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Hey Riot, Some Advice From Someone That Has Been Around Since Beta

LifeCyclesTWA··1 votes·954 views

The whole "I don't want to support, can I jungle/adc/mid/top" crap has existed since the start of the game. Because of the lack of people that want to play the support position, many people are autofilled into said role and forced into something that is as you would call "antifun" for the good of the team. Many champions have been reworked over the course of this games history because they reduced the overall experience of those playing. I believe the support role needs an overhaul for the same reason, and autofilling people into said role isn't the way to go about it.

Why doesn't the average player not desire the role of support? I believe the answer to that is people agree that they can't carry a game the way a successful top/mid/jungle/marksman can. They don't get the glory of having some eye-popping number of kills. The #1 reason people don't find support to be fun is that its the hardest role to carry a game with. The perfect game as a support isn't nearly as fun to the average player as snowballing and slaughtering teams as a top/mid/jungle/adc. How do you change that?

Well, in DotA 2, without going into great detail, supports actually tend to have some of the strongest abilities in the game to boot but don't scale into late game. They use this advantage to roam the map and provide vision/ganks for their teams/lanes and protection for their hard carries. Supports have the absolute largest impact on the first half of every single game due to their map prescence and power at early levels before the core position players get items.

That said, I'd love to have supports in this game to FEEL like they are having a large impact like they do in DotA. A way to do that would be to make roaming less risk/reward for supports. You give up so much in terms of gold, protection, and experience by roaming in this game as a support if you fail to successfully gank. Allowing them to place more pressure on the map early on without so much risk would be awesome.

TL;DR: I believe that more players would love to play what is now the least-desirable role in the game, support, if it had a more rewarding impact on the game. I think the best way to do this would be to make roaming more effective and an option for supports in the early stages of games.

9 Comments

5050BS2 votes

DING DING DING we have a winner.

Playing support (like everyone wants you to play) means you are ALWAYS behind. You cant 1v1 anyone (for the most part) and are a ward bot (the thing that I find the most un-fun)

This is what they need to do.

Make Items like Jungler Items that require you to have Heal or Exhaust as a Summoner to buy. They are Items that the ADC would NOT want but give actives that are what a support WOULD want. Allow a Support to get Gold like any other Role. Give them Bonus Warding and Ward placement Range.

This way you can shape the Support builds and play styles without messing with the Mid Lane builds for champs like Zyra, Lux, Malz, Annie, ect

Support items make them tankyer for AP builds and more Utility (longer slows, extra Stuns, Better heals, Shields) Allowing a team fight to last 20-30s is NOT a bad thing to the game. Having a ADC blowup in .2s by a Rengar or Zed at the start of a team fight IS a bad thing for the game.

Sarutobi2 votes

{quoted}

DING DING DING we have a winner.

Playing support (like everyone wants you to play) means you are ALWAYS behind. You cant 1v1 anyone (for the most part) and are a ward bot (the thing that I find the most un-fun)

This is what they need to do.

Make Items like Jungler Items that require you to have Heal or Exhaust as a Summoner to buy. They are Items that the ADC would NOT want but give actives that are what a support WOULD want. Allow a Support to get Gold like any other Role. Give them Bonus Warding and Ward placement Range.

This way you can shape the Support builds and play styles without messing with the Mid Lane builds for champs like Zyra, Lux, Malz, Annie, ect

Support items make them tankyer for AP builds and more Utility (longer slows, extra Stuns, Better heals, Shields) Allowing a team fight to last 20-30s is NOT a bad thing to the game. Having a ADC blowup in .2s by a Rengar or Zed at the start of a team fight IS a bad thing for the game.

But then wouldnt these work better on other champions not typically on the support role. I mean this is the reason why Frost Queen Claim got nerf hard. it was good on the support, but heavily abused towards others lanes because of the cc and gold income. What is stopping other lanes from using Heal, or Exhaust and getting more gold than usual. Plus your idea basically means Supports are suppose to be Warding bots. Everyone should be warding period. Thats the reason why we have a limit now because people dont understand the importance of warding and assume (and still assume to this day) that warding should only be done from the support!

LifeCyclesTWA1 votes

If Riot were to do it that way, then they would give support's their own seperate items similar to junglers. Junglers give up a summoner spell in order to have smite, for the sake of balance supports would give up a summoner spell in order to have access to their items. Lets say, heal or barrier.

Edit: This would make Flash or Ghost + TP standard for top, Flash or Ghost + Smite standard for Jungle, Flash or Ghost + Ignite/Exhaust standard based on matchup for mid and marksman, leaving supports to take the support oriented summoner spells (heal, barrier) that would in turn provide them access to support-only items.

Aptest1 votes

{quoted}

If Riot were to do it that way, then they would give support's their own seperate items similar to junglers. Junglers give up a summoner spell in order to have smite, for the sake of balance supports would give up a summoner spell in order to have access to their items. Lets say, heal or barrier.

Edit: This would make Flash or Ghost + TP standard for top, Flash or Ghost + Smite standard for Jungle, Flash or Ghost + Ignite/Exhaust standard based on matchup for mid and marksman, leaving supports to take the support oriented summoner spells (heal, barrier) that would in turn provide them access to support-only items.

not heal or barrier.

Exhaust.

Q r a f T e e1 votes

{quoted}

not heal or barrier.

Exhaust.

And I think that's the harder part. For junglers, you know they essentially need Smite to jungle so you can tie items to it to limit it to that role. Even then you have tops who may take it for the ability to access some of the items from time to time.

For supports, it's harder because you can't say all supports need Heal, Barrier, Exhaust, Clarity, etc. Frequently AD carries take Heal and they used to pick up Barrier. Mids can pick up Barrier or Exhaust depending on their match-up. As such, you run into players calculating the cost/benefit analysis. Maybe Barrier is worth picking up now that it opens up a variety of items to use which may be OP for mid laners. And then what about damage dealing supports like Zyra and Brand who might want to pick up Ignite?

So if they want to find a way to empower supports with a new variety of items, it'll have to be done in some manner that isn't just locked to summoner spells.

Aptest1 votes

{quoted}

And I think that's the harder part. For junglers, you know they essentially need Smite to jungle so you can tie items to it to limit it to that role. Even then you have tops who may take it for the ability to access some of the items from time to time.

For supports, it's harder because you can't say all supports need Heal, Barrier, Exhaust, Clarity, etc. Frequently AD carries take Heal and they used to pick up Barrier. Mids can pick up Barrier or Exhaust depending on their match-up. As such, you run into players calculating the cost/benefit analysis. Maybe Barrier is worth picking up now that it opens up a variety of items to use which may be OP for mid laners. And then what about damage dealing supports like Zyra and Brand who might want to pick up Ignite?

So if they want to find a way to empower supports with a new variety of items, it'll have to be done in some manner that isn't just locked to summoner spells.

I've been repeating this point for a while now: supports individually are pretty damn strong. what keeps them down is filling the niche of ADC protectors. specifically being the only one who attempt to fill this function. in addition junglers are currently crowding them out from the role of offensive play maker. if ADCs become stronger (if ADCs can 1v1 the guys who try to dive then) or if junglers are forced into playing ADC caretaker (they won't do it unless forced) than support is more free to do offensive play which is more fun.

5050BS2 votes

Other players dont change their minds on the support warding thing. Have never changed their minds over 3 warding changes.

So make warding for support easier with more wards and longer ward ranges.

The thing about FQC is that anyone can pick it up. That is why you link it to a summoners spell and you can only buy one item linked to it.

Personally I think it would be cool to have all summoner spells have linked items that you can pick only one of but have 3-5 options.

We have Smite items and we have ADC that pick smite to get one. They lose Heal or Flash or Ignite in doing so.

It gives more play paths and more strategies to teams.

On the Gold, make it so you get bonus Assist gold. That way as support you dont want to get the kill and as a non-support you dont want the item because you cant get the bonus gold.

FQC removes the disable if you kill a minion and that is why Mid Laners pick it up. I dont find this a issue tho after it was nerfed.

The idea is to make the Support role more fun and more noticeable.

Sarutobi1 votes

{quoted}

Other players dont change their minds on the support warding thing. Have never changed their minds over 3 warding changes.

So make warding for support easier with more wards and longer ward ranges.

The thing about FQC is that anyone can pick it up. That is why you link it to a summoners spell and you can only buy one item linked to it.

Personally I think it would be cool to have all summoner spells have linked items that you can pick only one of but have 3-5 options.

We have Smite items and we have ADC that pick smite to get one. They lose Heal or Flash or Ignite in doing so.

It gives more play paths and more strategies to teams.

On the Gold, make it so you get bonus Assist gold. That way as support you dont want to get the kill and as a non-support you dont want the item because you cant get the bonus gold.

FQC removes the disable if you kill a minion and that is why Mid Laners pick it up. I dont find this a issue tho after it was nerfed.

The idea is to make the Support role more fun and more noticeable.

I agree with everything you said aside from your first point. As a support main i dislike only being able to place 4 wards (3 green and one pink/control) it sucks mainly because to this day i still have ADC who despite having a trinket, never uses it, and then blames me when bot lane isnt warded enough. Let alone i shouldnt be forced to ward top/mid, mainly for early game because again this would give me less gold unless placing a ward would give me enough gold to compensate for leaving bot lane to ward top/mid side.

I mean my only concern would be abuse. Take Lee Sin as a jungler by this logic he could take Smite/exhaust and basically get a huge amount of income because of these two role specific summoner spells. how would we combat this?

Aptest2 votes

As a support player, I have to say I find it easier to carry, from the support position, than from the ADC's position. I can be on the map, get in someone's face, and with the support of my team, force kills or objectives on the other team. I can set up areas for fights, I can catch the enemy team off guard, I can funnel the enemy team into an ambush or direct mine into a fight or a picks.

This has one important caveat. I can only do all these things if I don't have to babysit the ADC. The moment I am forced into either picking a dedicated ADC-protector or playing dedicated to the protection of the ADC, I cant.

This is because the ADC can't fight other classes, and benefits mainly from peeling and reactive, conservative play. The ADC in addition can not easily take opportunities created by the support, because they are so easily turned on and killed by the enemy.

Whereas the mid lane or jungler can take advantage of proactive play-making and shot calling.

This is why cooperation with the ADC is detrimental to the carrying ability of the support player. The support who peels and protects primarily will not be making plays, he will be following on the ADC's conservative, reactive play.

And even if the ADC is bossing it up and carrying hard, the support is still in a second fiddle position.

edit: no disrespect to janna players, I love you all don't kill me.

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