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@Riot Don't do this again Riot.

Zerenza··6 votes·4,875 views

Senna looks interesting, i love her design i like her R, Q and W but guys, c'mon.

E - The Curse of the Black Mist Senna turns into a cloud of fog, gaining movement speed and camouflage for herself and nearby allies. Allies who come out of the fog are seen by enemies as ghostly phantoms that cannot be attacked until they attack or approach.

Like, i could get behind her making sort of a "Safe Zone" around herself that enemies can't attack her or her allies while outside of, that's pretty interesting but could definitely be frustrating and the fact that if you see the "Fog" you can't tell how many champions are hiding inside of it is definitely going to be frustrating, to add they can also launch their abilities from inside of it as well and that's pretty strong to. Why did you have to add that enemies that exit it are Untargetable? That's ridiculously strong, the whole ability is absurd and i'm getting Akali flash backs from it.

All i ask Riot Games is that you take a step back and rethink releasing a champion with that ability. A long time ago the champion Lux was supposed to have an ability that gave her allies Camouflage, it was scrapped because and i quote "Not every champion in the game is balanced around being Invisible." but your going to release a champion with an ability that does exactly that?

Again i love the rest of her kit she looks great and i always wanted a champion who satisfied my need for a global laser of death, but that E is terrifyingly powerful and it's going to be impossible to balance.

Edit: Forgot to mention that you can't CC her or deal damage to her to cancel her E, i imagine that this was done because she's always at the center so you always know where she is but it still makes the ability hard to play against because there isn't a counterplay to it. Your forced to go inside of it where her entire team might be waiting for you and i think that's too strong. If the Untargetability was gone and it could be canceled by dealing damage to or CCing senna, the ability would be frustrating but not overpowered this current interation is both frustrating and overpowered.

13 Comments

Ultîma4 votes

The zone is camouflage so you can literally walk up to break the stealth. Think of it like Pyke, except you know where Senna is because you can see the mist. At a distance, just think of it like Akali's shroud where she can't be targetted but skillshots and AoE will work. This ability is neat, but it isn't nearly as strong as you're making it out to be.

Zerenza2 votes

First, don't use Akali's stealth as an indicator of balanced stealth, it's one of the strongest stealth abilities in the game and riot made a mistake when it was released that's very similar to what they're doing with Senna. Akali shroud used to not allow you to Target akali while she was under tower, turns out that not being able to target someone but still being able to see them is just as frustrating and hard to balance as her just being invisible. Which is why i don't like that senna's makes her allies Unclickable whenever they leave her mist.

I would never risk walking into her Fog, her entire team could be hiding inside of it and i'd never know. I know where Senna is, she's in the center of the mist but i don't know where the rest of her team is inside of the mist. To add, as i said, with Pyke, Rengar, Twitch and Evelynn, their Camo is canceled whenever they're attacked or attack, senna's is not, meaning that regardless of what you do to her allies or her, they will remain stealthed until senna cancels the ability herself. If i could i would GLADLY take not being able to be knocked out of my stealth as Evelynn any day of the week, that's broken.

It turns out that not being able to see enemies is extremely strong, regardless whether you know their General location or not it's still frustrating and this iteration of her E lacks a large number of Counterplay options when compared to other champions with Stealth.

Pika Fox3 votes

{quoted}

I would never risk walking into her Fog,

Malphite

Zerenza2 votes

Yes, i mean it would definitely work but again, i don't want to have to pick a certain champion, whether it be malphite or someone else with great AOE CC just so that senna's team can't group under stealth.

Pika Fox3 votes

{quoted}

Yes, i mean it would definitely work but again, i don't want to have to pick a certain champion, whether it be malphite or someone else with great AOE CC just so that senna's team can't group under stealth.

You mean you dont want to have to have a frontline and play a team game properly?

Leona Amumu Alistar Galio love this. Hell, even mages such as Vladimir Brand Annie with strong AoEs love this. Hell, Anivia Fizz easy 5 man Qs/ults? Hell yeah.

Zerenza2 votes

First, Brand R and Annie R have to be casted on a Targeted enemy, you can't target enemies that are Stealthed or that are effected by her "Mist" effect after leaving the fog. It's not that i don't want to have to have a frontline, that's not what i'm saying, what i'm saying is that your FORCING me to counterpick for a champion because if i don't i won't have any other way to deal with that ability.

Second, again, all i'm saying is that the ability lacks a large amount of the counterplay that comes with most other Stealth abilities in the game while also giving that Stealth to champions that aren't designed to have it(As i stated in my original post an ability similar to this was going to be on lux and they didn't do it for this exact reason.). I'm 100% sure this ability, unless they atleast take out the part where allies can't be clicked on after exiting it, will be just as hard to balance if not harder to balance than Akali's Shroud was.

The Stripy Bag1 votes

{quoted}

First, Brand R and Annie R have to be casted on a Targeted enemy, you can't target enemies that are Stealthed or that are effected by her "Mist" effect after leaving the fog. It's not that i don't want to have to have a frontline, that's not what i'm saying, what i'm saying is that your FORCING me to counterpick for a champion because if i don't i won't have any other way to deal with that ability.

Second, again, all i'm saying is that the ability lacks a large amount of the counterplay that comes with most other Stealth abilities in the game while also giving that Stealth to champions that aren't designed to have it(As i stated in my original post an ability similar to this was going to be on lux and they didn't do it for this exact reason.). I'm 100% sure this ability, unless they atleast take out the part where allies can't be clicked on after exiting it, will be just as hard to balance if not harder to balance than Akali's Shroud was.

Tibbers isn't a lock on Ability that's Annie's Q your thinking of and Brand still has his W and Q not to mention he could still just wait for they can be targeted again to use his ult or he could stack his passive using W and Q to get it to bounce off a minion to them. Also yeah that's kind of how counterpicking works is it makes it much harder for a champion to beat their counter unless someone is good enough to make up the difference. On a more personal and side note there a 140 something champions in the game and you are saying you don't wanna learn more than one. If you're gonna one trick then you can't really complain when someone brings some that's built to kick your ass which she's still gonna be squishy and they have to make sacrifices for that Direct Untargetability.

Pika Fox2 votes

{quoted}

First, Brand R and Annie R have to be casted on a Targeted enemy, you can't target enemies that are Stealthed or that are effected by her "Mist" effect after leaving the fog. It's not that i don't want to have to have a frontline, that's not what i'm saying, what i'm saying is that your FORCING me to counterpick for a champion because if i don't i won't have any other way to deal with that ability.

Second, again, all i'm saying is that the ability lacks a large amount of the counterplay that comes with most other Stealth abilities in the game while also giving that Stealth to champions that aren't designed to have it(As i stated in my original post an ability similar to this was going to be on lux and they didn't do it for this exact reason.). I'm 100% sure this ability, unless they atleast take out the part where allies can't be clicked on after exiting it, will be just as hard to balance if not harder to balance than Akali's Shroud was.

Brand R, yes, but guess what? They all have to be grouped up inside that mist, so you can have someone else reveal them and all of a sudden you have a clustered group. You also have QW you can use, and Q will amp W on one target while hitting everyone else. Annie can just E > Flash R and hit everyone. Hell, even W to hit everyone. Annie has 2 skillshots.

Lacks counterplay? It forces the enemies to group and is broken immediately by walking towards them. You can also see them from a distance, which is the opposite of what stealth generally does.

Zerenza1 votes

I mean i guess you do have a point but i still don't like the idea of it, i'm sure something will have to be removed from it before it will be balanced and i think that the Unclickable(Cause that's what it describes it as) mechanic should be the first to go and i think it would be fine if that mechanic wasn't there, the ability would still be very useful and do it's job just fine.

The Stripy Bag2 votes

{quoted}

The zone is camouflage so you can literally walk up to break the stealth. Think of it like Pyke, except you know where Senna is because you can see the mist. At a distance, just think of it like Akali's shroud where she can't be targetted but skillshots and AoE will work. This ability is neat, but it isn't nearly as strong as you're making it out to be.

Exactly and that's not even mentioning Red wards which people never f#@king buy for some reason against stealth champions or champions with True Sight effects like Lee Sin who is a real pain against her E because of his Gap Closing and having only his Ult being point and click. But yeah people just wanna be dumb when it comes to stealth mechanics.

Zerenza2 votes

Those all work, all i'm saying is that it's going to make her very hard to balance, especially in Pro Play where i'm sure she'll be pick or ban. I main a stealth champion, Evelynn, i don't mind stealth so long as the weaknesses of it can still be exploited and the fact of the matter is that 90% of the champions in the game are not designed to be balanced when Stealthed or Consistently Untargetable(Lucian proced it 3 times in their teaser earlier this week).

I'm gonna be real with you i'm not going to walk up to what is potentially an entire team just so that i can place a Control Ward that they'll take out immediately afterwards. It does have SOME counterplay, yes, but invalidates a lot of counterplay that other stealth in the game has while also giving that stealth to champions that aren't designed to be balanced around it.

FlameHalbrdOkido3 votes

Laughs in Illaoi, the how team is grouped inside that little cloud of mist? Perfect

Zerenza2 votes

I mean yes but your going to have to pick a champion specifically to counter her E, sure counterpicks are part of the game and picking to counter specific parts of a team are but imagine being forced to play Illaoi, Poppy, Ornn or Malphite every game that senna's in.

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