Zed & Talon Items

Dreadlocks·Feb 11, 2015·2 votes·677 views

So I was wondering why is so popular on but not . I know before worked well with's ulti, however they made Botrk more of an auto attack item rather than the active. I know it still helps "some better than none" But I'm just curious as to why isnt popular on .. I havn't really tried it. But I always get on Which is also quite popular on now and with it sounds deadly for too. Someone fill me in? Why is more auto attack based whereas is burst? Not to say Zed isn't bursty.

Edit: Is it cause Talon's Q scales well with raw AD?

16 Comments

PraiseYossarianFeb 11, 20152 votes

Some games people do build bork, but usually there is no room for it and it isn't optimal. You have to rush mobi boots and ghostblade so that you can ghostblade + ult and ahve 500+ ms to initiate on someone from outside of their vision of your ultimate blades, and then after that you need to have the damage to instantly kill your target so that you can disengage before their team can respond and cc + burst you. Bork provides less burst damage but more sustained damage and more sticking power, zed needs to land a few auto attacks so he benefits from the ms buff and his ult also doubles the active's damage, so he benefits from it more than talon who just wants to blow someone up in .5 seconds. Hydra is a better second item for talon because it gives more AD and it's active works well with his spell rotations.

Oh, also Talon's Q is an AA reset and aa reset's don't scale well with AS because it would be like building cdr when you have a spell that instantly refreshes your cooldowns. One aa, q, another aa, hydra + w will kill any squishy and bork isn't worth building if you are only attacking twice.

WhereTheNamesAtFeb 11, 20151 votes

Zed autoattacks to proc his passive on targets and Botrk's current health damage passive synergizes together. The active also gives him something to amplify his damage when he activates it after his ult.

Talon has no need for Botrk because he usually kills squishy's in a full spell rotation. Most Talon builds end up being full armor pen items because of how his abilities work with it. Talon does not auto attack enough to use the item to its full capacity.

DreadlocksFeb 11, 20151 votes

Good point on the Zed passive, however Perhaps Talon doesnt auto attack enough because he lacks Attack speed which BOTRK can fix? Idk it just sounds kinda cool with youmuus crits and his Q

WhereTheNamesAtFeb 11, 20151 votes

If you want to spend 3200 gold for Botrk then save up another 600 for IE. It scales off of Talon's Q (I believe) and will give 40% crit. I normally get it as my last item and late game you can just E to people, use Q and kill them (might need W but no ult).

DreadlocksFeb 11, 20151 votes

This is the main reason I think Talon builds high dmg rather than attack speed. His Q.. Thanks Makes sense.

Sailor MintFeb 11, 20151 votes

After 3 seconds, Death Mark will trigger, dealing flat physical damage plus 20/35/50% of all physical and magic damage dealt to the marked champion while it was active.

This includes items and can be amplified by crits.

DreadlocksFeb 11, 20151 votes

So is your point that the attack speed is to help proc the crits? Why not just I.E/Youmuus then?

Sailor MintFeb 11, 20151 votes

BotRK: Passive damage (8% Current Health on hit) + active (10% Max Health) all get amped. Youmu's: More basic attacks in (and more BoRK passive procs) + chance of crit.

insaiyanbaccaFeb 11, 20151 votes

i dont have an idea but other people explained it better then i could but have you tried shiv on talon? i find it quite effective as third-fourth item

DreadlocksFeb 11, 20151 votes

item 3158 item 3142 item 3074 item 3035 item 3071 item 3031 is my standard build. With 4points in sorcery for masteries this gives 40% cdr

insaiyanbaccaFeb 11, 20151 votes

that is a good build i would use that except im not a fan of youmuu's i dont like the way the item feels so i tend to replace it with shiv, and depending on whether i need more lifesteal i sometimes replace ie with bt or even qss if needed as they give the same amount of ad just they can be more useful in different situations. and i do like cdr boots sometimes but i like to roam alot on talon so i tend to pick up mobi's and then sell them for cdr boots later on if needed.

DreadlocksFeb 11, 20151 votes

The movement speed with item 3142 and Ultimate is so good. I consider that my mobis xD

TerffFeb 11, 20151 votes

Idk... I just usually rather have armor pen and then tankiness on talon.

I usually build: item 3074 item 3035 item 3117 item 3071 or item 3142 item 3102 item 3143

DreadlocksFeb 11, 20151 votes

Interesting i never thought of building defense on talon, whats the reason?

TerffFeb 11, 20151 votes

Just more durability, from what I've played you are still able to kill squishies even with 2 tanky items and you survive longer if you do happen to find yourself in a rough situation. Idk, I'm not all that big of a talon player and normally my games don't go long enough to get tanky items but normally thats what I pick up on him, or swap out banshee's for a GA

SouL1essFeb 11, 20151 votes

The only time when you can use BOK effectively on Talon is when your target has no intention to fight you at all. It's also the same reason why you don't build Trinity Force on Talon: building Raw AD and/or armor penetration will contribute much more to your damage than AS and on-hit effects.