If you want to improve wits end, give it some HP

Moody P·Mar 21, 2019·23 votes·10,955 views

Pure resist items are really bad right now and the variable value of Wits usefulness from game to game doesn't really help. Adding HP for more universal defense and slightly adjusting the effects it gives would go far for its overall viability

I actually think adding a Phage to it would be really useful since a lot of Wits potential users have poor synergy with the other two upgrades or just can't really afford it on their budget (Volibear, Warwick) or generally doesn't particularly care for the effects (eg Shyvana doesn't really care for Trinity but greatly enjoys Phage)

I think the teased Zephyr rework was a solid direction for it and could be good for Wits to follow up into; gaining increasing MR at a much higher value, with a higher flat magic damage to compensate for no MR shredding. Wits would make a solid high tier 3k+ gold item with a setup like that.

38 Comments

Minimac2000Mar 21, 20197 votes

I feel like this would be an insane buff for gnar tho....

SweedishGunnerMar 22, 20194 votes

Would help Yas and Irelia out too which is probably a bad thing.

KoggyStyleMar 22, 20191 votes

if it helps gnar it helps the whole onhit crew, most people still wouldent built it tho, personally i will buy it on occassion.

Warlord RhinarkMar 21, 20193 votes

I don't really know about giving it a Phage, as that would mean it would both have health as well as AD and the Rage passive.

I think a Ruby Crystal or even a Giant's Belt would suffice.

heroikcMar 21, 20195 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9jKokwWb,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-03-21T20:54:42.006+0000)

I don't really know about giving it a Phage, as that would mean it would both have health as well as AD and the Rage passive.

I think a Ruby Crystal or even a Giant's Belt would suffice.

item 3211 ?

Warlord RhinarkMar 21, 20193 votes

Then it would need to keep the regen passive.

heroikcMar 21, 20194 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9jKokwWb,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-21T21:06:15.003+0000)

Then it would need to keep the regen passive.

item 3065 item 3194 ?

Warlord RhinarkMar 21, 20196 votes

{quoted}

?

Both items have health regen.

Yets4240Mar 21, 20193 votes

Adaptive gives less regen than its components and doesn't have SC's unique regen passive. SV also loses SC's regen passive as well.

Warlord RhinarkMar 22, 20194 votes

It gives less regen because it makes up for it by being constant regen, whereas Spectre's Cowl requires you to get hit by a champion first.

Anu3isIIMar 22, 20191 votes

It wouldn't be that bad of a thing. After all, the item encourages extended fights.

Having two passives on an item isn't that rare and I think it would actually be beneficial in this case.

Rathar DashingMar 22, 20191 votes

item 3136

Warlord RhinarkMar 22, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Rathar Dashing,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9jKokwWb,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2019-03-22T01:54:42.308+0000)

That would mean giving it AP as well as the Madness passive.

Rathar DashingMar 22, 20191 votes

That's the point

Wild GeeseMar 22, 20193 votes

Wits End is amazing how it is. It's just only useful in certain Champions in certain situations- which is fine.

PaletongueMar 22, 20192 votes

In my opinion, I think they should push Wits End to have more magic resist, and be a better situational choice for tanks/heavy bruisers against magic damage.

Think Amumu's passive. He isn't known for his auto attacking, but ends up doing so when he has already engaged and is waiting for CDs. A lot of tanks have medium length cooldowns, so there is downtime when they don't have spells to cast but still want to stand in the middle of teamfights. If Wit's end provided more magic resist on hit, it could be what makes tanks last longer in fights against AP heavy teams, as well as ambient magic damage from other tanks

Of course we always have to worry about ADC abuse, but that's another matter. Maybe add a super small % max health heal so it works better on tanks and bruisers with larger health pools? If thats the case, it could be built out of item 3211

SaiannaMar 21, 20191 votes

I'd rather see Wits end having better AS/on-hit. HP stat is tad too generic and overabundant at this point

Moody PMar 22, 20197 votes

There has never been less HP in league than right now

SaiannaMar 22, 20193 votes

I'm not saying there's too much HP, but there are too many items that give hp already. Wits end shpuldn't have it imo. It should be just perfect item for all on-hit users, rather than "i have bit of this and that and this, but every stat is somewhat mediocre".

Buff its stats, like AS so on-hit champions can actually get closer to cap 2.5AS without buying AS-crit items, that don't benefit them as much.

While we are at it, turn runaan to its former clean on-hit form, rather this crit bs.

TerchioMar 22, 20192 votes

I feel like an HP jolt is going to turn it into an Ionic Spark in usefulness. MR is bad enough making it a countering item, but HP will make it too flimsy to compete with anyone properly. I must agree with Saianna on this one.

Old Ionic Spark was generally stronger farm than Statikk Shiv, iirc. It was still a noob trap because it left you starved for power spending a full item's worth of gold on half an item of power. Now it at least builds into heavy damage coupled with IE, and doesn't have diminished power stats for defense, either.

Chembaron YamadaMar 22, 20191 votes

Yeah, no, please keep Ruunans as a crit item. I don't want to miss it on my Jinx and Twitch.

SaiannaMar 22, 20193 votes

.... You didn't have to miss it on jing or twitch when it was crit-free item. It instead provided huge AS stat.

Chembaron YamadaMar 22, 20191 votes

I prefer it being a crit item on them still. I want to get as much crit as possible on these 2 and Ruunans being one helps alot here.

KlydeFrogMar 22, 20191 votes

Improve onhit damage is all it needs

Rathar DashingMar 22, 20191 votes

that can stay, buff the other numbers (attack speed, MR, MR stealing cap) to all be 42 and it would be perfect.

KoggyStyleMar 22, 20191 votes

so a partial revert?

Rathar DashingMar 22, 20191 votes

Kind of? Been a while since it was 42% AS, and it was never 42 on the other numbers.

KoggyStyleMar 22, 20191 votes

yeah im not really remembering its stats 42 total mr shred and atk speed wasent it 42 mr at one point? personally im also missing maladys?

Yets4240Mar 22, 20191 votes

It had 42 on hit damage before it got nerfed.

Rathar DashingMar 22, 20191 votes

It still has that. They gave it 42 on-hit again a long time ago.

AORVALMar 22, 20191 votes

Honestly they need to get rid of it. Champions that stack auto enhanced items except crit are hard to stop as is unless you have hard cc. Items like item 3124 item 3153 item 3161 item 3078 make the champions insanely snowbally and capable of 1v5ing which is just unhealthy and stupid for the game. Adding an updated version of Wit's End where enemies get Armor+Magic resistance per auto will make it impossible to kill the already hard to kill Master Yi and Jax.

EthreainAmbusherMar 22, 20191 votes

If you improve want to end wits, it give some HP

RebonackMar 22, 20191 votes

I really liked the idea of Wit's becoming a Dagger/Nega component item. The direction Riot went with the Zepher remake was just a little ham-fisted. Keep the component Madred's. Complete the trio with a Dagger/Giant's Belt Ionic Spark.

Each component item could be combined with a Recurve Bow or combine all three Trinity-style.

While we're at it remove Phantom Hit from Rageblade and give it hybrid OnHit damage instead. Balancing OnHit effects and champions is going to continue being a pain so long as Phantom Hit is a thing.

Z3SleeperMar 22, 20191 votes

Phage is simply way too good of an item. I'd rather not open up the possibility for non-BC/TriForce users to be viably building it.

Rathar DashingMar 22, 20191 votes

Hype for Phage Kai'Sa

FSRERMar 22, 20191 votes

Welp, if something like that happened maybe it would return as a recommended item for mundo!

MysticShakerMar 22, 20191 votes

Why not true dmg? Hp are useless in this shitty meta too

Ambitious MinnowMar 23, 20191 votes

Peronsally I love Wit's End and think it's fine when you use it at the right times, trying to end game early with lead. If it were to receive some kind of improvement, I would love to see it have the capacity to reduce cc / some kind of tenacity increase on hit. All the times I build Wit's End it is to fight enemies who also have overpowered cc.