Does anyone else think that Cloud and Mountain dragons don't give enough?

JavelinJoe·May 9, 2016·3 votes·844 views

Infernal and the Ocean dragons are always fought for, but if a cloud appears, I see both teams kinda place it on the back burner and only take it when it is convenient. Similar thing happens to the Mountain dragon as well. Currently, I see that Infernal is the highest priority to get, then Ocean, then cloud, and lastly is mountain who is not really much to fight over in the first place unless you are the jungler.

Maybe if Cloud could give tenacity as well as a permanent movement speed buff that persists through combat, and if Mountain could give damage resistance form maybe players and/or other sources on top of the current buff, they would become closer in value to the other two elemental dragons.

14 Comments

Zero Skill TankMay 9, 20162 votes

Ocean is stronger than Infernal, at least if taken early.

JavelinJoeMay 9, 20162 votes

Both have their strength, I find Infernal to be stronger for more of the full game, but that is just me.

Zero Skill TankMay 9, 20161 votes

Generally speaking, yeah, but Ocean has few corner-cases that break it. If it's taken early, amount of resources killer team greatly helps all lanes and jungler, infernal is only good in lanes you could play aggressive in the first place, i.e. it won't do anything to help Cho'gath in laning vs Lux.

Second breaking case, even worst one, are champions like Maokai, who get just absurd amount of in-combat sustain from it + new SV. Mao with SV and Ocean drake is just disgusting, I was it once myself, I played against it once, now I'm just glad it's getting nerfed soon.

JavelinJoeMay 9, 20161 votes

Alright ocean is better for immediate effect but i still think 3 infernal is stronger in the long run

Zero Skill TankMay 9, 20161 votes

This is not what I mean. What I wanted to say is that while infernal is stronger in general, there are some situations when ocean totally breaks the game - i.e. ocean is only more powerful if you have Maki, Grag, Yorick and the like, or if you take it very early, but if that happens it's stupidly strong.

JavelinJoeMay 9, 20161 votes

Ah. I see. Yeah that does get annoying on tank healers like Garen and Mundo

vladeragMay 9, 20161 votes

Swain with RoA and AA and a 3 ocean buff is basically god.

run some tank masteries and runes, throw in a visage and tabi, hourglass and scepter. and then show people that the bird is in fact, the word.

EMetaMay 9, 20161 votes

Players don't tend to notice hidden power. It's why Janna was OP for so long. Riot can run numbers now that the dragons have been out for a while and see how different dragons change the % chance of winning games, and certainly they're going to adjust some numbers based on that. But I wouldn't be surprised if players also change their behaviors around which to take sooner once they figure out the same thing about the less-obvious buffs.

vladeragMay 9, 20161 votes

its powerful yeah, but what is 45 movespeed compared to 24% ap and ad?

and the ocean buff is just ridiculous, a swain or mundo with a 3 ocean buff... they just wont die.

EMetaMay 9, 20161 votes

At 2-3 stacks, cloud does fall off pretty hard, since you hit the movespeed soft caps on most of your team, but if we're talking one stack, and I (or my opponents) have a split-pushing team, maybe I want that ms. I'm not saying it won't need adjustments, just that it's probably under-appreciated.

Aaaand that brings me to the adjustment I want. Give cloud dragon buffed teams relief from the ms caps! Now I wants it always.[zombie-nunu-hearts]

IgotlazyMay 9, 20161 votes

People underestimate Air because it isn't as visible as the other buffs. It's still pretty strong, especially if you have a pick based comp or are against one.

JavelinJoeMay 9, 20162 votes

but 15 flat out of combat is nothing. It is the only one which goes completely away in combat.

IgotlazyMay 9, 20161 votes

Ya well good luck using Earth in a Teamfight most of the time. I do think Earth and Air need a bit of a boost (and Riot has confirmed that some tweaks are coming) but what they actually give is fine.

vladeragMay 9, 20161 votes

Cloud yes, mountain no. Mountain dragon increases damage to other dragons, baron, rift, and turrets. So an early mountain can result in a sizeable lead.

Cloud, however, is kind of silly. Its not useless, but its not nearly as useful as the others. All of the others have direct impact on combat, whereas cloud helps with rotation. True, rotation is important, but what is 45 movespeed out of combat compared to restoring 10% max hp and mana every 6 seconds?

3 ocean drags can make a swain or mundo a god. 3 cloud dragons will do... not much...