And then the OTP suggests a completely placebo nerf that will do nothing to make his otp any less overpowered.
Can we stop with this? Talon and Wukong need nerfs and those nerfs might not even be enough.
Slythion5 votesare you talking about the challenger otp post about talon? Cuz those nerfs are meaningful and much better than Riot's planned nerfs
Rexxiee3 votesare you talking about the challenger otp post about talon? Cuz those nerfs are meaningful and much better than Riot's planned nerfs
You mean the guy that wants to nerf TIAMAT (LOL) and thus every bruiser in the game instead of his broken freelo?
Dont make me laugh, those OTPs are incredibly biased about anything that isnt their otp.
IceAYon2 votesTiamat was a suggestion.
If you read his post, he is stating the current nerfs Riot are doing is a joke and isn't going to change anything cause Talon can still clear waves easily with Tiamat.
You seem pretty biased.
Try checking what nerfs Riot want to place on Talon and think whether that would work.
Rexxiee1 votesTiamat was a suggestion.
If you read his post, he is stating the current nerfs Riot are doing is a joke and isn't going to change anything cause Talon can still clear waves easily with Tiamat.
You seem pretty biased.
Try checking what nerfs Riot want to place on Talon and think whether that would work.
The problem isnt that he can clear waves with tiamat, everyone can thats the whole point of the item existing.
The thing is tiamat is not as strong in terms of combat stats to items like jaurim fist, phage, caulfield hammer and serrated dirk (all around its price/cheaper), the item gives up combat power for the pushing power, which is fine.
What isnt fine is talon having so much damage on his kit that he doesnt even need to rush dirk to start 100-0ing ppl and can do that with 2 long swords or tiamat, the nerf on pbe nerfs both his damage and waveclear, nothing wrong with that, in fact its good because removing his base damage means he has to go dirk first to actually kill ppl forcing him out of the tiamat.
And this is why the OTP is wrong and shouldnt be taken seriously as he suggests other minor nerfs, talon needs a hit on either his base damage OR mobility, and of course he suggests neither of this (oh nerf his Q range LMAO, as if it matter when the champ can literally ignore walls), suggesting a tiamat nerf really was the funniest shit considering talon is the only assassin in the game that can rush it and still have damage to 100-0 ppl, but yeah lets nerf the item and not the elephant in the room lmao.
IceAYon2 votesThey didn't nerf his dmg. only his later W dmg. his lvl 1 W dmg remains same and he doesn't need that 10(level 1 W) to 20(level 2 W) extra dmg to kill someone 100-0. He can get Tiamat and get the minion advantage. Tiamat is there for him to clear the wave in one sweep and avoid lane interaction.
He states that the current Q range doesn't involve much counterplay and it is big enough that you won't be needing E. Guess you are fine with that.
IP Masquerena1 votesNot like Rengar exists, who doesn't even complete his jungle item until later in the game.
Let's not forget that many in the community don't even know how to balance.
Recall Irelia's nerfs? When they were announced, people went on crying how they aren't enough, and how she shouldn't even get the compensation buffs on other parts of her kit she got, and how she's still gonna be the best champ in the game and the nerfs are, as you called the suggested nerfs from that player, placebo.
What did the nerfs end up doing? Irelia got gutted, by the nerfs players said aren't enough.
You disregard OTP suggestions because of "bias", but you also need to keep in mind that a main who suggests nerfs also understands that champion better than a random who played the champ 2-3 games, and the OTP also wants the champion to be playable, not gutted. Talon's nerfs from PBE are ok, but just that, it doesn't do much, exactly as the guy said. It reduces Talon's power if he doesn't buy Tiamat, but if he does, then nothing happens.
You need to consider how a nerf will impact more than just a champion's kit. Let's look at Taliyah's nerfs, 2 sec on her Q early. People cried that mid lane Taliyah is hurt more than jungle, while it's so untrue. 2 sec more after each cast, depending on a leash and elo (lower elos give worse leashes, seen Garen's not want to tank blue because "it would harm their lane"), she needs around 4-5 Q's to clear Blue, Gromp and Scuttler. That would be 8-10 seconds extra time, doesn't sound much, but that means she takes extra damage from the camps early, can be invaded easier, has both worse ganks due to her extra time in the jungle and lower health due to taking longer to kill camps.
A small nerf can have a huge impact outside of the kit, so don't just disregard the nerfs an OTP suggests as placebo nerfs, as they could have a huge impact when one sits down and analyses the situation in all aspects.
ankoanko191 votesYou mean the guy that wants to nerf TIAMAT (LOL) and thus every bruiser in the game instead of his broken freelo?
Dont make me laugh, those OTPs are incredibly biased about anything that isnt their otp.
Bruisers are fucking broken anyway, so yeah tiamat might need a nerf.
CppL2 votesWhy they wanna nerf his wave clear? talon problem in my opinion is lvl 2 all in ,wich has almost no counterplay.
IceAYon1 votesDoes nerfing Q range sound like anything to you or nerfing W dmg is better?
CppL1 votesNerfing his Q range into prebug fixed state would be good.And lets not forget that base magic resist buff he get for no fucking reason at all.These two changes made him almost unkillable for mages.
IceAYon1 votesGuess what? The guy who made this post thinks that the nerfs that the OTP suggested(nerf Q range and magic resist) are placebo and the OTP is trying to not make Talon less overpowered.
SithesisLord2 votesPretty sure plenty of Irelia mains, even ICU said that what Rickless did to Irelia was the wrong way to nerf her.
Unsurprisingly, they were right. She is a troll pick in top lane and bullshit pick in mid lane still, when it was supposed to being her up in power for top lane and massively weaker her in mid, rather than gut her across the board.
Pretty sure a lot of Camille mains said that the E nerf wouldn´t benefit Q max, and they were right, because E-max Camille isn´t a thing because of the damage, but because of the AS and CD, which weren´t nerfed. Sure, losing 50 damage on max rank E lowered her winrate, but it was still not the problem.
One heavy nerf to something is effective, sure. But one small nerf on what is actually the problem? At least twice as effective. At least.
Wukong 0ne Trick1 votesThe thing with the Wukong nerfs is that they are bad. Reverting the Q buffs would have been a better idea. Wukong depends on his E for trading. clearing the jungle, and clearing waves.
He is already a feast or famine champion that relies 100% on his AD ratios to be relevant. You cant make a champ 100% reliant on getting expensive items, yet make his already terrible lane phase worse by reducing his trading potential, and his ability to clear waves and jungle camps. Yes, Wukong does too much damage but nerfing his E isn't going to make it better, its just makes playing Wukong an even crappier experience than it already is.
Solidair31 votesChampion mains often have a better idea of what is appropriately strong and what is inappropriately strong, because they have a good idea of their champion's strength/weakness profile.
A lot of the changes that talon main suggested are good ones. lowering his MR, lowering the range on his Q are both meaningful changes.
Wukong is a whole other story as he is a champion played like an assassin with a bruiser's kit. Frankly, Riot needs to lower his damage but make him harder to kill. What he REALLY needs is a rework, but that isn't a quick fix at all, so we have to deal with what they give us. Wukong should be going in, causing some chaos, then either scoring some kills or getting killed himself.