles while reducing the cooldown to 135, and then when you max it out, it turns into a three second immunity every ninety seconds, AND reduces the cooldowns of all of your abilities by three seconds.
Yet there are still plenty of gods in Smite that have some form of CC ignore or tenacity (Guan Yu's ultimate, Tyr's passive).
So what point is there to taking cleanse instead of a vastly superior spell like ignite, heal, or hell, even barrier? Hell, what's the point of even considering cleanse when champions like Master Yi, Morgana, Olaf, and Gangplank exist?
Abyssphere4 votesYep, it's pretty sad that a basic ability on a champion is stronger than the actual summoner spell.
There are a lot of basic abilities that gapcloser/escape better than Flash and a lot of abilities that provide bigger shields than Barrier though. I don't think it's that rare for champion abilities to outdo summoner spells.
Remlap12231 votesThere are a lot of basic abilities that gapcloser/escape better than Flash and a lot of abilities that provide bigger shields than Barrier though. I don't think it's that rare for champion abilities to outdo summoner spells.
Yes, but the difference is that you're not going to forego flash for another summoner spell on a champion just because they have a gapcloser (unless you're Shaco because his kits not overloaded in any way shape or form).
What's the difference between heal and cleanse? I'm not going to forego heal for cleanse just because Soraka's my support. Heal is good enough to stand on its own. Cleanse is not.
What's the difference between cleanse and ignite? I can use ignite in multiple different ways. I can ignite a champion at full health to supplement burst damage, or I can ignite them at low health as a way to secure a kill. I can use ignite to keep a high sustain champion in check. I can use it to dissuade tower dives.
With cleanse, you either use it to escape, or to chase, but more likely than not it's to escape and remove the grievous wounds from ignite.
The fact that Gangplank's Remove Scurvy is superior to cleanse isn't the reason it's shit. It's shit because it's weak on its own, situational on its own, and other summoner spells are just better in terms of value and utility.
If basic abilities on champion kits alone decided viability of summoner spells, everyone would run Teleport and Clairvoyance. Or Heal and Clarity. Or Ignite and Barrier. Yet Flash is taken 94% of the time. The last game I saw Clairvoyance outside of the last game I played was back before I could even take Summoner Flash.
SouL1ess3 votesYep, it's pretty sad that a basic ability on a champion is stronger than the actual summoner spell.
Gangplank can't cast W when suppressed.
If he can, it should be reported to the Report a Bug forum, because it is not the same behaviour pre-rework and it isn't on a patch note.
The Bíg Ticket10 votesRofl what? He always could remove supressions with his W.
Remlap12233 votesNo, he can remove suppressions. The only things that Gangplank can't remove are knockups because knockups have no counterplay. Riot has thought about putting tenacity in with knockups, and possibly CC removal on knockups as well, but Gangplank can cure out of literally everything else, including Malzahar and Warwick's ultimates, as well as Yasuo's airborne suspension.
gaby1best2 votesHe CAN. And it's intended. He still gets the damage if he doesn't get out of the range though.
I Main Swain3 voteshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-VBwa2FY5M
cmon man, it's even in his themesong
Llanite7 votesA spell SHOULD be inferior to item, because it can be grabbed for free whilst the later costs a lot of gold.
I Main Swain1 votesyes well the item also gives you many other very good stats and can be used far far more often. also, if you're not ad, the item is burning needed space.
Beerstein6 votesCut clarity in half and merge it with cleanse, it's now useful. Gives more early game pressure with the bit of mana and still does something late game, now they both work instead of neither.
Thairn5 votesMy issue with Cleanse is that you're punished for hitting it a fraction of a second too early when you see the CC coming in. Oftentime that tiniest fraction of a second of CC is enough to lock you down with teamates to kill you anyway. I know it has a 65% tenacity buff on it for further CC, but nobody who can suffer ANY CC takes cleanse. I good work-around would be a VERY short CC immunity instead. No more then 2 Seconds at most,
Wathehellsupdog1 votesA mini Ragnarok? That would not be a very good idea considering how strong Olaf's ult is already. It'll be way too strong at two seconds for a summoner spell. Maybe one or half a second but even then, I don't like the sound of any champion being completely immune to cc.
TurquoiseYoshi4 votesIt's more useful than Clarity and Clairvoyance, at least. Most people wouldn't rush QSS, so it has a use early-game. QSS also doesn't build into AP, but it builds into AD. Cleanse isn't very useful, but at least it has uses, unlike Clarity and Clairvoyance.
Earl Eulrich3 votesi sort of agree, only think that shouldn´t be cleansable is suppression (as the suppressor heavily relies on it and cc´s himself aswell for the time).
MAN OF INTELLECT3 votes
Flash should be a permanent spell right next to the recall button.
That way people can still make LC$ plays while increasing summoner spell diversity.
And then maybe more people would pick {{summoner:2}} or .
Serevas2 votesIt has some niche applications in mid lane, but not really anywhere else, and those applications are exceptionally limited. Annie, Cassio, Viktor, and the rare Ekko. It's not even that useful against Viktor and Ekko anyway due to the heavily forecasted nature of those stuns. If it dealt with Suppressions as well it would be far better, that's honestly all it really needs like you said. Just needs to be even with QSS.
EchoZeero1 votesI do agree that needs to be buffed because its use is practically non-existent currently. Also I could see summoner spells being chosen in-game at the start instead of in the lobby so that there could be a counter play element, and that would go for all summoners spells.
steampig1 votesCleanse is good on Tryndamere. Whenever I play him my lane opponent ends up taking ignite, so I can just negate that with cleanse. Plus he's generally weak against CC so it's pretty useful. And if I ever get stuck by a ww or malz, then I can use R in that case. But no, I wouldn't take it on any other champ.
BlkGolem1 votesWell i kinda agree, my biggest problem is that you have to get stunned in the first place to even really use it correctly, it should give you a bv type of spellshield for stuns if you use it beforehand. it is, however, named cleanse, so that wouldn't make sense.
Hat1 votesI sometimes use cleanse against CC heavy teams. I think flash is overrated. FLash has a huge cooldown, cleanse is better on that. Also some champions have pretty decent mobility, but get shut-down if they get hit by 1 stun.
Canechurch1 votes100x this. Every time I think "I should take heal" I regret it. Its only value is against a team that stacks like Leona/Ryze/Annie.
BlkStar1001 votesAgreed , even if it offers that safe condom early , it sacrifices either of a hear , ignite and even flash for an early QSS inferior effect . It needs some updates .
I Main Swain1 votesnot to mention it can't cleanse suppresses
Crowe Stalker1 votesI like this idea except where you say
maybe even things like Nautilus R.
No, Nautilus' Depth Charge should not be Cleanseable, Spell Shield is fine because that has counterplay but if Nautilus throws his ult and then it immediately gets cleansed you are not only negating the fantasy of a Champion but also denying them the ability to play around the most interesting part of their kit.
If anything I would recommend Cleanse be reworked into something like a Retroactive Summoner Spellshield: if you are under CC or Debuffs, you get cleansed. if you aren't, it gives you a 1.5 second spellshield to block the next spell so you can make sick outplays of things like 
Super Mega Death Rocket but not somehow protect your entire team from 
using Depth Charge.
TheRainInSpain1 votesCan't use Cleanse to get out of Tahm's mouth.
zFlash961 votesCleanse and Barrier could be merged together. 1- Cleanse removed 2- Barrier reworked into Sivir's Spell Shield (without the mana part, 300s CD, cannot be cast while stunned/silenced)
Pros:
Cleanse would be toxic if it was strong because it gives no counterplay:
in half and merge it with