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I have played new Mordekaiser, and he feels too simple

Moody P··11 votes·2,804 views

He is heavily lacking in an appealing nuance that helps lessen that "unga me club you" thing that juggernauts oft get stigmatized for. He is very, very reliable and its almost stifling in how guaranteed he starts feeling after you get used to his E.

What I mean by nuance is that most other juggernauts have some kind of depth to their playstyle that at least makes it fun to get up on somebody and bash them like a cave man. Darius plays around 5 stacks before he has his steroid and his Q outer range and R resets. Illaoi fights around her tentacles. Aatrox fights around his sweet spots. Yorick is pretty mindless bashing but he has to PvE for half a minute before he can throw E at you and go full chimp on your head.

Mordekaiser gets his passive up with any 3 instances of damage from his kit, and then his passive aura is up for as long as he's fighting. In addition to that his primary steroid is completely passive and permanent, and only requires gold to scale it further.

Its not that he's almost Garen levels of simple, but I just don't really feel satisfied by the gameplay pattern I'm given; he doesn't have enough visceral satisfaction through stimulating visuals to make this simplicity work the way Garen does. And I asked my friends who also have PBE and they agreed that he feels very simple and statchecky.

I like a lot more about Mordekaiser than I thought I would -- him having a pure defensive tool and good utility is fantastic change of pace and a direction I hope continues -- but currently the sum of the kit is offputting to me.

28 Comments

Mid Nidalee3 votes

Current Mordekaiser is very rewarding to learn, but most people have just played a couple of games and inted a bunch. From the outside he looks like a very easy champion but with time spent on him, he is amazing. I got my MMR to d4/d3 in a matter of 30 games on him so far this season.

I have played new Morde on PBE and have 3 complaints about his design.

Ultimate: Being able to take a jungle champion out of an objective fight for 7 seconds is kinda busted.

Ghosts: Ghosts being removed completely takes away from Mordekaiser's old identity. Riot has really failed us here.

W: This ability almost doesn't feel like an ability currently, the values are so weak. It feels like the W belongs on the passive and the passive belongs on the W.

Overall he feels like every other juggernaut/fighter in the game now, but with a niche ult, instead of the unique drain mage he was. Riot has been shoeing champions into a classification like juggernaut/marksman/enchanter and removing the uniqueness of their play style for quite some time now..

Overall, he looks cool; but pretty disappointed with the game play.

Kelg2 votes

Main damage comes from 2 abilities that are skillshots but hes a statcheck? You don't know what a statcheck is.

Moody P6 votes

No it doesn't. E is not anywhere close to his main damage and you'll find that in an extensive trade passive and auto attacking will outpace his Q nuke.

Yes, he is a stat check; he can very easily win fights simply by showing up to them, especially when R makes it easier to do exactly that. Skill shots do not exclude a champion from being a stat check, or else we would not call Shyvana and Mundo stat checks.

Alzon1 votes

Say you build Nashor’s on him and he gets 1.00 AS. With his passive up, he’s dealing 85% of his AP as DPS, and that’s without factoring in his base damage (which seems lower than live Morde). You could potentially just build him with speed ups and slows to the point where you press a couple keys then right-click once to win, like Mundo or pre-rework Aatrox.

Now compare that DPS with his Q and E. Yes, he is an immobile auto-attack based melee champion. Q is more for poke/CS than as DPS, while E is engage. His win condition is simply getting in range. At least, that’s all they should be for - but they also stack his passive! I say Morde’s base attack speed should be slightly higher, and his passive only stacks on autoattacks. Or they make it five-hit like Darius’s.

Moody P2 votes

That's what I've been doing in my games. I take Conqueror or Phase Rush with Approach Velocity secondary; after Rylais Mordekaiser is basically permanently at 460 movement speed. Its quite potent.

I think it might feel better if part of his passive were moved onto W active, then he might have a more deliberate feel to him

Sir Saltarin6 votes

Mundo isn't a stat check, just dodge his Q

In fact he's perfectly designed

The Ecdysiast2 votes

Is this a troll response?

FireDrizzle4 votes

No he has a point, no ones says Mundo isnt a statcheck because his Q.

Kelg1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sir Saltarin,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=44UEK7QH,comment-id=00020001,timestamp=2019-05-31T02:05:52.730+0000)

Mundo isn't a stat check, just dodge his Q

In fact he's perfectly designed

Morde is no where near Mundo levels. Mundo scales insanely well while building full HP and can regen to full through grievous wounds with his ult. Also His cleaver is short CD and if he lands it once, you're basically dead if you are overextended. If you dodge Morde's E(24 second cooldown at rank 1 btw, compared to mundo's 4 second at all ranks cleaver), he cant catch you unless you're playing unmounted Kled. Mundo has a skillshot, and is mostly a statcheck, yes, but context is important.

Sire Hippington1 votes

If you are a melee, morde doesn't need his E, he walks up to you and you either retreat and get zoned or he clubs you, simple as that.

Kelg1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sire Hippington,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=44UEK7QH,comment-id=0002000100010000,timestamp=2019-05-31T13:55:41.684+0000)

If you are a melee, morde doesn't need his E, he walks up to you and you either retreat and get zoned or he clubs you, simple as that.

That is literally every juggernaut. Should Morde be the only one who's harmless up close? He's not a tank, and you cant really have an ap juggernaut without them having a nashors-like passive. I swear, people will complain about anything and everything on this forum lmao.

The Ecdysiast5 votes

The problem with this guy's posts is that he simultaneously loves statchecky juggernauts and doesn't quite understand the thematics and mechanics behind them.

Case in point, notice how he makes the claim that Darius "plays around" his passive.. as if it doesn't work basically exactly like Mord's new passive. And he mistakenly includes Aatrox, who actually does have some amount of mechanical difficulty to his abilities, in the list of statcheck champs he likes.

I wanna stress, this isn't an insult to the guy himself. Just a response to his poorly supported argument(s).

Kelg2 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=44UEK7QH,comment-id=00020002,timestamp=2019-05-31T02:33:08.197+0000)

The problem with this guy's posts is that he simultaneously loves statchecky juggernauts and doesn't quite understand the thematics and mechanics behind them.

Case in point, notice how he makes the claim that Darius "plays around" his passive.. as if it doesn't work basically exactly like Mord's new passive. And he mistakenly includes Aatrox, who actually does have some amount of mechanical difficulty to his abilities, in the list of statcheck champs he likes.

I wanna stress, this isn't an insult to the guy himself. Just a response to his poorly supported argument(s).

If new Morde is a stat check then Darius "4 autos and w to kill you while building full tank" definitely is. All Juggernauts are balls of stats, but that doesn't necessarily make them stat checks, especially not Aatrox who you can outplay in many ways.

Now Trundle, he's a statcheck:

  • No potential to outplay him
  • Ult steals your stats while letting him 3 hit you with q
  • W literally just gives him stats while he's in it, and lets him stick
  • Pillar is on Trundle to missuse, though it's not an amazing ability

Compared to New Morde:

  • Q is missable
  • E is missable
  • His w and e cooldowns are long 15+ seconds at low levels and if he misses e he cant stick and loses a lot of kill potential
  • Passive requires 3 hits to activate, so you must hit q and e to proc quickly, considering his low attack speed
  • no way to stick without passive, and sticking isn't the best even with it
  • Morde's ult has statcheck (statstealing) elements(for some reason riot put it on cast and not just as the reward), so I'll give him that.

But otherwise, Morde is not a stat check, he is actually less of a statcheck than current Morde(and I main current Morde).

Moody P2 votes

Darius plays around passive and Q, a skillshot that can be dodged by moving directly towards it. Mord's isolation damage is mostly on coincidence rather than a mechanical flex. Darius also puts more work into getting his which makes it not guaranteed except against other juggernauts and immobile tanks.

The other juggernauts listed certainly aren't stat checks and weren't listed with that intention. They have an enjoyable payoff to their pattern that makes them feel good to play. That is the complaint. Mordekaiser is missing that feeling of payoff because the bulk of his damage is not doled out in an enjoyable way, is acquired too easily, and after the rework his skill ceiling is much lower.

Compared to old Mordekaiser who had a more complex W especially factoring in its ally uses and the management of his ghosts, I'm left wanting when I play the new one.

Sire Hippington1 votes

main damage comes by far from his passive, and the Q very reliable, the only skillcheck is landing the E to get in range and even that isn't the hardest skillshot to land.

Sir Saltarin1 votes

Cant have that R with also other nice things on his kit

Moody P3 votes

His R is stronger when combined with Mordekaisers highly reliable damage. It would be more reasonable if he were made to have to work a little harder for his payoffs

Sir Saltarin1 votes

That would be too complicated for juggernaut mains who rather unga unga me club you

Linna Excel1 votes

As a guy with a big mace, isn't "Imma club you" probably the proper gameplay for him?

Moody P6 votes

To this extent? I don't think so. Mordekaiser is very statbally at the moment with how much damage is tied to his auto attacks and his passive aura, neither of which can be avoided or outplayed by melees. Since Riot has made clear efforts to avoid this sort of thing, and Volibear is being reworked because of his unsatisfying gameplay and for his very statchecky play style (which is still more windowed than new Mord's) I think my complaint is valid.

Snowbrand1 votes

I do agree, I feel like there is something lacking that could ad a bit more depth and unique feeling to his play pattern.

XJ999999999999991 votes

Well, you can miss his Q as it has a bit of a wind up.

His passive AoE damage I believe only stays up with abilities/autos hit, not if you get hit (it says in combat). So you have to decide whether or not to walk with the target the whole time, or auto inbetween/Q. E'ing when they try to run away and then Qing.

Moody P1 votes

I solve this by taking Rylais with Approach Velocity. It's basically guaranteed that you'll stick to somebody unless you're chain CC'd with these two together, and if strong slows are a risk then you can easily opt into Phase Rush too.

XJ999999999999991 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=44UEK7QH,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-05-31T08:48:46.633+0000)

I solve this by taking Rylais with Approach Velocity. It's basically guaranteed that you'll stick to somebody unless you're chain CC'd with these two together, and if strong slows are a risk then you can easily opt into Phase Rush too.

approach velocity is just such a strong rune in general tbh

Sire Hippington1 votes

Its not that he's almost Garen levels of simple, but I just don't really feel satisfied by the gameplay pattern

I find Garen less primitive, he atleast has to choose between gapcloseing with Q, getting it for the AA-reset or despelling a slow, his E has some nuace to it with the increased isolated damage, and the timeing on his W makes or breaks close fights for him. New morde is litterally a walking sunfire + his new E(which i actually like alot). He has just so stupidly much power in his passive(up to 34+6%hp per sec, thats more than twice the damage of amumus W) and to some extend in his ult and free %pen and the rest of his kit is pretty shallow to compensate. His Q needs more work to add a bit more skillexpression and reward, and the passive could loose some power to allow for that. I also really miss the option to go AD, i miss the AA/reset and trinity synergie, and his new W does not really give that much stained damage to be anywhere near the old passive, it's nice for trades in lane, it helps a bit vs burst in teamfigths, but in no way does it give the same"..not dead yet" vibe that he always had.

Also, Tankyness in this game still feels shit and their answer to that is a handing out %pen and hgih %damage in the same kit...classic

Pika Fox1 votes

? Whats wrong with "unga me club u" champions? Sometimes you just wanna play a big, beefy beat stick and kill one person in particular.

Moody P1 votes

Nothing. My complaint is that Mordekaiser is lacking the same satisfaction as other juggernauts when it comes to how he fights. Even Trundle feels more inpactful when he's just bonking someone over and over.

Mord feels like he's missing something that would make him enjoyable and its been bothering me since I started playing him on PBE.

Pika Fox1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=44UEK7QH,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2019-05-31T16:28:20.582+0000)

Nothing. My complaint is that Mordekaiser is lacking the same satisfaction as other juggernauts when it comes to how he fights. Even Trundle feels more inpactful when he's just bonking someone over and over.

Mord feels like he's missing something that would make him enjoyable and its been bothering me since I started playing him on PBE.

The only thing hes missing is a 5 second invulnerability cutscene windup animation on his ult that makes both him and his target completely immune while showing off the entry into the shadow realm with yugioh cards flying around in the background.

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