fiora's really really healthy

ScarnMichaelScar··131 votes·7,074 views

you might as well never pick a melee into her unless it's her equally unhealthy counterpart Darius

all she has to do is freeze lane, wait for you to walk up to farm and then just hit vitals. it's a really stupid minigame that punishes her opponents for even trying to walk in her range

i mean, % health true damage? that scales with ad? what the hell is the matter with you riot?

free crits, damage negation, and slows? OH AND A HEAL? YEAH AWESOME

yeah just build 2 damage items then go full tank. then abuse the shit out of your low mana cost low cd dash and aoe heal murder ult

185 Comments

GlockHammer86 votes

I love how some Fiora mains will say: BUT HURP DI DHURPALAHBAR JUST WALK AWAY IF VITAL EXPOSES DURRSELF, ok, so give Fiora another 15 seconds of free farming while she zones me away from my cs simply by existing. Sounds really healthy. [zombie-brand-facepalm]

HeartPalpitation1 votes

lol i laughed harder than i should have at this

GlockHammer2 votes

{quoted}

lol i laughed harder than i should have at this

Yeah, me too. I'm think I'm a pro at entertaining myself. [zombie-nunu-bummed]

Boulderox2 votes

sounds just like a Gangplank barrel.... Powerpicks is what the game revolves around, either play it or ban it, which is just plain stupid...

Celeste Benal7 votes

You know, this reminds me of Blitzcrank counterplay suggestions.

"DERP get hooked! Dodge! Build MR. Get better nub."

Skelenth28 votes

At least you can hide behind minions against Blitzgrab

MrryZ3 votes

That's basically what a blitz wants; to zone you away by threat of his hooks.

Skelenth2 votes

Yes, but all Bltz does after that is cc, unless he builds ap the damage is negligible. Fiora just keeps doing the same damage over and over again you were trying to evade

Aazzlano7 votes

wat? Blitz Q-R combo at 6 alone does more damage than Annie's R-W-Q. And with his E he does way more.

UmmTastedPurple12 votes

Blitz Q-R : (190 + 1AP) + (250 + 1Ap) totalling 440 + 2*AP.

Annie R-W-Q : (150 + 0.8AP) + (70 + 0.8 * AP) + (175 + 0.8 AP) totalling 395 + 2.4AP

So Annie's base damage is 45 lower.

This page shows that the most common runes for Annie include +15 ap from quints as well as 7.83 Mpen. These are the exact same for Blitzcrank, so we'll compare with the same rune set.

There's a difference on items though, as Annie's most common starter is spellthief (adding 5 ap and 30 true damage for three procs) contrasting with Blitz's targon.

Let's calculate damage before reduction :

Blitz : 440 + 2*15 = 470 Magic damage Annie : 395 + 2.4 * (15+5) = 443 Magic damage.

Once you add 3*10=30 True damage from spellthief, Annie's Q-W-R burst is greater than blitzcrank's Q-R. This somewhat debunks your claim that "Blitz Q-R combo at 6 alone does more damage than Annie's R-W-Q". By something like 15 damage after reduction at most, sure, but facts are fact.

You might want to dispute my claim all THREE spellthief procs are used. I do so because the calculations do not include poke but burst. If we don't include poke, than we suppose no poke was done and we supposed the procs are available for use.

You might dispute the fact I used an item advantage on Annie to justify more damage dealt, and you are right Blitzcrank's base damages are higher, yet LoL isn't played without items, so it's normal to calculate with items bought at that stage of the game (supposing no backs before 6).

Finally, you might say that adding E definitely tips the balance in Blitzcranks favour, but that's where Blitzcrank's damage actually starts to falloff compared to Annie, as he is truly a burst caster while she has sustained dps in Tibber's AoE + auto.

Doing the calculations quickly, one level 6 Blitz E does 75*2 = 150 Physical damage.

We'll suppose Annie gets to do One auto, Tibbers does one Auto, and his fire procs only once. That's 61 Physical damage + (20 + 0.2*AP) + 80. Adding brutly before resistances, she's doing 161 mixed damage before AP ratio. Of course calculating resistances favours her because there's less magic resist at those levels and both champions are using Mpen runes.

To conclude my post. You're right Blitz has higher base damage, but he does not do more damage at level 6 than Annie, especially less when you add E.

I'll add though that Blitzcrank's support winrate is at 52.63% (bordering on OP) averaged on Plat+ games. If your statement means that you find Blitzcrank stronger than Annie support, you are right. I myself don't play botlane and have no opinion on the matter, I simply enjoy basic calculations and providing facts. Enjoy the rest of the conversation.

KomePrePongo17 votes

You must be fun at parties

UnderscorBunnies2 votes

I mean, to reset a vital it will take at most 5 seconds right? So yes, you are giving her 5 seconds to do w/e in lane, but that's the trade you make for getting the vital to reset. It's like laning against anyone with consistent harass (Like pantheon).

Fiora is a duelist, she excels at dueling other champions. Her weaknesses being that she doesn't do AoE damage, and has to get really close to her enemies and have space to be able to out-duel them. If she gets behind and CAN'T out-duel her enemies, she's kinda fucked. Much like Jax, Yi, Xin, etc.

Verdade6 votes

Okay, so here are some facts: Reseting a Vital doesn't take 15 seconds, it takes merely few seconds walking into brush/away from her

Frozen lane means there are more friendly than enemy minions. Most of them will be casters. If you stand in your minions while she Qs you, she will draw minion aggro (YES, her Q counts as basic attack for purposes of getting minion aggro) and she will take more damage from minions alone than she actually healed from hitting a vital. Also drawing minion aggro means she has to retreat, possibly drawing minions into turret and messing up her freeze.

QSS will completely screw her chances in late game duels, especially if you play tanky champion. She has nowhere near enough damage to kill you or severely damage you without her R, OR very prolonged fight.

Cowgirl Ed41 votes

why is he getting downvoted? Fiora needs huge nerfs and a sane dose of gutting

she has free stats everywhere, movespeed, heals, crits, health true damage in percentage, retarded cooldowns, might as well be manaless, no need to go dmg items, can't duel her, a heal stronger than janna's ult, and the list goes on

"bbut muh vitals mechanics"

Anraton10 votes

Because you CAN counterplay her - if done correctly

Cowgirl Ed8 votes

{quoted}

Because you CAN counterplay her - if done correctly

nah depends on the champion you play. also even if the fiora's player is a monkey he will always come back and build tanky with 2 damage items. the movement speed from the ult is plain pathetic. a "lategame champ" shouldnt be able to bully you out of lane. same thing for yasuo. they scale strong, and in lane they are good champs as well. not a good thing

also shes just retarded stop denying the truth i dont follow the competitive nerds but if im not wrong she has like the highest winrate or something

WadeWilson133716 votes

Was with you until you put Yasuo and Fiora in the same tier..

Captain Aishi2 votes

yasuo is actually equally problematic as fiora, and the reason he got gutted with nerfs so that he's barely playable right now... his scaling is so hard and he has so little counterplay (yasuo does what he does and most champs just have to take it, it's on him to mess up and there's very little his opponent can do about it)

with a kit like these, either the numbers are enough for the champ to work so it always works or they are too low to work so it never works, fiora is currently in the 'numbers are high enough' and yasuo is in the 'numbers are too low'

Dairdrek3 votes

There's a lot you can do to a yasuo. I just play kassadin against him, or veigar. Once you land the stun he's done

The Yetii Rider4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Kiss Kiss Kiss,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2uAXrhEA,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2016-03-07T10:13:12.452+0000)

why is he getting downvoted? Fiora needs huge nerfs and a sane dose of gutting

she has free stats everywhere, movespeed, heals, crits, health true damage in percentage, retarded cooldowns, might as well be manaless, no need to go dmg items, can't duel her, a heal stronger than janna's ult, and the list goes on

"bbut muh vitals mechanics"

Fiora needs all of these things to be viable. If she can't be a threat to everyone on the enemy team while building tanky, she is either useless or she gets blown up instantly.

The melee carry is a very supported idea in fantasy, but in this game range has such a huge advantage that melee needs some kind of insane power to fight them properly.

Skelenth3 votes

Which are normaly Gapclosers, but Fiora now can shred tanks just as easy as adc's just because of that stupid %hp true damage and ridiculous sticking power

The Yetii Rider3 votes

{quoted}

Which are normaly Gapclosers, but Fiora now can shred tanks just as easy as adc's just because of that stupid %hp true damage and ridiculous sticking power

Gap closers aren't enough. Tryndamere has a gap closer and invulnerability and he's almost never picked. Master Yi only finds so much success because he can be built tanky. Indeed, I played Master Yi jungle the other day building full assassin with 300 AD and 60% crit and my friends were yelling at me because I "didn't do enough damage".

You need to survive long enough to kill enemies, and that means doing damage while tanky and ignoring CC. That's why Yi, Fiora and GP all work while Tryn and Jayce don't.

Eternal Zen2 votes

While I do think Fiora and Yi amoungst others are stupid and understand the others complaints, you are actually correct. I play a lot of Master Yi and I was super stubborn about playing him traditional assassin crit dmg attack speed build. It just doesn't work anymore. Even many adcs now can 1v1 a glass cannon Yi, it's simply not viable. In team fights he's non-existent in this build. Honestly, tank yi is the only viable yi and if you make it nonviable for him he will disappear from play completely. While I only play a bit of Fiora here and there I imagine the same is true for her.

Crett35 votes

Three slows, a really low cooldown dash that procs nearby vitals, and a refreshing MS boost The only way her passive can be called a minigame is if you're just as mobile as she is.

Yasuo vs Fiora is kinda fun to watch. Sion vs Fiora is just sad

MLDzXnRRR6 votes

{quoted}

Three slows, a really low cooldown dash that procs nearby vitals, and a refreshing MS boost The only way her passive can be called a minigame is if you're just as mobile as she is.

Yasuo vs Fiora is kinda fun to watch. Sion vs Fiora is just sad

I played yesterday FIora vs Sion. He is way more useful than Fiora later in the game - can initiate, tank, CC. Fiora can only split and gets bursted in teamfighs even with tanky items.

GlockHammer16 votes

{quoted}

I played yesterday FIora vs Sion. He is way more useful than Fiora later in the game - can initiate, tank, CC. Fiora can only split and gets bursted in teamfighs even with tanky items.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Sahn Uzal6 votes

I decided to share my opinion with a silent downvote... This works too I guess summoner 31

Catastrop22 votes

{quoted}

bursted in teamfighs

"Yeah let's focus burst the tanky as hell Fiora while the rest of the team rapes us all."

GlockHammer17 votes

{quoted}

"Yeah let's focus burst the tanky as hell Fiora while the rest of the team rapes us all."

Yeah, let's do it boys, CHARGE! OMG! The Riposteh! The CC! All gone! It's all lost boyz. The zergs have taken Mar Sara.

Biffolo2 votes

I mean, to be fair. If you all use your cc at the same time on her, you dun fucked up.

ZGM Dazzling1 votes

Dude you dont understand how initiating work in solo que. And she can dodge 1/2 cc's and your fight is over.

Biffolo1 votes

I understand that stacking cc is bad, in soloq or not. If people fuck it up, that's on them.

Only Play Darius19 votes

Damn right she's really really healthy

You don't get a body like that eating fast food and watching TV all day

Dairdrek5 votes

Way to lighten up the thread^

Sahn Uzal13 votes

Seriously... Darius is not perfect... but not nearly as bad as Fiora... summoner 31

GlockHammer13 votes

[{quoted}](name=SwHc Fenris,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2uAXrhEA,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-03-07T12:10:49.803+0000)

Seriously... Darius is not perfect... but not nearly as bad as Fiora... summoner 31

Darius is an epitome of balance compared to canc... cough Fiora.

Meep Man6 votes

Darius isn't even bad. He's just really good early game and has true damage, something people seem to hate... but I don't like Fiora either.

GlockHammer11 votes

[{quoted}](name=Inept Maverick,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2uAXrhEA,comment-id=000600000000,timestamp=2016-03-07T12:43:04.266+0000)

Darius isn't even bad. He's just really good early game and has true damage, something people seem to hate... but I don't like Fiora either.

I think Darius is excellent, he has clear strenghts, clear weaknessess and is as such well balanced as opposed to Fiora who has clear strenghts and very unclear weaknessess.

Serika Zero9 votes

Fiora has clear weaknesses: when she's dead, she can't deal damage!!!!!!!

GlockHammer3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Serika Zero,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2uAXrhEA,comment-id=00060000000000000000,timestamp=2016-03-07T15:25:19.891+0000)

Fiora has clear weaknesses: when she's dead, she can't deal damage!!!!!!!

Oh god, I feel so wrecked. Well played sir, well played.

Akunaitsu4 votes

Fiora can die? I never heard of that...

63536895_DEL9 votes

http://i.imgur.com/NssfdEn.png This game happened forever ago, but I'm still salty.

GlockHammer5 votes

Fiora, the most oppressive thing to hit this planet since fascism. :D

WadeWilson133717 votes

Literally everything from patch 5.16 was cancer. Skarner 65% winrate, had to be gutted because so much power was put into his dominion memorial spires. Darius Was permaban/pick in solo que and LCS for basically all of worlds, just stomped every single game. Was the equivalent of Kogmaw comps last patch. Garen Didnt bother me too much, but seeing the rage from bronze/silver players who didnt ban him was hilarious. Im told that hes still a ban in that elo. Gangplank HOLY MOLY. How many god damn times did they have to nerf Gangplank? Hes been nerfed 6 times, including the last round of nerfs being absolutely huge, and hes still a massive threat if you can handle his high skillcap. Mordekaiser . Fiora Quite frankly Fiora was quite possibly the least oppresive of the bunch as she was a glass cannon for so long, but with this tank build...its bullshit.

Jungle Lux God6 votes

In regards to Darius, he wasn't ever a pick in the LCS because the LCS was never played on patch 5.16. At worlds he was a popular pick, but he wasn't a pick that "stomped every single game". If anything, he was barely relevant in most games at worlds because most teams would first-pick him, and then he'd get counterpicked by someone like Gnar or get laneswapped on and basically become irrelevant the rest of the game.

Solo queue yes, he was definitely really strong and definitely stomped, and there were a few examples of Darius doing well at worlds, but he was never really dominant at worlds even though he got picked a lot.

Darth Pixy Misa4 votes

easiest way to counter bad vitals is to walk a screen away and come back, just 3 sec......

Lauchmelder13 votes

Doing so will make you lose CS and XP and in the end might as well lose the lane/game. It's counterplay, yes, but should it be one of the few downsides she has?

IceKingChernobog8 votes

It's funny that one of her counterplays involves counterplaying yourself out of cs and xp

KING 5HARK3 votes

You can just walk into a bush

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