The current flat amount is simply a joke. A simple Talon W can clear theam. Even a single Karthus Q can. In teamfights they simply blow up by random AoE. PLEASE give them ward-like health, so that they have to be actively attacked in order to be destroyed.
ComannderShepard4 votesI agree the small ones blow up way too fast in fights
Yuumi or Lose4 votesMy honest opinion, Heimer is outclassed. Even with the rework, he is still not "there". This is what I feel that Heimer should get so he can stand toe to toe with the games current state. He needs lower cooldowns on all of his skills Especially on his turret. You take a look at the champion itself. What makes him special and the first thing people will think of Heimer is his turrets. They die so quick late game and even with full cdr, it's still on a long recharge timer. Along with his other spells, they still have such a long cdr with max cdr. Here's 3 options to work around. Like OP said, give them ward-like health, reduce cdr on turret (and possibly on his other spells), or AT LEAST make his turret active when you leave the vicinity. I never understood why his turrets now deactivate when you leave out of their range. It was perfect on old Heimer.
Drunk Rummate3 votesuhh they can actually take a pretty big beating
i played jayce in lane vs a heimer last night and it took me 2 Qs or an E+Q to kill a turret, and that's a lot of burst that i wasn't able to use on other targets for a pretty long cooldown and at a pretty high mana cost
and my W triple shot wouldn't even kill a turret until i finished my manamune... but i guess that's just the downside of a tear build.
and if you're talking about lategame teamfights... spread them out so that they don't all die to a single aoe. or stockpile them since they can be placed pretty reactively anyways.
Kowe The Ewok1 votesuhh they can actually take a pretty big beating
i played jayce in lane vs a heimer last night and it took me 2 Qs or an E+Q to kill a turret, and that's a lot of burst that i wasn't able to use on other targets for a pretty long cooldown and at a pretty high mana cost
and my W triple shot wouldn't even kill a turret until i finished my manamune... but i guess that's just the downside of a tear build.
and if you're talking about lategame teamfights... spread them out so that they don't all die to a single aoe. or stockpile them since they can be placed pretty reactively anyways.
Well ther are better charcters to play against Heimer than Jayce. Note that you also can auto attack them. They also have a cooldown of 24 / 23 / 22 / 21 / 20, which is MUCH, MUCH more than most abilities take which can destroy them.
(Also note that you can't have several turret stacks until you reach a certain skill level in your Q) So "simply gather stack", is easier said than done. Especially if you have a 20s+ cooldown and they die with 2 AAs or 1 skill)
P.S: Even if they're not stockpiled there are man large AoEs which easily destroy them (even a support Zyra ultimate...)
Hayaishi3 votesHis problem is that hi completely avoids any kind of lane interaction.
They HAVE to be this weak.
Cacapoopoopipi3 votesThey last a good while. Besides that, Heimer has such a short CD on them in the mid game that he can replace any destroyed ones quickly. And not to mention that it's already ridiculous how long they last after Heimer dies. That needs to be addressed actually.
Kingsgrave2 votesIt becomes a problem against one person in lane though. Most of the nerfs towards Heimer have been due to top heimer.
Remlap12232 votesThe problem with that idea is that Heimer would need a new passive. The whole point of his passive is to make his turrents last FOREVER. Turning them into Zyra plants would be ok, ish? I don't know, I don't play Heimer a huge amount. But I feel that's the main reason why Heimer's turrents aren't like Zyra's plants.
LeeDark2 votesIf nothing else were to change, Heimer would still need a new passive. His is crap.
Kowe The Ewok1 votesThe problem with that idea is that Heimer would need a new passive. The whole point of his passive is to make his turrents last FOREVER. Turning them into Zyra plants would be ok, ish? I don't know, I don't play Heimer a huge amount. But I feel that's the main reason why Heimer's turrents aren't like Zyra's plants.
That might be the concept, sadly it doesn't work out if they die by a single spell or 2 auto attacks.
DarthSpectrum2 votesMy main issue with the turret is that even minions can take them down without much effort. Giving them blocks of health instead would just make the process above faster.
Ninpire2 votesi think i like that. because as it stands, dont quote me on this im not sure, it takes more than 3 autos from most mid lane mages to destroy them early, but they just blow up late game when people actually have damage. they even give gold like wards so why not?
Kuroi862 votes125 + (25 * level) + (5-40% AP based on level)
Want more hp on turrets, build more ap. xD
Kowe The Ewok1 votes125 + (25 * level) + (5-40% AP based on level)
Want more hp on turrets, build more ap. xD
Now consider that even the worst mages have at least 0.6 scaling on their 4s cooldown abilities.
Kuroi861 votesVlad E lol .45
But I digress.
It could be a good idea to buff the health per level as well as up the lvl 1 scaling.
disregardable1 votesNah. They just need better scaling. Early (and even mid) game they're fine. Really annoying, actually. They just need to have scaling health so they don't get one-shot.
Brenticus121 votesHe shouldn't get ward like health because it's already a pain early game to clear them quickly for an engage. Seeing as how they fall off durijg mid to late, they just need better scaling health.
Kynami1 votesWon't happen because it would be either overpowered or underpowered depending on lane opponent. Would be overpowered against people who rely on skill shots for their ranged and completely worthless against any competent ADC or AA based APC past the opening ten minutes. As is Heimer is situational and some lane opponents just are horrible match-ups for him. (Syndra and Veigar can really ruin his day...)
Kowe The Ewok1 votesWon't happen because it would be either overpowered or underpowered depending on lane opponent. Would be overpowered against people who rely on skill shots for their ranged and completely worthless against any competent ADC or AA based APC past the opening ten minutes. As is Heimer is situational and some lane opponents just are horrible match-ups for him. (Syndra and Veigar can really ruin his day...)
Why would they be overpowered against a skillshot based champion? What keeps him from hitting a ward 3 or 5 times? I don't understand the reasoning behind your statement.
Kynami1 votesIf it takes an opponent upwards of 200 mana and three sets of cooldowns to clear ONE turret since their only range is a skillshot its an automatically lost lane unless they eat the entire turret nest worth of poke. Thus why it will never be that way.
Kowe The Ewok1 votesIf it takes an opponent upwards of 200 mana and three sets of cooldowns to clear ONE turret since their only range is a skillshot its an automatically lost lane unless they eat the entire turret nest worth of poke. Thus why it will never be that way.
Where the hell do you get these numbers from??? That are absolutely made up numbers.
Kynami1 votesHardly. Diana's only ranged hit is her Q. If its ward like health that is three Qs or walking up the stupid turrets and eating mini-turret damage, Heimer's autos + abilities, etc. Galio is another melee AP, his cheapest costs are at first level skills and even then its a minimum of 60 for his Q. Even some of those like Lissandra who actually have a ranged auto have baseline mana costs of 80-85 for their ranged poke. And furthermore we can get to the likes of Kassadin with a 1st level Q of 70 MP and who is also another melee AP, Malphite with a 70 cost 1 level Q, and Chogath also has 70 1st level E and 90 1st level Q.
You cannot have Heim's turrets have ward health without their potential being nerfed heavily because its abusive against most melee champions in general and would contribute far too much zoning power. And being absolute famine against other champions who'd drop a pool and laugh as your turret blows up in a second flat.
Or in other words stop complaining they need more health and realize that aggressively using them instead of having a defense line to retreat to is going to have the lane opponent wanting to clear them fast... which already requires they spend resources and cooldowns on your turrets and not you. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
TeemoHunter13371 votesi completely disagree. they are fine the way they are. heimer shouldnt need to rely on his turrets late game. he has a ult+stun combo that wrecks in team fights.
also having ward-life health. how do they interact with aoe spells? does not affect them? what about skillshots? it makes heimer too op. ud have to actaully treat them like wards and take off them 1 by 1 which u cant do in a team fight or late game where you can get instagibbed.
Kowe The Ewok1 votesi completely disagree. they are fine the way they are. heimer shouldnt need to rely on his turrets late game. he has a ult+stun combo that wrecks in team fights.
also having ward-life health. how do they interact with aoe spells? does not affect them? what about skillshots? it makes heimer too op. ud have to actaully treat them like wards and take off them 1 by 1 which u cant do in a team fight or late game where you can get instagibbed.
His ultimate requires his abilities to not be on cooldown, meaning that he basically can't poke. His ultimate and stun is strong, but his tun is easily dodgeable and his ultimate disables his basic DPS ability.
Drukyul1 votesHow about a compromise where it has two stacks of half the current HP? So any overkill from the first HP bar doesn't carry over to the second HP bar. This would keep them from being eliminated with one single AOE spell.