Make Rammus' W a toggle or remove/lower the self slow

JavelinJoe·Jun 6, 2017·65 votes·2,944 views

60% self slow is bullshit when after you still have a 6 s or so CD. The slow is just enough to make sure you cant even chase even a dismounted Kled.

So could the slow be removed, lowered at least, or the ability become a toggle, where switching on/off puts it either on no CD, or maybe a 1 second one so spamming it isn't a thing. If it is a toggle, then the slow is fine, but having both slow and a CD makes the ability pretty worthless for anything other than jungling since players are just not that dumb to willingly attack you with it up.

74 Comments

MysterQJun 6, 201735 votes

Don't you know?

The most mobile champions deserve the most movespeed. LeeSin You don't even deserve to move, you immobile brick. Rammus

Ok. D:

JavelinJoeJun 6, 20179 votes

But the BLIND champion can be the most positioning oriented, and most ward using Jungler in the game?

Lordk0zJun 6, 201712 votes

Well.........He's blind. Of course he'd use sight aids.

LeetriJun 6, 20178 votes

I mean, it makes sense logically. Things that are mobile and fast tend to move fast, and things that are big and heavy move slowly.

JavelinJoeJun 7, 20172 votes

But how does one change mass without adding or removing anything? All he does is "curl up" He does not hold on to an anvil or some other heavy shit, yet he can move perfectly fast by pressing Q. And if the defense is weighing him down, then all Armor and MR should lower movement speed because of its "weight".

RevaliJun 6, 20177 votes

"We'll give you your toggle, but we'll make it drain his mana while it's up"

korg023Jun 6, 20173 votes

nice idea.

SauceyapplesJun 6, 20172 votes

I think that was sarcastic...

korg023Jun 7, 20173 votes

still nice idea.

ChønklordJun 7, 20172 votes

"We'll remove the slow, but his E taunt is now a dash skillshot like Shen's, and only lasts 0.5s at all ranks"

AseeyaJun 6, 20175 votes

Remove the movespeed on Rammus? Are you insane? Have you seen the straight up ridiculous damage he deals?

mosdeadlyJun 6, 20176 votes

He dealt 80% of the damage he used to before the rework.

RenascentJun 7, 20172 votes

Wait, what? Where are you getting that statistic from?

mosdeadlyJun 7, 20172 votes

From my games. Mastery 7 rammus with a high winrate on top. Used to get about 35k damage per game. Now getting 40k damage per game. Really not much of a differnce except i lose harder with the new one.

coley bearJun 6, 20173 votes

I think it'd be cool if they made the w a part of the taunt and just gave him a new ability. Slow isn't too bad if you get to taunt an enemy and attack speed makes no sense as the thing that makes his taunt special. But I agree as his 60% slow is too much and makes him so vulnerable to kiting

Skins ProjectJun 6, 20171 votes

It kinda is tho...

Your taunt resets/reapplies while other abilities are up. I.E. while your W is up your taunt remains up.

KaìjuJun 6, 20171 votes

False, the attack speed slow is up while other spells are up, the taunt is still on a timer. A six second taunt would be broken, six seconds of hard CC on a normal spell, that's some Dota shit.

philosiferJun 6, 20172 votes

Gbay?

Skins ProjectJun 6, 20172 votes

I'm quite sure does reset. I'll check in a moment. The taunt "Ends" but the icon that indicates there is still a taunt, along with the taunt continues for W, I'm quite sure it lasts throughout, works thru ult 2 I think? I'll check.

*Edit

I checked, you were sorta right.... SOoooo other abilities refresh the attack speed boost that comes with the taunt, not the taunt itself.

coley bearJun 6, 20172 votes

I was thinking his w would work like his attack speed buff does now, maybe it slows only for the duration of the taunt then lasts a little while longer. It wouldn't make sense to have his spell reproc it though because his q at least shouldn't be able to be up at the same time as his taunt. And this would let him have a more fun kit because it is nearly always that you put up the shell at the same time you taunt anyways

VerarticusJun 6, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Skins Project,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3KxOmm6s,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-06-06T04:56:54.407+0000)

It kinda is tho...

Your taunt resets/reapplies while other abilities are up. I.E. while your W is up your taunt remains up.

No, the shitty ATTACK SPEED buff reapplies.

VerarticusJun 6, 20172 votes

This entire kit update on Rammus is so damn bad. He needed a new passive that was relevant, so they give him the exact same passive but magic damage and weaker really. His Q could use a little QoL changes but was fine otherwise, they gave him that then fuck it up by making it channeled. "What if we take his W, the main skill that he relies on and that makes him even remotely viable, and remove the durability from it and base it's damage ENTIRELY on his new passive that we also nerfed. And then break his legs as well." His ulti got a stacking slow, to bad he has 0 chance of staying near a target long enough for it to matter.

RobertsmashJun 6, 20172 votes

AS is always great for jungling really, if you use E > W (kill camp) > Q to next camp > W, you only have to press E once per route, and a constant AS buff feels awesome. Even though I'm not a fan of the W self slow AT ALL and think the rework is mostly bad, I think the AS on E is neat.

PapaGreg21Jun 7, 20173 votes

Rammus now has the best feeling ability in the game as well as the worst feeling ability in the game.

ChaosThiefJun 6, 20172 votes

Pro tip: run stormraider's surge with rammus.

No but seriously, without a stormraider's proc he does feel like a literal turtle. Not a tortoise that's built for land, a turtle that has to drag itself across the sand slowly just to lay eggs and then drag itself back to sea. It would be nice for some improvement.

JavelinJoeJun 6, 20172 votes

How does one proc Stormraider's Surge as Rammus though? You would need to be able to reach and attack an enemy to do it.

statelesskillerJun 6, 20171 votes

mosdeadlyJun 6, 20172 votes

Too bad getting hit by anything removes his q. Bad disign period.

statelesskillerJun 6, 20172 votes

i mean . . . its pretty easy to dodge things as rammus, and the hit box for his Q is . . . consistent

mosdeadlyJun 7, 20172 votes

Well the problem is that its only easy to dodge things as rammus on the last few seconds of his q. If you do decide to dodge however you end up wasting your q duration. Lose lose situation.

Raid Boss MordeJun 7, 20172 votes

Getting hit by what? Hard CC? Well yeah, that's how a channel works.

mosdeadlyJun 7, 20172 votes

Well even non hard cc like vayne knockback and draven knockback removes q.

When i say "anything" i mean almost every champion since the only targets youre going to focus (the adcs) always have some form of cc and the movespeed isnt competent enough to counteract this.

Junglerz FaultJun 7, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Pro tip: run stormraider's surge with rammus.

No but seriously, without a stormraider's proc he does feel like a literal turtle. Not a tortoise that's built for land, a turtle that has to drag itself across the sand slowly just to lay eggs and then drag itself back to sea. It would be nice for some improvement.

Dude not to be a naysayer but I just looked up your match history and you only have one rammus game played but the mastery you used was grasp of the undying and you went 1/7/3 with a loss. Not to say you don't have another account that you play on but, I was hoping to gain some more guidance on your "pro tip: stormraider's surge" rammus build.

ChaosThiefJun 8, 20171 votes

I didn't run stormraider's surge on that game and regretted it. Plus I kept getting ganked by a volibear (the laner was GP, couldn't fight both.)

Unless you're going fully dedicated tank or can land your ult a few times before using W, you really do need stormraiders from my experience.

Junglerz FaultJun 9, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I didn't run stormraider's surge on that game and regretted it. Plus I kept getting ganked by a volibear (the laner was GP, couldn't fight both.)

Unless you're going fully dedicated tank or can land your ult a few times before using W, you really do need stormraiders from my experience.

Care to post a guide about this stormraider's build? I'd like to see your setup, runes, masteries, item build order, yeah :)

ChaosThiefJun 9, 20171 votes

Well I mean, I don't really play ranked nor do I aim for the highest of a stat, I kind of just play as I go. The only time I actually did run the stormraiders rammus top was against a tryndamere, and the results for that kind of thing should be kind of obvious.

I'm not gonna lie, you would probably do a better job with those things than I would. I still only run 2 runepages with AP/AD as a standard.

CaveslothJun 7, 20172 votes

Ya gotta love how riot likes to dick over new players. It seems like they are systematically taking all the easier to learn champs and changing them to be much more difficult to learn and play.

JavelinJoeJun 7, 20172 votes

Akali Leblanc Katarina Rammus Warwick

If that is the case I cant wait for Veigar Zed Yasuo and Lucian

CaveslothJun 7, 20172 votes

Zed Yas and Luc aren't really simple champs. Veigar is fairly simple to learn, but hard to master. Other than his ults, hes all skillshots. I'm talking, Xin, Voli, Wu, champs that are really easy to learn and play, very few skillshots, and very simple mechanics.

JavelinJoeJun 7, 20172 votes

Ah, like Garen

squidoJun 7, 20172 votes

Yep. Rammus is practically useless while in DBC, because his 200 movespeed. Sure, he is tanky as hell in it, but useless and the enemy can just walk away from you, if you cancel DBC then you do no damage, so its a lose-lose situation. ALSO if you taunt in it, which lasts about 1-2 seconds, you never do enough to finish them off, and you cant even chase after them .

VerarticusJun 7, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Yep. Rammus is practically useless while in DBC, because his 200 movespeed. Sure, he is tanky as hell in it, but useless and the enemy can just walk away from you, if you cancel DBC then you do no damage, so its a lose-lose situation

You're not even tanky in it anymore. not unless you're full build, and even then you're less tanky overall since you don't get much free MR anymore so you have to build some which lowers your armor you can get.

Junglerz FaultJun 7, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Yep. Rammus is practically useless while in DBC, because his 200 movespeed. Sure, he is tanky as hell in it, but useless and the enemy can just walk away from you, if you cancel DBC then you do no damage, so its a lose-lose situation. ALSO if you taunt in it, which lasts about 1-2 seconds, you never do enough to finish them off, and you cant even chase after them .

Yeah but Riot doesn't care. They want to get rid of tanks. They honestly couldn't care.

One Ashe OnJun 11, 20172 votes

[Start to sing in my head : Hello Darkness my old friends...].. Rammus need compensation for his W ..

Raid Boss MordeJun 6, 20171 votes

HIs winrate went up with the changes, from about 48% to 52%. No reason to buff him even more, especially when the slow is supposed to be a drawback.

KitSun9Jun 7, 20172 votes

Thankyou! Does no one really see that his new 235% movespeed Q is enough compensation for this, I mean... Would you rather have less of a self slow and a slower Q or for it to stay this way... Even if you go by 150% movespeed base thats still pretty darn fast when most laners don't even have boots yet... Rammus ,I mean Sonic says- hi

JavelinJoeJun 7, 20172 votes

What was wrong with pre-rework?

Junglerz FaultJun 7, 20171 votes

{quoted}

What was wrong with pre-rework?

^ Couldn't have said it better myself.

KitSun9Jun 11, 20171 votes

Nothing really the only frustrating thing for me was when I cc'd him and he still was in powerball when he got out...

VerarticusJun 7, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Thankyou! Does no one really see that his new 235% movespeed Q is enough compensation for this, I mean... Would you rather have less of a self slow and a slower Q or for it to stay this way... Even if you go by 150% movespeed base thats still pretty darn fast when most laners don't even have boots yet... ,I mean Sonic says- hi

It was better the old way frankly. Your Q is now interruptible, and the LATE GAME speedbuff doesn't compensate the most self-harming ability in the game that was ALSO gutted in durability and damage at the same time.

And taking all balanced conversation aside, IT FEELS LIKE SHIT. Half the fun with Rammus was just being a fast lockdown champion zooming around the map, and now you're constantly going from high speed to slowest champ in the game jarringly all the time.