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126 champs in league, but less build paths

xxxMadLionxxx·Sep 16, 2015·25 votes·2,193 views

Hey all

Riot is nerfing sated devour because apparently Vayne is too op with it. They are changing it to proc on every forth attack for range champs. Well what about kayle who was buffed for the sole purpose of using it? What about the other range champs like ap varus who really benefited from the quick stacking of his W. On top of that, the new champ seems to proc it on every other attack for some reason.

When I saw sated for the first time, I realised it was op, but I loved the potential build diversity it added. Cause if you think of it, there are 126-127 champs in the game, but a lot of those champs use almost the same build paths.

Like ADCs for example,

1st item - Infinity edge 2nd item- boots with attack speed (cant remember the name) 3rd item- let me guess.... static shivv.

So my question is, is there really diversity if 5-10 champs use the same build paths? If 10 champs used almost the same build path each, then that would mean there are only 12-13 build paths used by the 126 champs in the game.

My point is, riot say they support diversity, but when an off build gets any publicity, they nerf it.

AP runeglaive EZ mid... RIP

30 Comments

KatCraftSep 16, 201512 votes

Change thread title to "League has no build diversity for adc's" since that's the only really stale role for build paths.

Chuck CharlesSep 17, 20151 votes

this. as an adc main its pretty lackluster how the build paths for adcs are all the same. any time I've tried to get creative and try funky builds to see whats out there I always come back to what is tried and true. IE > PD/SS OR BT > BT or PD/SS (whichever you didnt get first) > LW/BORK > BORK/LW

sometimes you rush lw early or bork early cuz they are very tanky or stacking pure health....but for the most part those 4 items are core. zerker greaves are pretty much all you ever get. sometimes if you feel like being an ad caster you can go ionians on like ez maybe lucian. but lets be real. thats not that often. corki builds sorcs cuz of magic pen and that alone is kind of a big deal. corki/kog also go the triforce route which in itself is also boring.

however, riot is reworking the adc/marksman items soon they said like they did with ap items so I expect a lot more balance in choosing which items will be the best to rush and it won't be so obvious. because with ap items it used to be "all the 120 ap items and then some defensive hybrid items". now you legitimately can go so many different ways and it works. I mean annie is a great example now as you can build her a myriad of ways and they all work.

I am excited for upcoming adc item rework.

Bloodhawk95Sep 16, 20155 votes

Or yasuos extremely limited build path. your only option is to build crit chance because of his passive

TurquoiseYoshiSep 17, 20151 votes

Actually, his build path isn't too bad. He has 3 main items (Statikk, I-Edge, T-Force) and boots that are pretty distinctly important to him for different reasons.

GloryBeToGODSep 16, 20153 votes

I think this is actually dumb. I'm not trying to spend 5 minutes in shop mid game because there are certain items i need to find because each champ has their own build path.

xxxMadLionxxxSep 16, 20153 votes

{quoted}

I think this is actually dumb. I'm not trying to spend 5 minutes in shop mid game because there are certain items i need to find because each champ has their own build path.

you taking it the wrong way, while you are playing the game you should already know what you are building. you not deciding at the moment you're in the shop. Example, if you want an armor pen build, you already have a list of items you need to get

AntiFlashSep 16, 20151 votes

Yeah who would want to use their brain a little bit to think about what the strongest item to build at that point in time is, or shit base items off runes and masteries. On top of that there are many good builds in the game people like this just lack the creativity to come up with anything. Scaling runes can allow for diversity.

GloryBeToGODSep 16, 20151 votes

Yes that's true "i" already know what i want to build, but you're not however thinking about the people that don't know what they need to build. Gonna be hard for new people to play the game. Noobs are already building more than one pair of boots and building things like two hydras that don't stack. For most it's already complex enough is what i'm hinting at. Not to mention that when rito does something like revamp the jungle, which they've done a lot the last year, it basically sends people into a frenzy how how the like 4 new items work and what to do with them. Just imagine the time it'll take for people to get used 4 personalized items for over 100 champs. Plus your way doesn't promote creativity, stating that this person can and only needs to build these 6 items and that's all.

MalzaharAnyLaneSep 16, 20151 votes

that's what mobafire is for lel

Actually adjusting to the circumstances of the match itself is for golds and up.

XonraSep 16, 20153 votes

Honestly Riot has about as much consistency between patches as a pro wrestling storyline sometimes.

It is like they almost forget what they did 2-3 patches ago then just break it with adding something, nerfing something, buffing something, who knows. I don't even try to find logic in it anymore because I swear, it seems sometimes like they have two completely different balance teams that just take turns swinging at the pinata.

Daedalus871Sep 16, 20152 votes

Goodbye Jungle Gnar.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 17, 20151 votes

Jungle Gnar was a thing in LCS before Sated Devourer existed. He'll still be slightly viable.

lilpokflufSep 16, 20152 votes

The build paths aren't set in stone. You can build whatever you like it just might not be optimal. If you want to build manamune on Sivir go ahead. Just don't be sad when you get out traded by Lucian with an IE.

xxxMadLionxxxSep 16, 20156 votes

{quoted}

The build paths aren't set in stone. You can build whatever you like it just might not be optimal. If you want to build manamune on Sivir go ahead. Just don't be sad when you get out traded by Lucian with an IE.

Well my point is, if an off build become remotely viable, riot nerfs it. Forcing us to stick to the linear recommended builds

Zenthon PrimeSep 16, 20152 votes

AP Kog says otherwise.

The reason good offbuilds are nerfed is because in every case I can personally think of except AP Cog and AP Corki they're utter cancer. See: -On-hit AS Fizz top/jg (aka "AIDSCancer Fizz") -AP Janna mid -AP Soraka mid/top -AP Sona mid -Runeglaive Ez -AP Yi ("one button penta")

All of these builds take away the weaknesses of a champion and retain the strengths (Ez, Fizz), or are just flat-out zero counterplay BS (Yi, Sona, Soraka, Janna). Are you seriously willing to tell me that ANY of these were healthy for the game?

In addition, the reality of the situation is that offbuilds, unless seriously used, are not taken into consideration when balancing for real builds. Kindred would be flat-out broken if Devourer didn't get nerfed (and let's be honest that one was a long time coming anyway).

XonraSep 16, 20153 votes

{quoted}

The build paths aren't set in stone. You can build whatever you like it just might not be optimal. If you want to build manamune on Sivir go ahead. Just don't be sad when you get out traded by Lucian with an IE.

Think this is kind of the point.

Sure, go ahead and build that needlessly large rod on Kalista as your first item. I mean, build paths aren't set in stone...just don't be surprised if that is dumb because why would you do that?

I mean, might as well say "Hey, no one is stopping you from walking into traffic, but don't be surprised if you get hit by a car doing it" <_< really?

MrWasjigSep 17, 20151 votes

Riot might as well give us a spoon and a cocktail stick and say "Now you can eat this boiled egg YOUR way" Sure you have the option to choose the cocktail stick but the spoon makes more sense. And this sadly rings true for item builds.

I think the issue is we need a bit more variety within each category. For example more items that fall under AD, and from there more options when it comes to pure AD, Crit chance, AS and so on. You get the idea. The more items that are specialized alongside the broader items should help bring about more actual item diversity. Rather than "Diversity" that Riot always harps on about. At leats that's what I think with my nooby Silver opinions.

Lord o teh MemesSep 16, 20152 votes

To OP: Sated Vayne is not the problem child, sated Kindred is. As a result Riot wants their new baby to thrive in the jungle at the expense of jungle Kayle, TF, Vayne, Azir, Teemo, Caitlyn, and Twitch (there might be more). I agree they should just let people do what they want except in abuse cases. So really they should fix the problem child Kindred to be not so dependent upon stacks because that is feast/ famine mechanics right there. Tanks have plenty of build path diversity, many items that have health, armor, utility, mana etc. Mages have plenty of options for regen, utility, ap, defenses, etc. Assassins and fighters start getting a bit restricted because they share items with ranged ad champions. Currently ADCs have little diversity in build path because of how they operate. They can do damage for NO risk IF they have a proper front line. Mages require mana and ap, Tanks require survival, assassins require positioning, timing and followthru. But Marksmen require something outside of their kit and their items.

Yuri By MailSep 16, 20151 votes

I liked Devourer on Twisted Fate, and then building Wits next. It gave him hybrid damage (and deceptively strong damage too when you consider E) and made AD TF actually fun. Are they nerfing the magic damage on-hit too?

Daedalus871Sep 16, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Are they nerfing the magic damage on-hit too?

Yes

IAmLordMichaelSep 16, 20151 votes

I think we need a few more items in general for each type of champ. they added mroe tank items, maybe add more ranged items, maybe another hybrid item, or another armor+ap item.

XonraSep 16, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I think we need a few more items in general for each type of champ. they added mroe tank items, maybe add more ranged items, maybe another hybrid item, or another armor+ap item.

They are looking at ADC items during the preseason supposedly.

Final Boss NautSep 16, 20151 votes

i want source, cause i dont believe.

xxxMadLionxxxSep 16, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Final Boss Naut,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=1INz5PEx,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2015-09-16T14:59:15.161+0000)

i want source, cause i dont believe.

see item notes....

http://www.surrenderat20.net/2015/09/915-pbe.html

g07h4xf00Sep 16, 20151 votes

item 3046 >> item 3087

But yeah LoL itemization sucks because most items are either not unique enough or have strictly shitty passive stats.

Maligaro SpikeSep 16, 20151 votes

item 3072 or item 3153

item 3035 or item 3072 ( item 3153 ) first?

muh diversity broh

TurquoiseYoshiSep 17, 20151 votes

Well that one depends. Statikk is for extra burst + waveclear + magic damage. It also has a nicer early build path. PD is for pure stats, and is built late in favor of Statikk.

yukonlSep 16, 20151 votes

Uh they specifically changed it for the upcoming release of Kindred. And also every game where the enemy team has a Sated Devourer Vayne is a free win for my team 9/10 times.

Silents429Sep 17, 20151 votes

Riot is nerfing sated devour because apparently Vayne is too op with it. They are changing it to proc on every forth attack for range champs. Well what about kayle who was buffed for the sole purpose of using it? What about the other range champs like ap varus who really benefited from the quick stacking of his W. On top of that, the new champ seems to proc it on every other attack for some reason.

What about them? Kayle is the only ranged champion they want using it, and it isn't being nerfed just because of Vayne, the item is absolute hell to deal with on a lot of junglers.

The only build paths that are suffering are for marksmen and they already have an overhaul for those items in the works.

Slamurai JackSep 17, 20151 votes

Runeglaive Kayle is honestly better than Sated Kayle most games anyway. Sated takes way too long to farm when you're already weak early game and it honestly isn't that much stronger than Runeglaive as the game goes on.

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