Feels good to have your main "sejuani'd" doesn't it?

Wukong Airlines·Dec 23, 2017·25 votes·1,658 views

Why nobody bothered to make threads about her when she was stuck at 55%+ win ratio? or is it only when your champ gets trashed you start complaining? The same people who are complaining about sona being "weak" atm are the ones who deny you from the right to express your opinion about your "weak main" when you try to make a constructive thread about him/her/it.

Sona is "fine", being played at 4% p.r and having 49% w.r is fine, you just got used to gaining more freelo when Riot ignored the fact that she was broken. but now that she's fixed you're upset she's not the same. [slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

77 Comments

Sona PingDec 23, 20179 votes

Why nobody bothered to make threads about her when she was stuck at 55%+ win ratio?

I see this is your first day on these forums, having never been here before.

Wukong AirlinesDec 23, 20174 votes

I've been here long enough to see a lot of people become "mains" based on a champ's win ratio and gamebreaking kit.

MimikÿuDec 23, 20178 votes

[{quoted}](name=Cloud Walker,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3yMEZEAM,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2017-12-23T11:59:08.481+0000)

I've been here long enough to see a lot of people become "mains" based on a champ's win ratio and gamebreaking kit.

.... Apparently not if you think they are upset over her winrate.. but okay [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Wukong AirlinesDec 23, 20171 votes

I just made this post as a response to all the butthurt sona "mains" who are QQing about her being weak atm, when she's not, I couldnt careless about her w.r, it just statistics that proves im right.

DarkeusDec 23, 20176 votes

Except stats prove you wrong Lol...

[zombie-brand-facepalm]

nice tableDec 23, 20171 votes

if 49,5% win ratio was "weak" we have a shitload of weak champions with sona being nowhere near the top of the list : ^)

RedCycloneDec 23, 20174 votes

Stats only tell half the story (and Sona's stats are still very bad for a simple to pick up champion)

How about how it actually feels to play Sona now? The ENTIRE laning phase you are useless, you can't trade anymore because it costs you 80% of your mana if you do get traded, once you run out of mana (what is about 6 spell casts) you and your ADC are fucked, do yourself a favor and play Sona because obviously you don't, much like every idiot who claims Sona is still good now, enjoy getting your shit pushed in

hoyohaiDec 23, 20171 votes

...When does she come up on Free Champion Rotation? I wanna try

DarkeusDec 28, 20171 votes

Good luck. You will get your ass stomped in. But please let me know when you do. I want to look at your OP.GG and say, "Told you so."

hoyohaiDec 28, 20171 votes

Well now everyone else is picking Sona so I can't.

And of course I will lose badly. I absolutely cannot support

nice tableDec 24, 20171 votes

bitch please, i'm a volibear main with him rocking a 41% win ratio at the elo i play on so everything feels pretty fucking good in comparison including sona. sona isn't "good" but she's not bad either, well at least from my point of view.

RedCycloneDec 24, 20172 votes

Okay? Yes we all know there are champs in shitter spots, but Sona just got hard nerfed with literally 0 context and reason and now feels like crap to play and is leaking viability every day

It's not as if they can't just reverse the mana nerfs and Sona will be on a decent-but-not-op trend again

Fuck man, just cus someone who mains a champion who just became shitty after they got nerfed is voicing their dismay about the situation does not mean we don't think any other champion is in a worse spot then her, we are unfamilar to champions like Voli ect. and expressing our opinions on them would be a waste of time because we would have no idea what we are talking about

nice tableDec 24, 20171 votes

you said sona feels shitty to play i said she feels fine then you told me to try it and she still feels fine. right now shes in line with most "simple champions" she's not good but she's not bad either, there are better picks but shes balanced.

RedCycloneDec 24, 20173 votes

Based on what exactly? You figured out how to make mana costs that take 1/4th of your mana bar work for you? your enemy didn't even bother retaliating to you? your jungler camped your lane ect Just because a champion is shitty doesnt mean they can't have good games

Also putting a champion in a place of "they are only good in low elo but a waste of time in higher elos" is a really shit position and we should be figuring out how to get champs like Garen out of it and not put more champs in it

I don't think you would appreciate it if Warwick was condemned to this purgatory

nice tableDec 24, 20171 votes

eh warwick was already condemned to this purgatory and that's why i had to stop playing him back in the day. i'm sure sona will be quite alright once people realize you are supposed to run klepto + trans + manaband with cookies now. sona is a squishy poke mageish support and shes supposed to die to shit like leona / ali which is unfortunate for her right now as tank support are meta.

honestly a lot of shitty things happened to sona at once and people haven't been able to adapt to it yet while the meta also doesn't favor her but i don't think she needs direct buffs just yet.

RedCycloneDec 24, 20172 votes

It still comes up to the fact that now it takes Sona way too long to scale, you need 30 minutes minimum to start being as effective as any other support, it's too much downtime for not enough uptime No other champion in this game needs 30 minutes minimum to scale, and if they did it certainly should not be a goddamn support

DarkeusDec 28, 20171 votes

Eh, don't waste time with them. Another one without a clue.

DarkeusDec 28, 20171 votes

I can smell that bias a mile away. And I can also smell your TOTAL lack of knowledge about Sona too.

No use to continue talking to this one.

hoyohaiDec 28, 20171 votes

I can smell your bias as well. From 10000 metres away.

Everyone has biases

DarkeusDec 29, 20171 votes

I can smell I don't play Ranked. Placed and that was about it. Too toxic. People like you lol.

DarkeusDec 29, 20171 votes

Yes, but I actually have knowledge of what I am talking about. Sona. ;-)

DarkeusDec 28, 20171 votes

They are weak. Lol. So you know. Nice try.

Daedric EtwahlDec 23, 20176 votes

When Sona was at 55%+ winrate us Sona mains knew nerfs were incoming and were fine with it. Same with the Aery nerf after the hotpatch.

However, they then put up the huge Q nerfs before the Aery nerfs even went live, let alone before they could assess Sona's performance with them, which is where any reasonable Sona player started speaking up. We knew the nerfs would be too much, and not only that but Klepto and Scorch, and Manaflow all got nerfed, all of which Sona very often uses. All of these add up to create a miserable, miserable first 25 minutes of the game where it all feels completely out of your hands. This isn't something you can see just by looking at an overall winrate.

Riot even came very close to nerfing tge entire Forbidden Idol line, despite enchanters not even being out of line. They even admitted they likely were too hard on the Sona nerfs.

PennsDec 23, 201710 votes

I remember Sona mains saying "why is Sona getting nerfed again, she already dropped to 54% win rate?" lel

Daedric EtwahlDec 23, 20173 votes

Any REASONABLE Sona main would understand that having dropped to 54%, they should hold on just a second, and assess how the Aery nerfs, along with the indirect nerfs like Manaflow and less AP for taking Sorcery, would roll with Sona. Instead they were trigger happy on the nerfs and now we're stuck here with an overmerfed Sona with a first 25 minutes that are a damned chore to get through just to be allowed to do anything

PennsDec 23, 20172 votes

Well thats what a late game champ should do, have a low win rate in games that get surrendered at minute 15/20-25.

I mean she isnt one of the best supports anymore, but this already happened once recently. She got nerfed and every Sona main complained because she had a 46% win rate or something. Just that that win rate was for the next day when it was still around 7 pm in EUW. And her win rate went up to like 54% again lel

RedCycloneDec 23, 20174 votes

You don't think we get that, the point is Sona's early game is too weak for how slow it scales now You can't do anything but hope the flow of the game lets you get past 30 minutes before you actually get to do impactful things

Think of all the other hypercarries in the game, how many of them take THIRTY MINUTES to be self sufficient, most only need just 1 item to become a threat, it's too much weak earlygame for not enough payoff

hoyohaiDec 28, 20171 votes

Does she actually take 30 min? What items does she need to have?

RedCycloneDec 29, 20171 votes

Depends on what playstyle, but ultimately you need to hit level 11 before you start seeing improvements

She needs a tear rushed ASAP to address the issues of mana costs, you also need to rush your sightstone, so that's already 1.55k dedicated to items you need over other items

Daedric EtwahlJan 14, 20181 votes

Late reply, but Sona needs to rush Tear, otherwise her mana costs will neuter her. As a support she's expected to run Sightstone as well, but sometimes you can get away with delaying it.

Her two core full items are often considered to be item 3504 item 3174 , I don't think there's a particular order. One of these you start seeing some improvement, both of them you're just about good to go. This usually takes me around 25-30 minutes to achieve unless I randomly get fed or something.

However, you also need levels, specifically ult ranks, to properly reach your potential. Level 11 is usually considered to be when Sona really starts to come online, and she never really falls off from there.

Wukong AirlinesDec 23, 20172 votes

So youre saying it was "ok" she had that win ratio for a VERY long time, but when they try to kick her out of meta that's not ok?

what about my Talon who dropped from top 5 in top and mid to "ranked 23rd on mid" and "32 on toplane" ? ALL OF THAT HAPPEN IN PRESEASON PATCH. + MonkeyKing hasnt been touched at all in 4 years, so you people be fkin grateful you had the chance to be in meta.

RedCycloneDec 23, 20171 votes

You don't seem to understand that Sona's winrate was inflated due to her being a simple champion to just pick up and play for anyone, She has a kit that even first timers can latch onto and not fuck up, its why we see her having like 54% at bronze and 51% at diamond

GayFluffyUnicornDec 23, 20171 votes

Except her winrate was even higher in diamond. Same as janna. And a LOT of these "easy champs" only good at low elo.

D357R0Y3RDec 23, 20173 votes

no it was not

Sona had like 57% win rate in low elo and around 53/54% win rate in diamond+ on pre-season release before her last nerf she had 51/52% win rate in diamond+ and 54% win rate in low elo

hoyohaiDec 23, 20171 votes

51%?!

RedCycloneDec 23, 20171 votes

Okay, like 52% during the Ardent meta

Just understand that a easy champion that can still be played in higher elo games is ALWAYS going to have a inflated winrate due to her ease of play

hoyohaiDec 23, 20171 votes

52%?!

RedCycloneDec 23, 20171 votes

I'm sure since your an expert on the exact winrate of Sona in diamond in the last year you can quote what you think her winrate was

hoyohaiDec 23, 20171 votes

Oh. Sorry for not giving context. I was just surprised at how high the winrate was for a supposedly low skill floor and ceiling champion. I have no idea what the winrate was

RedCycloneDec 23, 20171 votes

You act as if Sona has had no counters for all this time

She always has and always will be weak to all in, I have endured some tortuous games as Sona because she can be effortlessly dived when behind Not only that but basically anyone can outtrade her, it's all about not letting her get ontop of you during lane, so many people just take poke from her and don't retaliate

hoyohaiDec 23, 20171 votes

Well I've never seen her in a game

I'm just surprised since she's apparently a low skill ceiling champion

RedCycloneDec 23, 20171 votes

Her skill ceiling relies on what playstyle you prefer on her

You can do the full healer passive playstyle that is very safe but doesn't have a good ceiling Or the AP aggressive playstyle that is not safe at all but rewards riskier play, it has a much higher ceiling

hoyohaiDec 23, 20171 votes

O. ...When is she free?

RedCycloneDec 23, 20171 votes

When is any champion free? I don't know when she is going to be free

hoyohaiDec 23, 20171 votes

Fair enough. I guess I'll have to wait.

On a completely unrelated note, who do you think has the highest skill cap?

RedCycloneDec 23, 20171 votes

There are a few champs I would debate have pretty high skill caps, Lee Sin, Zed, Azir, Riven

Basically any champ that has a lot of mechanical tools to learn and figure out

hoyohaiDec 28, 20171 votes

Really? Only mechanical tools? Good to know

GayFluffyUnicornDec 23, 20171 votes

"sona mains were fine with it". Literally every second post on reddit and boards: DONT NERF SONA ITS SO UNFAIR JANNA WAS MUCH BETTER FOR LONGER WHY DO YOU NERF 60% WIRNATE SONA NOT FAIR RITO PLZ DO NOT NURF. And yes, these posts came when the first nerf was announced were every sane person was like "eh this not gonna do much".

Daedric EtwahlDec 23, 20172 votes

Except we were fine with the nerfs themselves

What WAS annoying though, was how other outliers like Leona, Ezreal, and Miss Fortune were getting off scot free. Fuck, it's been two and a half patches and all three of them are STILL terrorizing the botlane, because Riot "wanted to be careful" when balancing them.

The bias from the balance team is clear as crystal, as they had ZERO such reservations about that asinine Q nerf and dumpstering her while giving everyone else a slap on the wrist at best.