Did they just nerf Sona again? (PBE)

Kowe The Ewok·Jan 5, 2015·74 votes·6,715 views

Sona

Movement speed lowered to 325 from 330

Source I just hope this is incomplete information... Otherwise it would be God damn hilarious to see her being nerfed yet again.

121 Comments

QantèsJan 5, 201534 votes

Riot must be joking... I can't believe they're nerfing her AGAIN with things like Lee Sin, Zed, Fizz, etc. still running around. -.-

Kowe The EwokJan 5, 201516 votes

Couldn't agree more...

But sadly Riot balances around winrates, not power. Statistically speaking we have a vast majority of Bronze players who can't even win botgames. They see a stream, want to copy it - and drop the winrates. Ironically op champions who get banned and picked often in decent ELO get their winrates ruined at low elo.

QantèsJan 5, 20158 votes

Usually champions with a lot of AoE spells have a little more winrate because of the incoordination of soloQ.

The thing is, why are they nerfing her over and over again without any context as if she was the most toxic champ in the game right now?

PentaJumpJan 5, 20156 votes

[{quoted}](name=Kowe The Ewok,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2axmwBNw,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2015-01-05T20:30:48.473+0000)

Couldn't agree more...

But sadly Riot balances around winrates, not power. Statistically speaking we have a vast majority of Bronze players who can't even win botgames. They see a stream, want to copy it - and drop the winrates. Ironically op champions who get banned and picked often in decent ELO get their winrates ruined at low elo.

I'm sorry, but RIOT does NOT balance around winrates. Look at LeBlanc, Elise, and Yasuo. They have received nerfs when they had one of the lower winrates in the game.

Pika310Jan 5, 20158 votes

That may have been true a year ago. However, for at least the past few months, the majority of nerfs have all been aimed at high win-rates. Patch 4.20 alone, they nerfed all 5 of the highest win-rate champs at that time. Fiora is not LB or Yas, she didn't deserve a nerf.

It Is I EmotoJan 6, 20156 votes

Leblanc did recieve the silence removal, but honestly, I did play her alot and she was really annoying to deal with, mostly if she did q+r and you were silenced, and you could do nothing against her killing you.

GaleWinUnleashedJan 5, 20157 votes

Winrate is a horrible way to judge power, yet we (the players) seem to place a lot of importance in it. There are too many variables involved to be able to use winrate as a standalone statistic. Our time would be far better used examining the individual variables, among other data, to make judgments about the power levels of individual champions. Sadly, we don't have easy access to these data, nor the tools to analyze them.

Riot, on the other hand, has all of the data at their disposal, and is in a position to analyze it accurately, or even make new analysis tools if the current ones are insufficient.

We see winrates mentioned by Riot from time to time, more frequently than we see them use other data. This is because the winrate is one of the few numbers we have access to AND can easily understand. Not because Riot thinks that this number by itself determines who is overpowered and who is not.

Demonsolder21Jan 6, 20156 votes

Sona doesn't make the LCS plays.

Ulquiorra995Jan 5, 201525 votes

"We reduced Sona's damage output so she does't kill anyone and ruined her healing so she doesn't out sustain anyone. However, we have noticed that even with these changes aimed at destroying any presence she might have Sona players can actually escape fights alive, so we're fixing that now."

DaaaaangJan 5, 201521 votes

Developer 1: Lee Sin is still dominating in every category. Developer 2: What do you think we should do to fix it? Developer 1: We need to... nerf Sona. Again.

Pika310Jan 5, 201518 votes

Surprised? I'm not. Riot hates Sona and will keep nerfing her until her playrate is 0%. The "rework" was inherent proof of this.

19 19 19Jan 5, 201516 votes

So now Sona's movement speed is the same as Zyra, hmmm So Riot Phreak why is this the case ?

MrBuffingtonJan 5, 20157 votes

If I had to play devil's advocate I'd probably say something about her medium cooldown speed buff, but yea...no....she doesn't nearly have the tools of champions like Zyra or Orianna...

MEMEME670Jan 5, 20153 votes

What are you on? Did this circlejerk really get so big you just ignore the facts now?

Zyra has infinitely less movement options available to her than Sona.

MrBuffingtonJan 6, 20154 votes

I was talking about CC and zoning pressure and just damage in general.

MEMEME670Jan 6, 20152 votes

Well, Sona is winning over 3% more than Zyra is in Diamond+, so while you can say what you want about sona has less of this and that, she is doing a lot better overall.

Therefore, what you're saying is probably wrong.

VDc0zCqe0wJan 6, 20157 votes

statistics in diamond change really really fast, sometimes Zyra is 2nd, sometimes is 4th, today is 14th, maybe tomorrow she'll be 6th or 4th

GaleWinUnleashedJan 5, 20151 votes

Sona's impact, aside from her ult, is more spread out and generalized, and is therefore not felt as strongly. She's actually handing out very high stats to her teammates over the course of a teamfight, and can keep at least one buff on them continually when she has enough items. Most other champions are more focused on particular goals, while Sona does some of everything at one time or another.

MrBuffingtonJan 6, 20152 votes

I mean I get she's still got problems as a champion, but I don't see how randomly watering down random elements of her kit helps; I don't think she's overtuned, I think that her rework only half solved her problems, which is her being too passive/non-interactive a champion (aside from her ult. By passive I mean she's focused on dispensing auras instead of having more defined moments). I mean her ult, and like, autos, are the only things you have to remotely aim. I mean, wasn't the whole goal behind the rework to give her more interactivity so Riot didn't have to water down her to the point where she doesn't feel satisfying to play? Isn't this exactly what's going on?

Emmy Cha0sJan 6, 20158 votes

By passive I mean she's focused on dispensing auras instead of having more defined moments).

Considering her abilities only work on activation now, she's actually LESS interactive than before. There are no more decisions. Is your spell up? Yes? Then use it. She's lost all of her defining moments, save Crescendo. Sona is more spam-bot now than ever.

MrBuffingtonJan 6, 20152 votes

lol so it's even worse than I said XD

xaadus creedusJan 5, 201515 votes

#Betternerfsona

Miku Hime samaJan 5, 201513 votes

item 3070

KailaTimeJan 5, 201512 votes

AH I hope not. Sona is really the ONLY support I enjoy playing. So much potential, she is an excellent champion and as pointed out above, nerfing her over others would be ridiculous.

In my opinion she is the most "support" like champion in the game, and nerfing that would ruin that.

It Is I EmotoJan 6, 201510 votes

Please, Phreak, explain us why she recieves a movement speed nerf, while Malz is flying around with 340, and having like Sona, the same aa range and having no reliable cc pre-six.

XtremeyJan 5, 20159 votes

the quantity of nerfs reminds me of Khazix but these actually hurt.

Remlap1223Jan 6, 20154 votes

Ok, after the real, objectively proper nerf Kha'Zix got that kept the freelo whiners from cheesing with him was enough, I'll give you that, but even after he got his W nerfed further he STILL is playable. Sona is literally unplayable. I seriously think they're going to delete her at this rate.

FalconPawwwwnchJan 5, 20158 votes

One of highest win rates in game

Nerf deserved.

Death to sona

Downvote me sona circlejerk I bathe in your tears

SammystormJan 5, 20151 votes

one of the highest win rates and play rates.

DiostukosJan 5, 201515 votes

{quoted}

one of the highest win rates and play rates.

Um, no. Leona and Blitz have way higher playrates and equal winrates.

SexyTaylorSwiftJan 5, 20158 votes

I think they also decreased power cord damage by 10% lol.

Pika310Jan 5, 20159 votes

Yes, they did that in the last PBE patch. The next live patch will bring both of these and if history repeats, a 3rd nerf that they'll think up on the spot.

SexyTaylorSwiftJan 5, 20159 votes

Don't get it at all.

VDc0zCqe0wJan 5, 20155 votes

today i was thinking "well Phreak actually did answer to the post about Zyra's MS, so probably he has something planned for that"

Sona MS nerf

kappa

Kowe The EwokJan 5, 201510 votes

{quoted}

today i was thinking "well Phreak actually did answer to the post about Zyra's MS, so probably he has something plant for that"

Sona MS nerf

kappa

Fix'd it for ya :D

ByrnesJan 5, 20153 votes

Oh God, THEY TOOK OFF 5MS? WTF RIOT. THE GAME IS LIKE 100% UNPLAYABLE NOW, NOW SONA WILL NEVER BE USED BY ANYONE EVER AGAIN OMGGGGG

Hellish ProphecyJan 5, 201510 votes

5MS can mean the difference between saving your tower or getting there just in time to see it destroyed.

NakawakaJan 6, 20158 votes

Blitzcrank

ha ha ha ho ho ho

SukishooJan 6, 20154 votes

Get 3 dragons, Mobi boots, spam her speed boost and you're fixed.

Emmy Cha0sJan 6, 20156 votes

"Spam" an ability that had its cooldown doubled and aura removed. GENIUS.

SukishooJan 6, 20152 votes

Aura removed? LOL. It's still there.

Pika310Jan 6, 20155 votes

A one-time proc, activate-only ability that disappears completely after a few seconds is not an "aura." I mean, unless you consider Fizz's shark an "aura," Lee Sin's slow an "aura," or Maokai's saplings an "aura." Hell, maybe every ability in the game should be called "auras."

SukishooJan 6, 20151 votes

A Proc? No. Sona's abilities all give off an Aura (except her ult). Aura's are the abilities or passives (in the case of items) that as long as you are near them and their effects are active that you receive benefit.

Pika310Jan 6, 20154 votes

as long as you are near them and their effects are active that you receive benefit.

You just proved my point. Sona's effects are applied ONCE. Allies receive NOTHING from being near Sona, only from being near her for a singular moment. With YOUR definition, Sona's abilities are NOT auras.

Thank you very much.

SukishooJan 6, 20151 votes

You know nothing. They are in fact Auras as they even say so in the descriptions. You are absolutely stupid if you believe otherwise.

Hymn of Valor AURA: Sona and allied champions tagged with Hymn of Valor's aura deal bonus magic damage on their next basic attack within 3 seconds.

Aria of Perseverance AURA: Sona and allied champions tagged with Aria of Perseverance's aura are shielded for up to 1.5 seconds.

Song of Celerity AURA: Allied champions tagged with Song of Celerity's aura gain movement speed for 1.5 seconds.

A Wild AP SonaJan 6, 20155 votes

{quoted}

You know nothing. They are in fact Auras as they even say so in the descriptions. You are absolutely stupid if you believe otherwise.

Hymn of Valor AURA: Sona and allied champions tagged with Hymn of Valor's aura deal bonus magic damage on their next basic attack within 3 seconds.

Aria of Perseverance AURA: Sona and allied champions tagged with Aria of Perseverance's aura are shielded for up to 1.5 seconds.

Song of Celerity AURA: Allied champions tagged with Song of Celerity's aura gain movement speed for 1.5 seconds.

sonas original ability was an aura

zekes herald/locket are an aura

sonas abilities arent fucking auras they have a range of like 5 pixels and last for 1 second lol aura = permanent effect if you are within a certain range

having an ability with a 12 second downtime and an active of 1.5 seconds (if you are close enough to tag them and bait a free amumu double kill) is not an aura the only reason it says "aura" is because riot is a downie and was too lazy to reword the description

SukishooJan 6, 20151 votes

No. Aura's are usually a temporary effect when in range. In the case of a champion's abilities, them giving off a permanent aura is very over powered. Which is why all global passives were changed or reduced.

And yeah, Janna, Zilean, type things give you the affect of the passive as long as they are near you but they don't really change you're power that greatly. If Sona's aura's we're permanently active when you were near her she would be one of the most OP champions in the game. You could have a shield once she learned her heal, the extra magic damage from her Q and a speed buff from her E... come on, that'd be broken.

A Wild AP SonaJan 6, 20156 votes

{quoted}

No. Aura's are usually a temporary effect when in range. In the case of a champion's abilities, them giving off a permanent aura is very over powered. Which is why all global passives were changed or reduced.

And yeah, Janna, Zilean, type things give you the affect of the passive as long as they are near you but they don't really change you're power that greatly. If Sona's aura's we're permanently active when you were near her she would be one of the most OP champions in the game. You could have a shield once she learned her heal, the extra magic damage from her Q and a speed buff from her E... come on, that'd be broken.

thats exactly what her original auras were and she was hardly OP she still had the same win ratio (or worse) and was garbage in competitive play

SukishooJan 6, 20151 votes

That's because they didn't give you that kind of power. If they made the current auras permanent she would have way too much power.

A Wild AP SonaJan 6, 20156 votes

{quoted}

All I'm heaing is "Look at me I'm another player that's Diamond so that instantly makes me better than everyone else" nonsense.

Ciao.

implying having the best sona stats in the world and the 2nd or 3rd most sona games played doesnt make you a leading expert/qualified to talk about the champion http://www.lolskill.net/top?filterChampion=37&filterRealm=