Shaco's boxes should still be disabled by sweeper and control

The Ecdysiast··19 votes·1,339 views

It makes sense for all the traps you actually have to step on to activate. You get time to attack the trap if you use a sweeper. But it added too much strength to Shaco's boxes, since melee champions (and Rakan) cannot step close enough to destroy the trap without setting it off.

They even changed the point at which you can target traps so that players can destroy them without stepping directly on top of them, in order to balance this feature for every other trap. However, the Shaco boxes still have a 300 range, making it impossible to destroy them as a melee champion without first activating them.

Edit: To anyone claiming Shaco doesn't need more nerfs because he's in a bad spot at the moment, the numbers don't lie. His winrate is above 50% and actually increases to 60% the later the game goes on, counter to his traditional intended design of falling off due to his kit's high early strength.

27 Comments

L Psy Kongroo5 votes

Using item 3341 or item 2055 on Shaco boxes automatically actives them. So all you have to do is wait 5 seconds while they expire. Furthermore, if they are revealed in this way, the fear does not go off, meaning they're basically worthless unless Shaco is building AP (which almost no one does these days).

The Ecdysiast3 votes

So "all" you have to do is wait 7 times as long to destroy the trap, and get no gold from it? And it's that "almost" part that makes it even more unfair against an AP Shaco.

abbbez1 votes

I think that since you don't get feared it's pretty balanced and fair since it makes the boxes weaker but not useless.

The Ecdysiast2 votes

Maybe if it only prioritized feared champions, that'd make it fair. But as it is it prioritizes champions in range. So removing the fear does nothing.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

Maybe if it only prioritized feared champions, that'd make it fair. But as it is it prioritizes champions in range. So removing the fear does nothing.

i'm all up for shaco to have his boxes disabled if you buff the fuck out of him because he is in no way shape or form in a good spot. He is very close to being one of the worst champions in the game and you are complaining about the pitiful damage that AD shaco is going to deal to you with his boxes? and for AP shaco you can just walk away and do something else if you are that afraid of the damage. All i see here is someone complaining about a weak champion

The Ecdysiast1 votes

Except the fact is, he is in a good spot. 50+ winrate and instead of his intentional design of falling off, he actually gets much, much better as the game goes on. So claiming he's not in a good spot is a far cry from the truth.

He hasn't been getting nerfs to make him useless, he's been getting nerfs because the more general assassin updates favored him too much.

Likewise, the sweeper update was intended only for Teemo, but they didn't want to code it separately for different champions.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

Except the fact is, he is in a good spot. 50+ winrate and instead of his intentional design of falling off, he actually gets much, much better as the game goes on. So claiming he's not in a good spot is a far cry from the truth.

He hasn't been getting nerfs to make him useless, he's been getting nerfs because the more general assassin updates favored him too much.

Likewise, the sweeper update was intended only for Teemo, but they didn't want to code it separately for different champions.

winrate means NOTHING! sorry but no he is not in a good spot. Every single assassin does his job better. You are complaining about a weak champion because you do not want to take the pitiful damage that the boxes do.

The Ecdysiast1 votes

You're.... just plain wrong. Winrate is the biggest indication of a champion's effectiveness that we have. And Shaco has been far above 50% ever since the assassin update.

He gets just as many kills early as any other assassin, and has his clone to block skillshots while dealing 50% more aa damage.

You not knowing how to play him doesn't change the facts.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

You're.... just plain wrong. Winrate is the biggest indication of a champion's effectiveness that we have. And Shaco has been far above 50% ever since the assassin update.

He gets just as many kills early as any other assassin, and has his clone to block skillshots while dealing 50% more aa damage.

You not knowing how to play him doesn't change the facts.

keep complaining about weak champions it doesn't matter that Shaco is weak. He can destroy low tier very easily which is what keeps his winrate high. WInrate means NOTHING at all but you can keep telling yourself it does. Winrate only means something if it's an extremely high or extremely low one. Sorry but cry all you want they won't change the way shaco boxes behave under the red trinket because you are do not want to take pitiful damage nor wait out the time it takes for them to fizzle away. The main strength of the boxes lies in the fear which is gone when you use the red trinket.

You believing that winrate means something doesn't change the fact that he is weak.

The Ecdysiast1 votes

I don't know how to explain it to you any more than it is.

All numbers, including win rate, show that Shaco is in no way in a bad spot.

You just don't know how to play him.

hater free zone1 votes

the fear doesn't proc, but they will still shoot you.

doiminat0r36001 votes

That's exactly what they just said...

hater free zone1 votes

That's exactly what they just said

_Exactly _

I don't see exactly where they said what I said. Where did it say EXACTLY that?

doiminat0r36001 votes

You're worrying over how exact your statement and OC statement is.

They said: "if they are revealed in this way, the fear does not go off, meaning they're basically worthless unless Shaco is building AP" which means that if they are revealed, the fear doesn't proc but everything else works normally.

hater free zone1 votes

I didn't know paraphrasing for clarity was illegal. sorry officer.

doiminat0r36001 votes

You didn't need to paraphrase. You just restated what they said.

That is the equivalent of the comment "This." It's useless and makes no sense.

Hallbuster2 votes

Just remove stealth off all champions.

fuffychan2 votes

Shaco is nearly the worst champion in the game, and youre still going to complain about him? His boxes are already useless because red sweeper destroys them. You get literally free counterplay.

Ralanr3 votes

Sweeper doesn't destroy them anymore. It only reveals them.

The Ecdysiast1 votes

That sounds like you have no idea how to play him. The numbers show that not only is he around 25th in winrate, he's 3rd in winrate for jungle. His winrate never dips below 50% at any game duration and actually increases, counter to his intended design, to near 60% the later the game gets.

He's factually one of the best champions in the game. And it's right to complain.

hater free zone1 votes

unless you are dealing with an AP shaco, the box dmg should not be of any concern when you destroy it. Even if you are up against an AP shaco, sweepers proc it's activation so you sweep it and wait 5 seconds for it to disappear. With AP shaco, the box is a big bulk of his dps and with trap detection items being available for anyone to buy in the shop, he is super easy to play against.

If you die to an AP shaco, you mostly deserve it. If you die to an AD shaco, it's certainly not because his box dps you down lol.

The Ecdysiast1 votes

If you have to wait 5 seconds for it to end, you've been zoned by it as intended by an AD Shaco. If it's an AP Shaco, then likewise you can't do much if all revealing it does is successfully zone you towards another nearby box.

L Psy Kongroo2 votes

{quoted}

If you have to wait 5 seconds for it to end, you've been zoned by it as intended by an AD Shaco. If it's an AP Shaco, then likewise you can't do much if all revealing it does is successfully zone you towards another nearby box.

AD Shaco doesn't zone people with boxes. He uses it purely for the fear effect, which is disabled when you sweep them.

And if you're low enough on HP to die to a single AP Shaco box, then you deserve to die for being so stupid as to chase him through it.

hater free zone2 votes

And that's literally all he has short of being utterly useless, and if you build any amount of resistances his boxes are even less effective. Maybe stop building glass cannon with your squishy picks.

Shuyin1781 votes

Fun Fact : Using a Red Trinket on Shaco's boxes activates them, causing them to kill themselves.

If you wanted to be cheeky, you could start with a red trinket and sweep Shaco's starting camp to delay him.

hater free zone1 votes

this kills the shaco

Shuyin1781 votes

Depends how good the Shaco is.

To bad my team is never smart enough to do this.

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