Sona a utility support with bad utility

only zhule··16 votes·1,603 views

As the title suggests i have an issue with Sona. Her lack of a core identity, her underwhelming utility, and her just over all lack luster power level in the game.

Lets first address her identity as a character: Before her rework she was the "super easy aura bot" who could stand way outside a fight and still have huge effects on it. This came from the huge range she had on her auras, the always on nature of those aura's the 1 second persisting effect they had (aura's would say active for 1 second after you switched to a new one), and her super low cooldowns. Her abilities were never over powered in face value (press a button delete/ negate a target), but they offered an insane level of invisible power. This power made it so that she could still be useful to the team even if her ultimate was on cooldown, and provide a lot of power for the laning phase.

After her rework her auras took on a whole different feel. Gone are the always on effect, and invisible power. But so to is gone almost all the range of her aura's. Where you use to be able to skirt the edge of combat ducking in and out, now you need to be front and center to offer your utility skills to your allies. She has be switched from a back line support to a front line support, but was never given the defensive boost to compensate for this switch.

Now to her Utility as a whole:

Her heal first lost the ability to be spammed via increased cooldown. Then lost the ability to be used often with a large increase in base mana cost. After that they reduced the value of each heal with the 50% nerf to her bonus healing. You are now left with a heal that is painfully underwhelming until/unless you build a very large amount of AP, have good mana regen, and have maxed out your cooldown reduction

Lets move to her movement speed skill now. You would think that a skill that can give multiple champions a 10-20% movement speed bonus would be very impressive. However a few issues show up very quickly, the first is that the movement speed bonus only lasts 1.5 seconds on your allies. Sona has the longer base time and a higher movement speed buff but both of these decay down to the aura value, meaning that she cant use them effectively to run anywhere. The second big issue with the skill is that it has a 12 second cooldown. This means that even if you max your CDR you still have long periods of time where you can't cast the spell. Assuming max cooldown, you boost your team for 1.5 seconds and then have 5.7 seconds where the skill can't be used again, that is near 4 times the length of the speed boost.

We can also look at her Q. The bonus damage she offers can not be used on structures so she no longer is good for a siege lane, and won't offer much help in destorying the enemy base. The level of difference between her old 20 AD+AP boost and her new on hit magic damage boost is also questionable. The new skill is much less helpful for champions who do more of their damage in spells instead of auto attacks. There is also reasonable question on if the bonus AD amounted to more bonus damage over all compared to the one time on hit bonus of her current Q.

The killer as i said before is her aura range. You have to be so close to allies to give them any utility bonus that you often have to decide between a combination of safety and personal damage vs helping your teammates.

Finally a few points on her power level over all:

The biggest issue Sona faces is that she is "balanced" around what her skills can do if you tag all your allies. This means that her 1v1 and 2v2 power is much lower then basically any other champion in the game.

However i would like to ask a question, for those who have played Sona. Outside of her ultimate do you ever feel like her skills make a difference? Even if you tag your whole team with a skill, do you ever feel like that made a huge difference? For a champion who is based around helping her whole team, none of her skill ever really feel like they have a big effect if you DO manage to get your whole team with it.

For those who are going to claim she does a lot of damage, ask yourself does she really? Or does she do a lot of damage for a "support"? Would you complain about the level of damage if you were fighting a "mage" character instead? Or would you laugh at how little it does compared to other character of that same classification?

44 Comments

biobirbbyy3 votes

All im saying is that when a Sona is picked on my team i cringe so hard. When it is picked on the other team, and I'm not bot, roam every 5 seconds

ModWulf Helhammer2 votes

You've never played with or against a good Sona then.

biobirbbyy1 votes

True.

TNHA Baritone2 votes

Even good Sonas struggle. Only the absolute great ones barely make it. Her kit just isn't up to par with other Supports. We are not asking for 50 buffs. We aren't asking for more damage. We just want to be able to peel as good as Thresh/Leo/Janna/Ali/Nami and not be Taric tier when it comes to peeling.

only zhule2 votes

Peel would be nice, but i'd even be happy with a stronger effect and a bigger range on her auras. I don't need it to go back to 1000 range, but something like 500 would be nice. Basically i would like to be able to help my allies but not have to be front line to do it (since reworking her into a damage sponge support seems like a bad idea).

TNHA Baritone1 votes

Agreed

Pika3102 votes

I'd say 700 range minimum. The shortest ranged ability amongst all supports(save Sona's THREE 350 abilities) is Soraka's W at 550 units. Every other spell has 600 or more.

Pika3104 votes

That's because they all quit playing Sona, because of patch 4.13.

Krigjer3 votes

I agree that she shifted from floating aura machine hanging out at the back to a front-line active ability user, and could use some defensive buffs maybe to compensate for it.

But I don't understand that people say that she has no core identity anymore. Old Sona felt like the only thing truly useful about her was the ult. Now I feel like I'm actually helping when I press QWE.

Your last statement made me think. She DOES do a lot of damage... for a support. I can two-shot squishy champions by myself, but tanks are more difficult, unlike an Ahri or Veigar just melting with enough AP. That said, does she really need a damage buff? She'll just move to midlane just like Lulu did. Why can't a support just be a support; why do they always have to be able to pump out tonnes of damage.

only zhule3 votes

{quoted}

I agree that she shifted from floating aura machine hanging out at the back to a front-line active ability user, and could use some defensive buffs maybe to compensate for it.

But I don't understand that people say that she has no core identity anymore. Old Sona felt like the only thing truly useful about her was the ult. Now I feel like I'm actually helping when I press QWE.

Your last statement made me think. She DOES do a lot of damage... for a support. I can two-shot squishy champions by myself, but tanks are more difficult, unlike an Ahri or Veigar just melting with enough AP. That said, does she really need a damage buff? She'll just move to midlane just like Lulu did. Why can't a support just be a support; why do they always have to be able to pump out tonnes of damage.

I feel i need to disagree with the second part of your comment. I think playing AS sona (pre rework) she had a very good core identity, auras, none committing poke, ultimate. Playing WITH her she seemed super boring and maybe threw out a little damage every now and then... BUT HER ULTIMATE...

I kind of see her as like that old timey drummer boy in an army. You don't see them in the front line, but they were super important for keeping order and helping their allies.

Please also remember that a bit before the rework she was a semi viable mid lane. The always on auras and low mana costs off set her one damage ability making it possible to still do good trades (also the bonus AD from the Q helped make her AA's have some reasonable power). I feel like now almost everyone can either out range you or has a reliable gap closer so you can't play the poke game.

TNHA Baritone3 votes

She doesnt naturally pump out tons of damage tho...Lich Bane just works beautifully with her kit. Is that our fault? Old Sona had useful persistent auras that made her always be buffing her allies with something. Now, her auras dont really give much, and they only buff while they are in use, not persistently,

at least you arent calling her broken. ;/ PS: She doesnt do so much dmg until you hit her with an ability and you see it take 3/4 of her hp

Krigjer2 votes

She doesnt naturally pump out tons of damage tho...Lich Bane just works beautifully with her kit.

But that was my point. She's a support, why would she have a need to naturally do a lot of damage? The only reason I even build Lich Bane (rushing Sheen) is to poke the enemy adc out of lane so they can't farm and have a harder time catching up in the mid game. I can't stand playing damage supports like Vel and Annie.

at least you arent calling her broken.

I feel like the only person that doens't think she needs a nerf or a buff. Feels fine the way she is.

TNHA Baritone3 votes

I mean supports can go build full dmg but that doesnt mean they dont deserve a buff. Some might say sona is broken with lich bane but what happens if she doesnt build it? Like you cant balence if they synergize with an item too good or else Riot would have already ripped Bork in two.

Emmy Cha0s3 votes

You're contradicting your own words:

She's a support, why would she have a need to naturally do a lot of damage?

The only reason I even build Lich Bane (rushing Sheen)

Lich Bane is NOT natural damage. It's the very definition of ARTIFICIAL damage. Sona's natural damage is VERY low. Only with Lich Bane, an ARTIFICIAL damage source does it look like she does anything.

Ash Lockheart3 votes

[{quoted}](name=only zhule,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2kzGpP0y,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-10-24T21:04:44.579+0000)

As the title suggests i have an issue with Sona. Her lack of a core identity, her underwhelming utility, and her just over all lack luster power level in the game.

Lets first address her identity as a character: Before her rework she was the "super easy aura bot" who could stand way outside a fight and still have huge effects on it. This came from the huge range she had on her auras, the always on nature of those aura's the 1 second persisting effect they had (aura's would say active for 1 second after you switched to a new one), and her super low cooldowns. Her abilities were never over powered in face value (press a button delete/ negate a target), but they offered an insane level of invisible power. This power made it so that she could still be useful to the team even if her ultimate was on cooldown, and provide a lot of power for the laning phase.

After her rework her auras took on a whole different feel. Gone are the always on effect, and invisible power. But so to is gone almost all the range of her aura's. Where you use to be able to skirt the edge of combat ducking in and out, now you need to be front and center to offer your utility skills to your allies. She has be switched from a back line support to a front line support, but was never given the defensive boost to compensate for this switch.

Now to her Utility as a whole:

Her heal first lost the ability to be spammed via increased cooldown. Then lost the ability to be used often with a large increase in base mana cost. After that they reduced the value of each heal with the 50% nerf to her bonus healing. You are now left with a heal that is painfully underwhelming until/unless you build a very large amount of AP, have good mana regen, and have maxed out your cooldown reduction

Lets move to her movement speed skill now. You would think that a skill that can give multiple champions a 10-20% movement speed bonus would be very impressive. However a few issues show up very quickly, the first is that the movement speed bonus only lasts 1.5 seconds on your allies. Sona has the longer base time and a higher movement speed buff but both of these decay down to the aura value, meaning that she cant use them effectively to run anywhere. The second big issue with the skill is that it has a 12 second cooldown. This means that even if you max your CDR you still have long periods of time where you can't cast the spell. Assuming max cooldown, you boost your team for 1.5 seconds and then have 5.7 seconds where the skill can't be used again, that is near 4 times the length of the speed boost.

We can also look at her Q. The bonus damage she offers can not be used on structures so she no longer is good for a siege lane, and won't offer much help in destorying the enemy base. The level of difference between her old 20 AD+AP boost and her new on hit magic damage boost is also questionable. The new skill is much less helpful for champions who do more of their damage in spells instead of auto attacks. There is also reasonable question on if the bonus AD amounted to more bonus damage over all compared to the one time on hit bonus of her current Q.

The killer as i said before is her aura range. You have to be so close to allies to give them any utility bonus that you often have to decide between a combination of safety and personal damage vs helping your teammates.

Finally a few points on her power level over all:

The biggest issue Sona faces is that she is "balanced" around what her skills can do if you tag all your allies. This means that her 1v1 and 2v2 power is much lower then basically any other champion in the game.

However i would like to ask a question, for those who have played Sona. Outside of her ultimate do you ever feel like her skills make a difference? Even if you tag your whole team with a skill, do you ever feel like that made a huge difference? For a champion who is based around helping her whole team, none of her skill ever really feel like they have a big effect if you DO manage to get your whole team with it.

For those who are going to claim she does a lot of damage, ask yourself does she really? Or does she do a lot of damage for a "support"? Would you complain about the level of damage if you were fighting a "mage" character instead? Or would you laugh at how little it does compared to other character of that same classification?

I can agree she was reworked in a bad way. Riots idea fell really short when they didn't think about increasing her deference to compensate for the nerf's I use to be a sona main, but sadly those nerfs hurt her so much. I dropped playing her as a sup all together. Now I use Braum,leona,sheraka, or Vel. I don't have issues with champs getting nerfed but hers was over kill for the most part.

2DRLNgK7wY2 votes

All I know is early Sona Q is strong...imo her laning phase is fine as long as you can avoid skill shots (shes too squishy)

only zhule2 votes

I'd say her level 1 Q is strong, but by level 3 her burst isn't impressive enough anymore (maybe with a good poke ADC)

2DRLNgK7wY1 votes

[{quoted}](name=only zhule,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2kzGpP0y,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2015-10-24T21:52:06.743+0000)

I'd say her level 1 Q is strong, but by level 3 her burst isn't impressive enough anymore (maybe with a good poke ADC)

take Q twice @ lvl 3 and now your peaking

TNHA Baritone3 votes

That is, if you have no magic resist

Pika3103 votes

Her level 1 Q has a base of 40 damage. That's literally tied for the lowest base damage of the ENTIRE support class.

Pika3102 votes

Essentially, I agree with everything you said, more or less.

The last point about her doing damage, it's neither. She doesn't "do a lot of damage" nor does she "do a lot of damage for a support." The truth of the matter is that Lich Bane and Luden's Echo do a lot of damage. Otherwise without 1 or both of those, on her own she factually has one of the lowest full-rotation bursts out of the entire support class.

1011001110002 votes

I feel less useful and impactful post-rework than I did pre-rework. I've said it before, and after more nerfs, Sona's literally just flat out bad at everything. Her poke was nerfed, her sustain was nerfed, her ms utility was nerfed.

I practically dropped Sona after her rework, she just isn't worth playing in the slightest. The games I do play her in are just games where I literally don't give a shit and just feel like Q-Ult spamming for the entire game, because that's all that Riot left her. If I even have a shred of decency, I'll play a support that provides REAL utility, like Nami, Zyra, Thresh, hell, even Taric is more useful.

People complain that Sona has a lot of damage just because of items like Luden's or Lich Bane. In all reality, ANY champion needing AP could build those items, deal MORE damage than Sona AND have better scaling. Even for a support, her damage is pitiful for how little utility she realistically provides.

Uiraya2 votes

If Sona needs to use W at any point during laning phase you both might as well just back because you're going to spend all your mana and then have to back anyway, leaving your adc in a 1v2 while you're gone.

I read somewhere that "pro" Sona builds don't take E until level 8 or something. This is likely the worst spell in the game. Pro is in quotations because nobody who wants to win picks Sona.

That leaves Q, which Sona used to build around, since her "rework" destroyed it the least of all her destroyed spells. Then they realized that Sona was doing something so they crushed Q the rest of the way too. She now gets a tiny power spike when she gets lich bane and then fizzles again.

Riot removed her invisible power and replaced it with nothing. That's not better. The champion needs a complete and total rework AGAIN because right now she is nearly completely worthless. Nami having to aim (one of) her skills does not justify having her able to do everything Sona does, considerably better, plus more, and every other support just laughs at her. The balance team being terrified of Sona of all champions when Thresh, Braum, and others are making an actual impact on the role is baffling.

Primaquarius1 votes

Riot knew everyone loved to rush Lich on Sona so they nerfed the Q ratio to bait it into meta, while keeping her damage as low as possible without making her another Taric...although her healing is Taric level at this point

only zhule3 votes

{quoted}

Riot knew everyone loved to rush Lich on Sona so they nerfed the Q ratio to bait it into meta, while keeping her damage as low as possible without making her another Taric...although her healing is Taric level at this point

I don't mind lower personal damage just would like it to be off set by a higher value to her teammates. As it is, it's often not worth trying to "help" your team with her auras in the late game. You can often do more just circling the outside of the fight.

TNHA Baritone3 votes

Her healing is less than Taric....

Pika3102 votes

Her damage is less than Taric...

HigeR1 votes

As the title suggests i have an issue with Sona. Her lack of a core identity

I stopped there, her identity is the support that has the most damage out of all the healers. If you can't figure out how to use that to your advantage then you shouldn't be playing Sona.

only zhule2 votes

{quoted}

I stopped there, her identity is the support that has the most damage out of all the healers. If you can't figure out how to use that to your advantage then you shouldn't be playing Sona.

Except that she doesn't. She just happens to be the "healer" that most often runs a Lich bane and/or Echo. Coupled with the need to have high AP to giver her utility stats half decent value. Build a Sona with a typical healer support item package and see how much damage you really do.

HigeR1 votes

that's the point though, you can't build Sona with a typical healer package, it's like building Soraka with a lich bane just because you want some damage, it won't work.

If you want more damage and poke, pick Sona, if you want good heals, pick Soraka, if you want Utility, Pick Nami, if you want Disengage, pick Janna, if you want defense, pick Taric, if you want peel, pick Alistar, if you want it all with lesser effectivity, pick Lulu.

Don't expect every single support to be good at everything, don't tell me that it's just because she runs lich bane that she has good damage, because in reality, it's the way her Q works that makes lich bane a good choice and not the other way around.

chipndip12 votes

{quoted}

I stopped there, her identity is the support that has the most damage out of all the healers. If you can't figure out how to use that to your advantage then you shouldn't be playing Sona.

  1. She isn't a healer. Just because her shield has a lousy heal in it doesn't mean she can play into healing like Nami/Soraka can.

  2. Her damage is actually garbage-tier. Only the third hit hurts hard. The first two are negligible.

Miraweave1 votes

In what universe is Sona a utility support?

She's a supportive mage: she requires AP to scale, and when she has it she's incredibly powerful.

only zhule3 votes

{quoted}

In what universe is Sona a utility support?

She's a supportive mage: she requires AP to scale, and when she has it she's incredibly powerful.

She's a pretty shit tier support mage. No stun pre 6, low base values, one damage spell (before ultimate).

2DRLNgK7wY1 votes

...but with her passive its not the lowest; and your not including the dmg buff on the aa as well as the dmg buff u give to your AD....

Pika3102 votes

She doesn't get a dmg buff to her AD, that was removed in patch 4.13. As for everything else, Staccato, Hymn's 2nd active, those are already included whether you want to believe it or not. Sure she's not the lowest(that would be Braum), but she does factually have the 2nd-lowest damage potential amongst all support champs.

2DRLNgK7wY1 votes

AURA: Sona and tagged allied champions deal bonus magic damage on their next basic attack within 3 seconds.

BONUS MAGIC DAMAGE: 20 / 30 / 40 / 50 / 60 (+ 20% AP) (+ 10 / 20 / 40)

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Sona

Ok im done i really dont care this much i dont post on here. ty for the info tho

Oksanaandjoy1 votes

Chuck the Ardent Censer on her and her shields are giving (potentially) the whole team a +30 magic damage and 15% attack speed. I find that tends to make a bit of impact...

Love playing Sona, and I play a lot of squishy supports, but i'm starting to question their viability unfortunately.

only zhule2 votes

Ok now instead of looking at bast case, lets look at most likely case. You buy Censer and you are tagging 2 allies per cast. Do you feel the item is A) worth the slot it takes up B) worth the gold investment early-mid game?

Oksanaandjoy1 votes

I do think it's a good option when you add in the 40 AP and 10% CDR. As a squishy support, I try not to focus on building AP, but every little bit helps. Ardent, plus Banner or Locket, means you are doing your job of focusing on assisting team mates rather than just playing as an extra AP champ with Sightstone. I do wish that aura was a little bigger though; Ardent would have a better/safer impact that way.

1011001110002 votes

That's just Ardent Censor though. Put Ardent on Karma and she'll abuse it a lot more easily than Sona.

Oksanaandjoy1 votes

Agreed. I also use it on Karma, who I use more than Sona to be honest. Mid game, you start using that shield with Mantra in group fights = everyone gets some shield and 6 seconds of magic damage/attack speed. It's not too bad.

only zhule2 votes

{quoted}

AURA: Sona and tagged allied champions deal bonus magic damage on their next basic attack within 3 seconds.

BONUS MAGIC DAMAGE: 20 / 30 / 40 / 50 / 60 (+ 20% AP) (+ 10 / 20 / 40)

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Sona

Ok im done i really dont care this much i dont post on here. ty for the info tho

20-100 magic damage on one auto attack every 8 seconds (minus CDR) VS. 4-20 AD+AP as long as the skill is up.

Partholonian1 votes

One auto attack per champion. Sona gets to trigger it herself in addition to applying it to at least one ally (unless you're trying to 1v1 as Sona, which you shouldn't be).

Now sure, sometimes your ally will use that bonus damage to last hit instead, but if they actually know to use it to trade, you're doing a minimum of double the listed damage.

A Wild AP Sona2 votes

{quoted}

One auto attack per champion. Sona gets to trigger it herself in addition to applying it to at least one ally (unless you're trying to 1v1 as Sona, which you shouldn't be).

Now sure, sometimes your ally will use that bonus damage to last hit instead, but if they actually know to use it to trade, you're doing a minimum of double the listed damage.

which is still less damage than other supports that just do the extra damage personally bad logic sona is a bad champion that needs more damage not utility buffs

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